Residential fridge

Topic: Residential fridge (Read 12644 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #50 – November 14, 2011, 07:14:59 pm

Yes, the inverter handles the fridge just fine, at least it does mine, and yes, as Brett says, you don't need to do the switching thing.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #51 – November 14, 2011, 07:21:06 pm

Thank you Brett, the manual for the Freedom 25 indicates the presence of the 'transfer switch' so will not be concerned about the need for manual switching. On a side note, your Sept 2011 FMCA article was extremely helpful in finding the defunct solenoid.
Your contributions are valued and appreciated.
Bill

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #52 – February 12, 2012, 12:02:37 pm

It's been a number of months since I bought the fridge... but it's finally installed. Finished.

The inverter was mounted below, where the central vac used to be. That took some time to put together. And as I wanted to add solar, and the power cables would run down the fridge bay, that wiring also had to be done first.

Some initial playing around showed the fridge drew 11 amps at 12 volts from the inverter when first started up. The clear plastic cover over the supplied lamp has been removed and replaced with the recommended LED lamp, making more space in there.

The shelf supporting the fridge was made from 3/4 plywood, with aluminum sheet bonded to it to protect it from moisture developing in the bay. There is a 2 1/2 inch air gap at the back of the shelf to provide airflow for the inverter. Opening the outside access door gives you access to the condensate catch pan in the back of the fridge.

A 3 inch L bracket was attached at the back of the fridge and a heavy screw was then used to attach the other end of the bracket through the shelf into the support frame. This anchored the lower rear of the fridge.

At the front I fitted styrofoam insulation top and bottom. A stick-on vinyl trim was fitted down the sides to seal the small gap there, and I fabricated two aluminum cover plates for the top and bottom. They were painted with a black textured paint to try to match the finish of the fridge. The top plate is secured to the wood above and sits just over the edge of the fridge. A neoprene foam gasket all around provides an air seal. Some screw and bolt covers hide the fasteners somewhat.

The lower hinge of the refrigerator door is secured to one of the front feet by means of a drilled an tapped steel plate, two shims, and two bolts. Both front feet of the fridge have holes drilled in them, which allows the doors to hinged from either side. The shims were replaced by the aluminum cover plate, and the shims were drilled and tapped to provide a means of fastening the trim plate to the other side. So both feet are attached to the trim plate, and the trim plate was then screwed to the front of the shelf. This anchored the lower front of the fridge. With the foam wedged in top and bottom, the fridge is now well secured.

Still need to fabricate an access panel/cover for the inverter, but otherwise it's a done deal. Finally.

Steve

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #53 – February 12, 2012, 12:45:26 pm

Look's a lot better than some factory job's I have seen.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #54 – February 12, 2012, 12:46:24 pm

Sweet! Complex series of upgrades giving the inverter install and all the solar prep... Looks to be well thought out and executed. Speaking of solar, giving the current draw of the fridge and misc other power draws on the house batteries, how much wattage worth of solar cells are needed to handle the load while boon docking without drawing the batteries down past the magic 50% level?
Don

Quote from: Merle Hench – February 12, 2012, 12:02:37 pm

It's been a number of months since I bought the fridge... but it's finally installed. Finished.

The inverter was mounted below, where the central vac used to be. That took some time to put together. And as I wanted to add solar, and the power cables would run down the fridge bay, that wiring also had to be done first.

Some initial playing around showed the fridge drew 11 amps at 12 volts from the inverter when first started up. The clear plastic cover over the supplied lamp has been removed and replaced with the recommended LED lamp, making more space in there.

The shelf supporting the fridge was made from 3/4 plywood, with aluminum sheet bonded to it to protect it from moisture developing in the bay. There is a 2 1/2 inch air gap at the back of the shelf to provide airflow for the inverter. Opening the outside access door gives you access to the condensate catch pan in the back of the fridge.

A 3 inch L bracket was attached at the back of the fridge and a heavy screw was then used to attach the other end of the bracket through the shelf into the support frame. This anchored the lower rear of the fridge.

At the front I fitted styrofoam insulation top and bottom. A stick-on vinyl trim was fitted down the sides to seal the small gap there, and I fabricated two aluminum cover plates for the top and bottom. They were painted with a black textured paint to try to match the finish of the fridge. The top plate is secured to the wood above and sits just over the edge of the fridge. A neoprene foam gasket all around provides an air seal. Some screw and bolt covers hide the fasteners somewhat.

The lower hinge of the refrigerator door is secured to one of the front feet by means of a drilled an tapped steel plate, two shims, and two bolts. Both front feet of the fridge have holes drilled in them, which allows the doors to hinged from either side. The shims were replaced by the aluminum cover plate, and the shims were drilled and tapped to provide a means of fastening the trim plate to the other side. So both feet are attached to the trim plate, and the trim plate was then screwed to the front of the shelf. This anchored the lower front of the fridge. With the foam wedged in top and bottom, the fridge is now well secured.

