Nanopulser ???

Topic: Nanopulser ??? (Read 1756 times) previous topic - next topic

Nanopulser ???

April 27, 2011, 12:42:49 pm

Anyone have suggestions as to whether or not a Nanopulser would be a good thing for my house batteries?

I never heard of a Nanopulser until it appeared on a thread about keeping finicky batteries alive and well. No AGMs in my FT, but the gell cells are getting old, and an $80 investment might be a good idea if it helps keep my house batteries usable for a few more years.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #1 – April 27, 2011, 12:49:41 pm

I think I'm gonna have to do some research on this topic. Do gel cell batteries sulfate? I'm asking as I begin to google.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #2 – April 27, 2011, 01:02:28 pm

I have a BatteryMINDer connected to my chassis batteries. I use it to keep the batteries from discharging while the coach is parked or stored and connected to shore power. Works great. This BatteryMINDer also claims to sweep the battery with high frequency pulses in the same way as a Nanopulser. I do not know if it does any good, but the batteries have been as strong as ever since I installed the device.

I ask about the Nanopulser because it might be a good idea for my 8D gell house batteries. On the other hand, another BatteryMINDer would be cheaper and might do the same thing (if it can handle the load of 3 8Ds in parallel)

By the way, a bit of history. When I purchased the (then five year old) coach, the chassis batteries only worked to start the engine unaided by the boost switch if less than a day had elapsed since driving the coach. I discovered one of the three paralleled chassis batteries had a shorted cell. I replaced just that one battery with an Optima blue-top I had on hand, and all have worked very nicely for the past three years. It just might be that the conditioning pulses have breathed new life into the original two batteries.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #3 – April 27, 2011, 01:39:05 pm

I think GEL batteries do not tend to sulfate as easily as wet cell.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #4 – April 27, 2011, 02:39:31 pm

I believe it is correct that gel cell batteries do not sulfate as quickly as wet cell or AGM batteries...but this is anecdotal on my part. The number of increased number of cycles that a gel cell has over AGM or wet cell would indicate to me that the sulfation is less on gel cell. And, since sulfation is the primary reason for shortened battery life, therefore my belief that gel cells are superior for house battery applications.

All this said, the use of a nanopulsing device could improve the life and performance of gel cell batteries. This type of charger could improve the performance of the AGM & wet cell batteries as well.

Check these other devices as well:
Pulse Tech Smart Battery Chargers

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #5 – April 27, 2011, 02:59:23 pm

It has been my understanding and practice to "Equalize" Lead Acid Batteries every few months. THis is done by raising the voltage to a much higher level for a time, on a 12 volt battery, raise voltage to about 15-16 volts for half hour. This is done to reduce the sulfation buildup.
This would work on the Flooded Cell and the AGM type. However there are warnings about "DO NOT GO ABOVE 14.2 VDC on the Gel cell type. DO NOT equalize Gel Cell Batteries.
I am not amazed to see a gadget that claims miracles, but I do not feel there is one magic fixed cure for all batteries.
As usual FWIW

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #6 – April 27, 2011, 03:00:32 pm

That is what is so great about the Progressive Dynamics Converter/Charger for those of us with older coaches and older technology converter/chargers. The PD 9100 and 9200 for wet cells and gel cells is similiar to a smart charger and has a "Charge Wizard ". "The Charge Wizard is a patented microprocessor-controlled circuit built into all the PD9200 Series converters. The Charge Wizard constantly monitors the RV battery voltage and then selects one of three charging voltages and one of four operating modes to properly re-charge or maintain the RV battery. The addition of the Charge Wizard makes all our 9200 Series converters an intelligent battery charger. It will safely and rapidly recharge a discharged battery by automatically selecting the Boost Mode (14.4V) to rapidly re-charge the battery to 90% of full charge. Once the battery reaches 90%, the Charge Wizard automatically selects the Normal Mode (13.6V) to safely complete the charge. The Storage Mode (13.2V) is automatically selected after 30 hours of non-use of the 12-volt RV electrical systems. The lower charging voltage in the Storage Mode of of operation reduces battery gassing and water usage, while maintaining the charge. Every 21 hours when the system is operating in the Storage Mode, the Charge Wizard will automatically switch to the Desulfation Mode of operation. The Desulfation Mode increases the charging voltage up to 14.4 volts for 15 minutes. This increased voltage mixes up the battery electrolyte and prevents battery stratification and the resulting problems of battery sulfation."

