MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Topic: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install (Read 1704 times) previous topic - next topic

MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

June 26, 2011, 10:32:23 am

I have deleted my topic. MCD has admitted that they really botched our installation and the resolution agreed upon is entirely satisfactory to me.

I see no reason to "punish" them by leaving my post intact. All companies sometimes hire someone who can't do a job properly.

I will continue to endorse them as a provider of quality products.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #1 – June 26, 2011, 10:40:12 am

Thanks, George. You have indeed been vocal (with good reason) about how much you loved these shades. You and Sandy were among the reasons we headed to their parking lot, and we also dropped a nice piece of change. We have heard that because of their increased popularity, the prices are on the rise! Must be nice. We are talking about the cockpit shades for our coach ... but based on your experience, we would certainly go into their parking lot with new questions and some extra vigilance. Interesting to see how they remedy your situation. Stay well.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #2 – June 26, 2011, 10:45:32 am

Carol,

If you do go I would do the following:

Before the shades are installed examine the splices and pull on them firmly to make sure they don't separate.

I doubt that I will ever hear from MCD.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #3 – June 26, 2011, 10:56:18 am

George, from the pix you have in the opening comment, shows a lot about the quality of the people who installed the unit.
First, the blue butt connector is too large for the wire, the correct butt connector is the red one, secondly, they also used to wrong crimp tool, you NEVER use the spike crimp on stranded wire, only the crush type. In the world of electric control wiring, this shows total lack of QC or don't give a damm.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #4 – June 26, 2011, 11:01:53 am

Dave,

With your years of experience and solid knowledge I place a high value on your response. Thank you. When I did my own splicing I soldered the connections and then applied heat-shrink tubing. I did not have enough wire remaining to make an effective mechanical splice.

The tech at MCD who did our installation was supposed to be one of their more experienced installers. Glad we didn't get the new kid on the block.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #5 – June 26, 2011, 11:40:24 am

At least he didn't use yellow ones and vise grips to crimp...
We used to 'bless' these guys in the Navy as 'hammer mechanics'. We would cut half the circular end of a 8 inch crescent wrench and weld on a ball peen hammer head. It was then given as 'the only tool they would ever need'...

Here's a variation on the theme...

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #6 – June 26, 2011, 12:18:02 pm

There is a butt connector that is a heat shrink type that contains an adhesive. I have pull tested these and the wire fails before the connection. They are meant for marine use but are perfect for exposed locations or where a quality (read Foretravel) job is needed.

Here is a link to what I am talking about.:

Heat Shrink Connectors | Marinco

They are available from marine stores such as West Marine or Defender Industries.

Also the quality of the work in the picture is awful. When I was in the maintenance field I would have put a tech or mechanic that did a job like that on a final warning or worse. I now have a business where customer service is everything. Doing a good job of servicing your customers is not hard. It's when things go wrong that you have an opportunity to shine. Fix the problem and go beyond what the customer expects and he will probably sing your praises. Disappoint him and he will do what George is doing, and rightly so.

Keith

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #7 – June 26, 2011, 12:46:15 pm

We were so happy with the front shades in the '95 that we only did the other 8 windows in the rest of the coach at MCD ... and we went all manual. In the '02 we are looking at, While the day/night shades are in good shape and OK for now, the front, pull-across shades are not ... we have been talking about MCD for the cockpit. You can bet I will eagle-eye anything that needs wiring or remotes or whatever!

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #8 – June 26, 2011, 12:57:11 pm

Quote from: Carol Savournin – June 26, 2011, 12:46:15 pm

In the '02 we are looking at, While the day/night shades are in good shape and OK for now, the front, pull-across shades are not ... we have been talking about MCD for the cockpit. You can bet I will eagle-eye anything that needs wiring or remotes or whatever!

Carol,

Since you're already in Nac, I might suggest you talk to David Flanagan at FOT about the MCD blinds. He gave us excellent advice for our self-install and his remodeling team has done MCD installs on a number of coaches. If the uplift on the cost of the blinds and the shop rate/labor estimate are competitive, that would give you an alternative.