Still need to fabricate an access panel/cover for the inverter, but otherwise it's a done deal. Finally.

Steve

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #55 – February 13, 2012, 10:33:43 am

Thanks for the compliments. Much appreciated.

Don - that's a good question. I have no idea.

I've done numerous calculations on paper, but I've never done this before, so am not sure how much power I'll end up using. Too much at first, no doubt, as I'm so used to just having power at hand when I need it. Safe to say I'll be watching closely going in and developing new habits to reduce consumption. I am adding four 150 watt panels for a 600 watt setup (about all I can fit on the roof and still have access to stuff). Is it enough? Dunno. Much also depends on how much time I spend with the computer and music gear. The solar system should at least keep the fridge running and the batteries topped up. If they drop too far, the auto gen start module will start the gennie to recharge. No TVs, no icemaker, no washer/dryer, a percolator coffee pot, campfire cooking and other things will all help in reducing overall energy consumption.

Steve

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #56 – February 13, 2012, 11:34:56 am

Good answer!

I guess a lot depends on how much the refrigerator cycles on and off... Do you know what it draws while running after the compressor start up? What kind of computer do you use? I am kind of obsessed with the idea of getting off the grid as much as possible, even though we will have hook ups at 1000 Trails parks... Eventually when we find some acreage that feels right, I want to know enough about the subject to be able to be energy independent (other than diesel of course... But who knows. I wonder if anybody ever run a FT on Bio-Diesel?). Oh well, life is an experiment after all....

Don

Quote from: Merle Hench – February 13, 2012, 10:33:43 am

Thanks for the compliments. Much appreciated.

Don - that's a good question. I have no idea.

I've done numerous calculations on paper, but I've never done this before, so am not sure how much power I'll end up using. Too much at first, no doubt, as I'm so used to just having power at hand when I need it. Safe to say I'll be watching closely going in and developing new habits to reduce consumption. I am adding four 150 watt panels for a 600 watt setup (about all I can fit on the roof and still have access to stuff). Is it enough? Dunno. Much also depends on how much time I spend with the computer and music gear. The solar system should at least keep the fridge running and the batteries topped up. If they drop too far, the auto gen start module will start the gennie to recharge. No TVs, no icemaker, no washer/dryer, a percolator coffee pot, campfire cooking and other things will all help in reducing overall energy consumption.

Steve

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #57 – February 14, 2012, 12:35:07 am

There are several threads on using an electric fridge that cover electric cost and installation issues.

One is at Residential fridge There are others to be found using search.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #58 – February 14, 2012, 08:15:38 am

Quote from: acousticart – February 13, 2012, 11:34:56 am

Good answer! I guess a lot depends on how much the refrigerator cycles on and off... Do you know what it draws while running after the compressor start up? What kind of computer do you use? I am kind of obsessed with the idea of getting off the grid as much as possible, even though we will have hook ups at 1000 Trails parks... Eventually when we find some acreage that feels right, I want to know enough about the subject to be able to be energy independent (other than diesel of course... But who knows. I wonder if anybody ever run a FT on Bio-Diesel?). Oh well, life is an experiment after all....

Don

Hi Don,

The inverter remote showed the fridge drawing 11 amps at 12 volts after startup. I don't know if it makes a difference, but both the fridge and freezer were being chilled. My residential fridge runs the fridge/freezer sections independently - don't know if that's the case here, but imagine it is, as each section had it's own temp control.

I have a tower PC that's a number of years old. Was looking at laptops for a long time, but a big issue is finding one with a Firewire port (other than Macs). Most new laptops don't have one, or even a card slot or other means of adding one. Gotta have the firewire for my recording interface. I'm just going to put the tower pc into the coach for now. My Kill A Watt meter shows it drawing an average of 200 watts - fair bit more than a laptop, but not too bad. I will probably have to run the gennie when I want to operate the PC and all the rack gear for any length of time - depends on the batteries' state of charge and how sunny it is that day.

Have been intrigued by biodiesel, but have not dug into it very much as yet. I'm also very keen to get off the grid. Would like to find a piece of land with running water that would allow adding a water powered generator for free perpetual electricity.

Steve

Re: Residential fridge - Another install

Reply #59 – February 22, 2012, 05:52:19 pm

I recently replaced our 2-door Dometic fridge with the Whirlpool that Barry and Cindy, Rudy, Merle (Steve), Gayland, and several other Forum folks have used. What a difference in usable space!
Very quiet after I rebuilt the fan motor. Rear bearing of the fan had no felt behind the end of the motor shaft, and the shaft was vibrating against the back of the bearing. Stuffed some small felt pieces in, added some thin oil, and now it's very quiet. No problems boondocking with it (we're now in Borrego Springs, Ca, boondocking in the desert. Our solar panels keep it and our ice maker happy and top off the batteries during the day, and low battery drain from just the fridge inverter during the night.

