engine compartment insulation revisited

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engine compartment insulation revisited

March 27, 2011, 10:36:42 pm

What did you use for the insulation?

Previous Threads
Engine Compartment insulation

Engine, generator insulation solution?

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #1 – March 27, 2011, 10:44:02 pm

Pat, I used some stuff from JC Whitney called Insulation Roll with Foil Backing. When I was researching it I came across the same product from a number of sources. Whitney had the best price at $110 per roll (way more than you need for the engine). I also did the area under the hood and I'm thinking about pulling the generator and doing that too. I'm investigating a noise and will probably have to take it out anyhow so that would be a good time to do it.
jor

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[IMG width=800]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/InsulationinhoodareaFeb2011-4.jpg[/img]

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #2 – March 28, 2011, 09:25:31 am

John, I am shocked at the before and after photos. I never would have thought about the old insulation clogging the CAC. The insulation in my 225 is still in good shape. However, that is such a slick job I would like to invite you down to Oklahoma to do the same to both my U-225 and U-300. I'll provide both the coffee and donuts as well as a hookup for your coach. You did say you had plenty of the foil roll left over didn't you and your coach knows its way here.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #3 – March 28, 2011, 10:05:21 am

Quote

I would like to invite you down to Oklahoma to do the same to both my U-225 and U-300

Hehe... I'm thinking once is enough! It's kind of funny I ended up with this rig. Two of my must-haves when we were looking for a Foretravel were: 1. Cat engine; and 2. SIDE RADIATOR! Best laid plans!!!
jor

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #4 – March 28, 2011, 10:18:09 am

Kent,
Don't you have a regional dish that is more of an inducement than donuts?

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #5 – March 28, 2011, 10:46:00 am

Quote from: George Stoltz – March 28, 2011, 10:18:09 am

Kent,
Don't you have a regional dish that is more of an inducement than donuts?

George, are you talking about Calf Fries?

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #6 – March 28, 2011, 11:14:15 am

Quote from: Kent Speers – March 28, 2011, 10:46:00 am

Quote from: George Stoltz – March 28, 2011, 10:18:09 am
Don't you have a regional dish that is more of an inducement than donuts?

George, are you talking about Calf Fries?

Chili cheese Tots and a Route 44 cherry limeade....

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #7 – March 30, 2011, 08:28:50 am

Quote

Whitney had the best price at $110 per roll (way more than you need for the engine). I also did the area under the hood and I'm thinking about pulling the generator and doing that too.

Jor,
I'm in the process of removing the deteriorating insulation on my 2000 u320 gen, which is in a quiet box, and wanted to know a little about the product you purchased.

Is it foil both sides?
Approximate thickness?
Quality?

I emailed Power Tech and they sell a Soundcoat product that comes in a sheet 76" X 57" by 1/2" thick for $160 and they told me I need two sheets. I like your $110 per roll instead of $320.

Thanks,

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #8 – March 30, 2011, 11:50:49 am

Brad,
It's about 1/2" thick with foil on one side and good quality. My factory insulation was absolutely shot. The slightest touch would cause a cascade of fine dust to rain down on my head. And, of course, with the darn pita rear radiator, that was a frequent experience. Anyhow, the product number for the stuff I got was 268585 but they don't seem to stock it now. They now have something they describe as MYLAR®-FACED FOAM SOUND/HEAT INSULATION WITH VINYL LINING (#20386G) which looks like it's better stuff. I was just looking in my LMC (lmctruck.com) catalog and I think they are selling the product I got from Whitney. Their number is 38-2829.

My original insulation was so bad I didn't even bother to remove it. I just cut the new stuff to size and screwed it right over the old stuff, using large flat washers. There are a lot of different products out there. Good luck. Post photos.
jor

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[IMG width=800]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/insulation-1.jpg[/img]
[IMG width=800]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/insulation-2.jpg[/img]
[IMG width=800]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/insulation-3.jpg[/img]

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #9 – March 30, 2011, 11:57:12 am

Jor,
This sounds like a great product. I know that under the bed there is a thick piece of plywood to hold screws. What is on the sides?

Also, if and when you do your generator box would you take a few photos? Please include the before as well as the after. My foam is beginning to disintegrate.

Thanks. And you did a really professional looking installation.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #10 – March 30, 2011, 12:00:39 pm

Wood on the sides too, George. Of course, it's a 93 so I guess it could be different than the later models. I'll be sure and take photos.
jor

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #11 – March 30, 2011, 12:39:35 pm

Quote

They now have something they describe as MYLAR®-FACED FOAM SOUND/HEAT INSULATION WITH VINYL LINING (#20386G) which looks like it's better stuff.

Jor,
It looks like it will melt at 200 degrees, so I might try the LMC product or some marine product.