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #7 – April 27, 2011, 04:52:46 pm

I read the Nanopulser FAQ at :: NANOPULSER.COM.SG ::

I think it is worth taking a chance, it might help me get a few more years out of my original-equipment gel cell 8D batteries.

Nanopulser

Reply #8 – April 28, 2011, 02:30:20 pm

I went ahead and placed my order. $85 with shipping here:

Nanopulser - Battery Conditioner

Even it it gives me another year on a set of three 8D batteries, I feel it is money well spent.

I plan to let the coach sit 24 hours after turning off the converter/charger with the vent fan and some lights on, trying for a constant 10A draw from the house battery (I'll measure the current draw with a clamp-on ammeter), then measure the voltage at the battery terminals. Then with the nanopulser installed for a week, rerun the test. I'll report back with the results. I'm hoping for a slight increase of battery voltage. If the results look good, I'll rerun the test a few weeks later.

By the way, this review helped me decide:

http://www.fourwinds-ii.com/v2/library/genetech_nanopulser_recommend.pdf

Re: Nanopulser

Reply #9 – April 28, 2011, 03:30:43 pm

Best price I could find, too!

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #10 – April 28, 2011, 04:01:12 pm

Tom,
Does this device need a 120 VAC source to work?

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #11 – April 28, 2011, 04:15:55 pm

No - it draws 12V, 40 milliamps from the battery and returns a high frequency signal to it.
It SLOWLY conditions a battery/bank (ex: 1000 amp-hour bank, 4-6 weeks).

Since my coach sits in storage most of the time on a solar trickle charge, I can condition my two 8Ds in 2-3 weeks.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #12 – April 28, 2011, 04:21:49 pm

I believe the general term for these devices is "Battery Desulfator". They came about for people who live off the grid and rely on solar power and as such have a difficult time generating the power required for equalization once a month. I became interested in them a couple years ago and decided to build my own from one of the online schematics I had found. I had it running in the garage for months but in the end I wasn't successful and unable to measure any significant change in the battery I was working with. The most difficult thing was that it was very hard to tell if the circuit was working the way it was supposed to - I imagine an oscilloscope would might help but I'm actually a mechanical engineer. I could have made any number of mistakes along the way or the battery could have been just too far gone. I think the general concept is good but there is very little scientific information on the details of what it takes make the desulfacation process significant and effective. As they say "the devil is in the details" and there are many, many variables. Here are a couple of sites that I had found for those interest in reading more technical details:
Battery Desulfator
Lead Acid Battery Desulfator
I did my testing in the garage with a RS3000 inverter-charger. I used a fixed 120VAC load along with a 120VAC timer to tell me how long the battery lasted before the inverter shut down on a low voltage error. I believe the load was about 1/10th of the amp-hour rating of the battery. Maybe as soon as they get some of the science down desulfators will be standard equipment built into the inverter-chargers. I hope the Nanopulser works with measurable effects for those who are trying them.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #13 – April 28, 2011, 04:30:53 pm

Hopefully I'll have some measurable results in a couple of weeks. I no longer have an o'scope, but feel the proof of this puddin' is in the voltage measurements.

I intend to turn the boost switch on so it might also help the chassis batteries, but I suspect the high frequency pulses won't make it all the way to the back of the coach.

I feel it is best to have the device physically close to the batteries, so one built into the inverter might not be as useful as one wired directly at the battery terminals.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #14 – April 28, 2011, 05:32:49 pm

After we bought our 1999 u295 last year and started to use it, the house batteries were very poor. They are gel batteries with no date on them. 2 or 3 hours with the tv and a couple of lights on and the bank would be under 12 volts. On ebay I bought a battery tech desulfator for under $40.00 . I hooked it up on one of the batteries, and moved it to another one every two weeks. In the first two weeks I started to see an improvemen, after 6 weeks the batteries are great. I bought another for our little jeep in Panama. Joe

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #15 – April 28, 2011, 06:00:12 pm

Curious; I know "zip" about the Nanopulser, (first heard about it through this thread) but if it were hooked to any single house-battery, would it not be connected to all of them? We have three 8D's, connected in parallel. If it's physically connected (not just "parked" on top of the battery) it seems you'd be connecting to all? What I've read (not much) on the device, seems to specifically suggest it for "lead-acid" batteries; I didn't see Gels or AGM listed, nor did I know they were also subject to sulfation? (Lots to learn - obviously.)

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #16 – April 28, 2011, 06:14:22 pm

The second link I posted on Reply #8 of this thread offers evidence that it helps gel cell batteries. The manufacturer says it works on all lead-acid battery types: flooded, AGM, and gel; and also says it works on paralleled battteries. I suspect the batteries all need to be in close proximity, which is why I don't expect much help for the chassis batteries.