Only a few things to add to the other reports:
1) I made a 2' x 2' dolly that would fit over our small auto floor jack, and we used that to lower the old fridge to the floor after we pulled it out, and lifted the new fridge into "pushing position" on the dolly.

2) I put a 2' x 2' 16 ga steel plate (from ACE) on the floor of the cavity - glued down with construction adhesive, and slid the new fridge directly onto it without any additional angles attached to the bottom of the fridge. Attached the fridge to the plate with screws at the back and from underneath at the front.

3) Anchored the top of the fridge by bonding two 3" x 1/8" x 9" pieces of aluminum to the top of the fridge with 3M VHB tape, and then screwed those aluminum pieces to a couple of 1/8" x 6" steel angles, which were then screwed to the inside of the roof vent opening (there's a steel collar on the inside of the opening.) (Sorry no pictures of this part as it was dark when I finished and needed to get it buttoned up.)

4) Sealed top and bottom wind gaps with 2" x 2" foam strips, and the edges in back with spray foam and tape. Still need to do sealing trim strips like Steve (Merle Hench).

5) The fridge sides bulge out beyond the 24" W dimension, so I had to cut out the opening more than originally planned, and reduce the amount of new insulation on the sides some. I had to remove about 1/2" from the right side of the original opening. Used a good jig saw to get close to the cut line, and a belt sander to clean it.

As others have reported, both the old fridge and the new one went out/in the door after I removed the screen door and the latch bolt. We got the new fridge from Lowes in Tucson, and they brought it in with no trouble.

Got a Xantrex PROwatt SW 600W true sine inverter just to handle the fridge, since we can then just turn off the main inverter with all its loads when we go out or go to bed. We can also plug the fridge into either inverter or non-inverter power in the back. Never hurts to have options...

I put a drain tube in the bottom of the defrost overflow in the back, since water seemed to take a long time to evaporate (and more so in cold weather!) and I didn't want it to be sloshing around and spilling when we are on the road.

Took another cut at a door lock for traveling, with three shelf pegs, a couple of neodymium disk magnets and a piece of hardwood. (Details in the next post.)

Re: Residential fridge - Another latch

Reply #60 – February 22, 2012, 06:07:46 pm

Here's a fridge door lock that I made for our new Whirlpool. Earthquake tested on a recent trip and works fine:

Materials:
- Three shelf support pegs; two cut down to fit on the inside edges of the doors and attached with small sheet metal screws , and one slotted to fit on the alternative hinge mount bolt.

- Several washers to space the center peg out.

- Three small super strong neodymium disk magnets to hold locking block on during earthquakes. (I got them in Quartzsite, I think, or maybe at a woodworking store.)

- Piece of cherry wood (other hardwoods could conceivably work also...)

- A spare cabinet knob (Decorating Department said it had to match.)

Process:
Cut, drill, slot, and attach pegs. Grumble about fact that doors were not even, and so pegs were not either. Carefully transfer hole positions to wood. Drill wood for pegs & knob, & counter-drill in back for magnet disks and press magnets in. Fiddle around with positioning the magnets. Sand and shape it to taste. Finish it as required. Attach teflon tape to back to avoid rubbing the wood. Take pictures. Paint pegs black someday.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #61 – March 14, 2012, 12:24:54 pm

Holy cow guys we removed the double door unit from our coach last night, I am not sure I want to do that again. I had to remove the front trim off the unit which was a total pain in the butt! What I was wondering has anyone replaced the double door unit with the new home frig and how did you trim it out. The new unit will be noticeably narrower.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #62 – March 14, 2012, 02:11:25 pm

I have a double door fridge that has to come out soon as we now have the narrower residential one sitting in the dining area to go in and I am going to make a storage/pantry to go on the right side(after changing swing of fridge doors.) I will post pics when I get it done but not on the top of list just yet
John

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #63 – March 14, 2012, 02:26:20 pm

John has a good idea for the pantry installation. I went to several hard wood suppliers in the area and found some excellent matching dark wood for a couple of interior projects. A table saw, router and a bit of work can make a nice OEM quality storage space.

Pierce

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #64 – March 14, 2012, 02:44:55 pm

I believe Rudy has done this on his 320... Maybe he has pics?

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #65 – June 17, 2012, 08:04:51 pm

We looked over the refrigerators at Lowe's today.