Thanks,

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #12 – March 30, 2011, 12:53:54 pm

Heat/Sound Insulation - JCWhitney
Check the above link. It's meant for automotive use & should not melt.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #13 – March 30, 2011, 12:59:57 pm

Hi Brad,
I just called LMC and they have insulating mat materials that are pre-cut and shaped only for cars. Nothing available from them in rolls.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #14 – March 30, 2011, 01:00:54 pm

Hotrod insulation EZ Cool Automotive Insulation heat barrier and noise reduction for cars, trucks,

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #15 – April 27, 2011, 07:44:27 am

FWIW, I'd buy insulating materials based on specs not price. It's too tough a job to have to do again. I went with FT's product and paid the price.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #16 – May 01, 2011, 10:56:29 pm

Brett,

I need to do my engine compartment also and have spent a good portion of today researching acoustic foams. What product was Foretravel using? Was it Barymat BTMM-14C? How bad did it hit your pocket book? The materials I have been looking at will cost from $400 to $700 for the 50 square feet I need that meet FMVSS 302, a flame spread test.

E.A.R and Soundown make 1" thick foams but neither of them match Barymat's sound absorption. The Soundown product is more price friendly at $250 for enough material.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #17 – May 02, 2011, 09:17:10 pm

I've been pondering this also but concerned about heat resistance and flammability of replacement products. When I was working with the existing foam insulation I peeled off one of the remaining patches of black vinyl looking material, touched a match to it and Poof! Easily ignited and burns readily. I'd like to find a flexible metallic base product without any bulk insulation attached (guess I could peel it off a sheet of ductboard) and just recover the mass loaded foam insulation Fore installed. I doubt you'll get that level of sound deadening from any foam/felt/fiberglass based mtl.

Chuck

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #18 – May 02, 2011, 11:27:43 pm

Chuck,
While going through the test procedure for FMVSS 302 I found that they specifically mention the test must be performed on "whole" sheets. The foam has failed and therefore no longer has the flame retardant characteristics it had when new. Apparently many of the foam composites use a metalized mylar exterior to help meet ratings. When I installed my exhaust brake I felt that it was too close to the foam and added a racing type heat shield.

Re: Engine Insulation

Reply #19 – May 02, 2011, 11:46:37 pm

Quote from: John Cooper – May 02, 2011, 11:27:43 pm

Chuck,
While going through the test procedure for FMVSS 302 I found that they specifically mention the test must be performed on "whole" sheets. The foam has failed and therefore no longer has the flame retardant characteristics it had when new. Apparently many of the foam composites use a metalized mylar exterior to help meet ratings. When I installed my exhaust brake I felt that it was too close to the foam and added a racing type heat shield.

That sounds right, it can't normally be that flammable. Regarding turbo heat we managed to ignite the lead/foam/metalized exterior Soundown material in the engine room of one of my boats. Once lit it burned viciously with clouds of bright orange smoke and we were steppin lively. Took two fire extinguishers to put it down. Engine was covered with molten lead and I learned a valuable lesson about turbos. The metalized mylar stuff sure looks like repurposed reflective insulation, mylar base would give me pause.

engine compartment insulation revisited

Reply #20 – May 07, 2011, 11:22:00 pm

I am going to upgrade my engine and generator compartment insulation.
the film on the factory insulation is failing and peeling away. (98 295)
is there a product I can use to COVER the existing factory insulation,
or is it necessary to totally remove the old and replace?
I have seen the products others have used, I'm just wondering if there is
a product to COVER the original?
thanks wayne

Re: engine compartment insulation revisited

Reply #21 – May 08, 2011, 01:31:58 pm

Wayne,
The original insulation in my '91 is very heavy and becomes powdery as it fails. The insulation on vertical walls would just fall to the bottom and would take the new insulation with it depending on how you put it in. I am doing a bunch of research to find a good, inexpensive replacement but I haven't finished yet. I did measure the sound of an idling Cat 3208 with the engine cover opened and then closed with the current insulation. Open I got 87 db and closed I got 81 db, which seems to indicate that the failed insulation is not working. My insulation has failed the worse over the side mounted radiator and at the floor on that side I measured 90 db. All db measurement were taken with a Radio Shack digital sound level meter and were taken with a C weighting and fast measurement response.

Re: engine compartment insulation revisited

Reply #22 – May 10, 2011, 12:37:11 pm

Wayne, I am also considering putting a thin layer of tinned insulation over top of what there is around the engine. Unlike what John described, my insulation is dirty but intact. The black plastic covering has cracked and mostly fallen off, like a sunburn.

I will watch for more details from John.

Re: engine compartment insulation revisited

Reply #23 – May 11, 2011, 12:13:00 am

I posted awhile back when I did mine (93 225). In the engine compartment I installed the new insulation over the old. It's held in place with screws and fender washers just like the original. On the generator compartment I removed the old stuff as I was afraid to start drilling. I glued the new on just as the old was. There's a ton of products out there. Here's a photo of my engine and gen compartment.
jor

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[IMG]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/EngineComp-6.jpg[/img]
[IMG]http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m105/joroiga/compprepared.jpg[/img]

Re: engine compartment insulation revisited

Reply #24 – May 11, 2011, 07:55:16 am

That looks excellent. I have the same task ahead of me, but my insulation is crumbling so need to do a total makeover. Have tentatively settled on dynamat and dynaliner. Was thinking of fitting a piece of rigid insulation under the bed and covering that with dynamat but not sure about the heat aspects.

Steve

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