Michelle

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #9 – June 26, 2011, 01:33:09 pm

George;
I use these everywhere possible when replacing units or repairing splices on all my vehicles.
Reason; never have to go back in that area again because I did it, if not it will break again.

Requires two tools available @ Radio Shack, less that $30.00
I get all my Pins, sockets & holders @ " " in 3 different sizes @ Mouser.com

Wire-to-Wire Connectors

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #10 – June 26, 2011, 02:55:48 pm

Quote

At least he didn't use yellow ones and vise grips to crimp...
We used to 'bless' these guys in the Navy as 'hammer mechanics'. We would cut half the circular end of a 8 inch crescent wrench and weld on a ball peen hammer head. It was then given as 'the only tool they would ever need'...

Here's a variation on the theme...

Dave, All these years and I have been using fencing pliers when I could have had a real tool. Do you have a part number ? Or were these unique only to the nuke navy ?

Gary B

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #11 – June 26, 2011, 04:30:36 pm

Quote from: Steve & Michelle – June 26, 2011, 12:57:11 pm

Quote from: Carol Savournin – June 26, 2011, 12:46:15 pm
In the '02 we are looking at, While the day/night shades are in good shape and OK for now, the front, pull-across shades are not ... we have been talking about MCD for the cockpit. You can bet I will eagle-eye anything that needs wiring or remotes or whatever!

Carol,

Since you're already in Nac, I might suggest you talk to David Flanagan at FOT about the MCD blinds. He gave us excellent advice for our self-install and his remodeling team has done MCD installs on a number of coaches. If the uplift on the cost of the blinds and the shop rate/labor estimate are competitive, that would give you an alternative.

Michelle

We were chatting with the fellows at MOT, who advised us that the prices on MCD stuff seems to be creeping up due to the surge in popularity (for which we can all take a good bit if the credit, I think!!). They also said that MCD does a much faster install, because of their experience, and hence they are cheaper than MOT by fair amount. I will run in and see David tomorrow, and get his price. Thanks!

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #12 – June 26, 2011, 04:36:24 pm

Gary, This looks like what we use for our work, little costly for rarely used but they do the proper job of crimping, there are much more costly tools for crimping, but we do our work in the field not sitting at a work bench.
There are other crimp tools that are like near beer, they almost crimp, but not with the correct pressure or form. Sort of like using a Vise Grip, it crushes the barrel but is not near correct.
These are made by Klein, T&B, Greenlee etc.

Klein J1005 | Crimpers

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #13 – June 26, 2011, 04:49:40 pm

Quote from: Carol Savournin – June 26, 2011, 04:30:36 pm

We were chatting with the fellows at MOT, who advised us that the prices on MCD stuff seems to be creeping up due to the surge in popularity

Interesting. The retail pricing on MCD's website today for the base vinyl American Duo manual window shades is exactly the same as we paid in March 2009 (and the same as it was in the fall of 2007 when we first considered them). It's actually one of the things I admire about them - they've continued to improve the roller mechanism yet have held the prices constant for several years.

Perhaps it's the wholesale pricing or the cockpit/windshield shades that have crept up in price. Or people are choosing other than the base vinyl. There are a lot more fabric choices now and those will definitely drive the price up.

Michelle

Edited to add: We were able to do single, full width rolls across our windshield after Steve modified our TV cabinet back. In March 2009 we paid $795 for the American Duo day/night, switched electric (not remote), $60 for 2 DPDT (on)-off-(on) switches, plus tax for our windshield shades (base vinyl B 33 for the night shade). We did our own installation.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #14 – June 26, 2011, 05:07:19 pm

Quote from: George Stoltz – June 26, 2011, 10:32:23 am

This is an update to our disappointing experience with the installation of our MCD shades.

Final comment. I would understand had a motor burned out, but for simple butt splices to separate is sloppy workmanship in my opinion.

A photo of the shade assembly is included.

George,

You might consider e-mailing Dave and Carla Townsley at MCD and send them the photo and good analysis Dave M. has given here. Dave T. is/was the main customer-facing partner and pre-sales technical contact. If nothing else, to strongly suggest that "installer retraining" seems to be in order.