Anyone ever use a larger one than the 9.7 cu ft one?

best, paul

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #66 – June 17, 2012, 08:18:04 pm

Mark,

The Mobile RV Service friend of mine that did my residential install took a matching board that he cut to length and width and pocket screwed it to the top, bottom and side of the opening left by the new Whirlpool 9.7 cu-ft unit. He then slid the new refrigerator into place and secured it in position.

Everything fit flush and no surround trim pieces were needed.

He charged me $300 and Lowes charged me $359 plus tax.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #67 – June 17, 2012, 08:53:44 pm

I posted pictures on what I did to use that space as a pantry and it really is working great. It is a shame just to cover that space up and not use it. I can not find the link on the board to show you so maybe Steve or Michelle can post it on this message for me
John h

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #68 – June 17, 2012, 09:06:19 pm

Quote from: John Haygarth – June 17, 2012, 08:53:44 pm

I posted pictures on what I did to use that space as a pantry and it really is working great. It is a shame just to cover that space up and not use it. I can not find the link on the board to show you so maybe Steve or Michelle can post it on this message for me
John h

Took a few clicks... here it is

John Haygarth's fridge and pantry upgrade (What did you do to your coach today)

Michelle

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #69 – June 18, 2012, 01:05:47 pm

RE: from a last year posting from Steve & Michelle: "Now all we need to find are some folks who've replaced the larger NDR-1492 with a comparable-or-better capacity residential unit . . ."

We just saw a friend's 2-door propane fridge and was surprised at the loss of interior space from very thick freezer walls, Freon compressor in lower part of freezer & the space the ice maker takes up. And they reminded us that they have to defrost every couple of months.

We have had our Whirlpool electric SELF DEFROSTING fridge for over 15 months and it is still one of the best mods we have made. And our Blue Bell stays hard and we make ice in 8 hours and have not defrosted in 15 months.

The reason for this email is for someone to measure their 2-door fridge useable inside space to be compared to the Whirlpool inside usable space to determine how much space will be lost by switching to electric.

Whirlpool freezer: 13.5" deep x 19.5" wide x 15.5" high = 4080.38 cu in = 2.36 cu ft
Whirlpool refrigerator: 17" deep x 20.5" wide x 35" high = 12197.5 cu in = 7.06 cu ft
Fridge + freezer = 9.42 cu ft

The Whirlpool replaced a 7.3 measured cu ft propane fridge, so we gained 29% more capacity.
So maybe with all the unusable space inside the 2-door fridge and the 29% increase of the smaller electric, maybe the interior space will not be that much less.

One of the issues with larger electric refrigerators, is that most have a bottom fan-cooled condenser coil that is open to the room. There are not many electric refrigerators, like the Whirlpool that still have the open condenser coils mounted on the back of the fridge.

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #70 – June 18, 2012, 03:09:38 pm

Quote

The reason for this email is for someone to measure their 2-door fridge useable inside space to be compared to the Whirlpool inside usable space to determine how much space will be lost by switching to electric.

Whirlpool freezer: 13.5" deep x 19.5" wide x 15.5" high = 4080.38 cu in = 2.36 cu ft Whirlpool refrigerator: 17" deep x 20.5" wide x 35" high = 12197.5 cu in = 7.06 cu ft Fridge + freezer = 9.42 cu ft

The Whirlpool replaced a 7.3 measured cu ft propane fridge, so we gained 29% more capacity.

My 1492 measured 11.4 cf or so. Or 2cf more than the Whirlpool.

best, paul

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #71 – June 18, 2012, 06:36:38 pm

Quote

RE: from a last year posting from Steve & Michelle: "Now all we need to find are some folks who've replaced the larger NDR-1492 with a comparable-or-better capacity residential unit . . ."

I'm starting to think seriously about replacing our 1492 with a Whirlpool.

Before I bite the bullet I'm trying to get my arms around the various issues.

First, what is involved in removing a 1492 from where it is now to the isle in front of it?

I assume Step 1 is to turn off propane.

best, paul

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #72 – June 19, 2012, 08:47:00 am

Paul, the unit is heavy and awkward. Lots of screws to be removed on sides and rear. I turned the propane off at the tank on Glen's coach. Went to hardware and purchased a plug for the propane line. Snipped and capped the 12 volt lines and unplugged the icemaker. If your unit has the icemaker mechanism under the refer, you will need to measure and get a solid surface to slide the unit onto. After you get the unit out and stabilized, you can remove the doors, and anything else that is easy to remove. The grab handle coming into the coach that protrudes into the opening will need to be removed. ERnie- hope this helps

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #73 – June 19, 2012, 09:36:55 am

Ernie, Just for my future info, how do you remove the wooden grab handles at the door ? I can see no screws or plugs on my U280.
Thanks
Gary B

Re: Residential fridge

Reply #74 – June 19, 2012, 11:15:18 am

Gary- the ones I have seen have the little plugs. They are the same color and may be sanded smooth with some wood filler

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