But I already have a BatteryMINDer connected to my chassis batteries to keep them from discharging, and the BatteryMINDer claims to have a desulfator circuit built-in (and testamonials on their website appear to support their claim).

Foor what it's worth, as I mentioned in the first post, the Battery MINDer just might be the reason the two original Optimas still work after I replaced the dead third one almost three years ago. Who knows???

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #17 – April 28, 2011, 10:06:27 pm

I found a number of other "pulse technology" products with Google and on eBay, some as low as $45.99. I will be very interested in the outcome of practical tests to be run. I certainly agree that it would be a small investment if one would extend the life of our house or starting batteries.

Tom, thanks in advance for your efforts.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #18 – April 29, 2011, 08:17:04 am

In my studies of Pulse Technology, I ran across the following item on what looks like a very good web site with exceptional pricing.

BatteryMINDer 12 Volt - 1.33 Amp: Charger-Maintainer-Conditioner (Desulphator)

I would appreciate an evaluation of the BatteryMinder product by our very knowledgeable Forum members.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #19 – April 29, 2011, 10:12:13 am

It is interesting that this site offers the same BatteryMINDer specifically adjusted for AGM batteries. The price is much closer to list price. It makes me wonder if that "special adjustment" is necessary or just a sales gimmick.

12 Volt 1 Amp BatteryMINDer PLUS AGM

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #20 – April 29, 2011, 10:49:35 am

The unit listed for $39.99 on RV Upgrades.com is listed as also compatible with AGM/Gel batteries - according to their spec-sheet: "The 12 Volt - 1.33 Amp BatteryMINDer allows you to charge up to 5 batteries (parallel or series connected) at a time. The batteries must be the same type (starter, deep cycle, sealed gel, AGM, etc.)"
What I liked was the ability to connect to up to I believe five batteries - in parallel - provided the condition (health) of the batteries is the same.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #21 – April 29, 2011, 11:43:42 am

Quote from: Monti – April 29, 2011, 10:12:13 am

It is interesting that this site offers the same BatteryMINDer specifically adjusted for AGM batteries. The price is much closer to list price. It makes me wonder if that "special adjustment" is necessary or just a sales gimmick.

12 Volt 1 Amp BatteryMINDer PLUS AGM

After a lengthy discussion with Battery Minder Plus customer support, They said the AGM model 12448 is for AGM's & has a higher charging voltage.
The model 12117 will work on any battery but not as good if you have AGM's.
If you have multiple batteries you need the model 12248 8 amp.

That said: since we have chargers built into our coaches these items will have NO value in our application.
12 Volt 1.33 Amp Charger-Maintainer-Conditioner (Desulfator)
It is basically a battery maintainer for parasitic loads.

Camping/RV Battery Chargers | Battery Chargers by BatteryMINDers.com

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #22 – April 29, 2011, 05:47:06 pm

That BatteryMINDer is the one I have on my chassis batteries, plugged into the block heater outlet under the bed. It does a great job of keeping the three Optima AGM chassis batteries charged when the coach sits. I remember checking the float voltage level after I installed it, and the voltage was within Optima specs.

I have no real information on how good it is as a desulfator, however... before installing the device, I had to replace one of the three batteries due to a shorted cell. Today that replacement battery along with the two original (now 8 year old) batteries appear to be perfectly healthy.

But I bought the BatteryMINDer to keep the chassis batteries from self-discharging. I bought the Nanopulser for a different reason, to keep the house batteries healthy for more years of useful service life.

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #23 – April 29, 2011, 07:40:51 pm

The Amptronix battery desulfator looks very interesting as an accessory for the house batteries and chassis batteries. It appears to operate when a charger brings the voltage about 12.8 volts, and goes to sleep at low voltages. It would be a very simple hookup and. It would be suitable for an application where you have charging systems, but not any kind of pulser.

Amptronix Battery Desulfator / Refresher

Re: Nanopulser ???

Reply #24 – April 29, 2011, 08:25:11 pm

For me, I feel this is more "Snake Oil" hype than what is best for your battery, These gadgets have been around for atleast 10 years, and trying to make a comeback. Battery folks have learned years ago about the "Hype";.
If real interested, check out the following EastPenn Manual on Gel & AGM Do;s & Do Not's.
East Penn makes many batteries, by many names including MK & Deka for example.
It is long, but most interesting. Enjoy.

www.dekabatteries.com/assets/base/0139.pdf

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