Perhaps an extension of your warranty would be an appropriate compensation for your inconvenience and expense.

Michelle

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #15 – June 26, 2011, 05:19:37 pm

Michelle,

When I called MCD I asked who I should send my letter to and I was given the name of the CEO. If the CEO is not interested in making any changes or getting back to a customer, then I am not interested in reaching below him to get the message across. As a former business owner, this CEO has his head in the sand.

I've always believed that having a problem to solve is an opportunity to satisfy a customer and all those to whom that customer might complain.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #16 – June 26, 2011, 07:50:29 pm

We used to 'bless' these guys in the Navy as 'hammer mechanics'. We would cut half the circular end of a 8 inch crescent wrench and weld on a ball peen hammer head. It was then given as 'the only tool they would ever need'

In The Air Force we called that a " NAF tool 1", NAF tool 2 was a hack saw

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #17 – June 27, 2011, 08:23:46 am

In the Marine Corp, if we couldn't fix it with bailing wire pliers, we just used C4.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #18 – June 27, 2011, 04:41:41 pm

Oh my goodness, George, I am so sorry you had this problem with your MCD windshield shades. Please believe me when I say this is not the norm. We install shades in 10-15 coaches per week and I haven't heard of this issue since I have been there (Since Feb. 2010).

We are excited that John Valencia has joined our staff as Chief Operating Officer. He just arrived in March so he is still getting his feet wet. He really does believe, like we all do, that we need to take care of our customers and answer their concerns. I'm glad you were able to talk to Charlie and that he was of assistance to you. I am not an electrician, so I, myself cannot address which connector should or shouldn't have been used, but I will be sure to forward your comments on to our installers and their supervisors.

Regarding the pricing of the MCD Shades, it is true that the prices have never increased. They are the same as they were in 2008, when the American Duo Shade System was first introduced.

George, please give John Valencia or Travis Townsley, who is the Senior RV Market Manager, a call to see what we can do to to address your shade installation issue.

The office number is 972-548-1850 (I'm actually at a rally right now and won't be back till July 5, but I will make them aware of your concerns.)

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #19 – June 27, 2011, 06:17:07 pm

Thank you, Peg.

I will call Mr. Valencia or Mr. Townsley in the next day or two and see what we can work out.

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #20 – June 29, 2011, 08:42:57 am

Quote from: George Stoltz – June 26, 2011, 10:32:23 am

Final comment. I would understand had a motor burned out, but for simple butt splices to separate is sloppy workmanship in my opinion.

A photo of the shade assembly is included.

I recently acquired an OTC No. 4497 professional crimping tool. It crimps to the correct tightness on the wire and makes FOUR crimps on butt connectors (instead of two). It is a quality tool, but requires some hand strength, particularly on red butt connectors (it handles red, blue and yellow terminals).

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #21 – June 29, 2011, 10:45:48 pm

Quote from: George Stoltz – June 26, 2011, 10:32:23 am

I have deleted my topic. MCD has admitted that they really botched our installation and the resolution agreed upon is entirely satisfactory to me.

I see no reason to "punish" them by leaving my post intact. All companies sometimes hire someone who can't do a job properly.

I will continue to endorse them as a provider of quality products.

At George's request I have deleted the photo in his original post which showed his concerns, since the issue has been resolved to his satisfaction. It's good to know that MCD responds to customer concerns, and that they have joined ForeForums as a result.

Should MCD wish to become a commercial member of this forum (which is a no-charge, no-compensation option) for the purpose of advertising specials to forum members, Peg or Travis (or any other MCD representative) are welcome to view the terms and conditions Vendor Forum & Posting Standards and send us PM or e-mail if there is interest.

Michelle and Steve

Re: MCD Shades: The quality of the product is not matched by a quality install

Reply #22 – July 01, 2011, 08:13:18 am

I am SO pleased to see that there was a quick and satisfactory response to George's issue. I am also terribly happy that the prices are holding steady! Cockpit shades are definitely in our future, although we have yet to work it in to our travel schedule. Our last experience at MCD was a really good one. I am glad to look forward to another.

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