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Starter Problem

While we were in Newfoundland in 2007 our motor home would not start. When you turned the key nothing happened. I called the Foretravel emergency help line and the man said to whack the starter with a hammer. I did this while my wife was holding the key in the start position and it started normally. This happened several more times so we had the starter sent out for rebuilding. I thought this solved the problem but it has reemerged. On our trip to Alaska this summer it happened twice but it did it a couple of other times too. This time I noticed that I had to strike the solenoid which is an integral part of the starter and is located on top of it. Striking the barrel of the starter did not work.
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Has anyone had this problem and how was it solved. We are at MOT now contemplating our next move.

Thanks in advance for any help. It is a 2001 (2000 model engine) Cummins ISC 350.

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #1 –
I had that issue so i jumped the solenoid to start it when I needed too. I had to replace it. IT was on my 99 270 and I replace the whole thing:starter and solenoid.

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #2 –
Nac has an old timer near the south end of town on the west side of South Street, who knows all about starter rebuilding.

Sounds like your solenoid was not replaced and has high resistance contacts. Solenoid is a replaceable item.

Hammering a solenoid makes sense as it has a movable electrical contact that gets pitted from high current and the hammer blow moves the contact to a new position.

Reman & new starters can be purchased and MOT can install them. Temporarily, you can get a bigger hammer or jump the two big terminals on the solenoid to bypass the solenoid

Starting problems can be traced to bad connections on components at start battery, start solenoid, neutral-safety relay, ignition switch, etc, as well as starter. But if you get results with hammer blow, it is probably just the starter.

We just took out our starter and found it to be a 41MT with a 12-tooth gear. Just ordered a new Delco Remy starter and will put it in when it arrives in a few days. I will then post the details.

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #3 –
Not sure about the starter on the larger cummins engines, but the heavy contacts inside the 6b cummins starter solenoid are wear items and are easily replaceable.  I expect the larger starters are the same.  That fixes the starter click or hesitation or needin a hammer bump issue. 

Chuck

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #4 –
Quote from: Rob & Di –
While we were in Newfoundland in 2007 our motor home would not start. When you turned the key nothing happened. I called the Foretravel emergency help line and the man said to whack the starter with a hammer. I did this while my wife was holding the key in the start position and it started normally. This happened several more times so we had the starter sent out for rebuilding. I thought this solved the problem but it has reemerged. On our trip to Alaska this summer it happened twice but it did it a couple of other times too. This time I noticed that I had to strike the solenoid which is an integral part of the starter and is located on top of it. Striking the barrel of the starter did not work.
.
Has anyone had this problem and how was it solved. We are at MOT now contemplating our next move.

Thanks in advance for any help. It is a 2001 (2000 model engine) Cummins ISC 350.

Rob,
 Not sure how your '01 is configured but if you are just turning the key "on" and nothing is lighting up then you should take a look at the ignition solonoid too. Others with a similar model year may be able to direct you to it's location on your coach.
Good luck,
Rick

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #5 –
Thanks to all of you. I was mostly worried about having the problem in one of the rare times that I am alone in the coach. I didn't think about jumping the contacts on the solenoid. The MOT guys found out that the 2000 ISC 350 engines have one of two different starters and ring gears. The cheaper one costs about $400 for a rebuild and new ones are no longer available. The other one costs about $500 for a rebuilt and $1400 for a new one. (These figures may be a bit off.)

As my wife is getting a knee replacement in a couple of weeks, we won't be using the coach for some time. I may try to get the solenoid/starter fixed by a shop in Houston where I have done business in the past. I don't feel as pressured now knowing that I can get it started by myself.

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #6 –
Replacing starters and alternators can be problematic as there are often unknown differences between coaches, like the ring-gears mentioned.

Removing your own parts and taking them to local rebuilder, if there is still one in your area, and having your own unit rebuilt eliminates any confusion.

In most cases replacing everything inside will be less expensive than buying new.

We even found it better to rebuild our couch and driver's chairs as replacements are often different is some dimension, which can cause problems.
 

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #7 –
Quote from: Barry & Cindy –
Replacing starters and alternators can be problematic as there are often unknown differences between coaches, like the ring-gears mentioned.

I agree 100%.  Not only that but I've found that often the "rebuilt" part that I exchange a core for exhibits far more wear/damage than the one I exchanged.  Lots of exchange parts are rebuilt to service limits, not new.  I think you are better off having your part rebuilt by a competent local shop.  Even better is if you do it yourself.  It takes about three minutes to disassemble a solenoid and check the contact points, and $20.00 to replace them with brand new. 

Chuck

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #8 –
I recall fondly during my working life doing a safety survey on a local starter, generator, alternator rebuild shop.  As I watched ,old cores were stripped down and parts segregated into large bins, after cleaning the parts in the bins went to the other end of the shop and the REBUILDERS then picked out the cleaned parts and built NEW units, after testing and labeling they went out the door.  They did have a 100% GAURANTEED RETURN POLICY.  Those return units were in a different color bin awaiting teardown.
It was a profitbale business that continues today. 
The lesson, be sure you know what rebuilt means.
Gary B

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #9 –
Like Gary I found when I was in the fleet world that most shops did not do a complete rebuild of starters and alternators etc.  They repaired them and cleaned them up.  A rebuild should replace wear parts as well as a complete diagnostic check.  Basically it should bring the unit back to "as new" operating condition.  This is why we rebuilt them ourselves.  Good luck finding someone who really does that!

Keith

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #10 –
Nacogdoches has an old-timer who rebuilds starters & alternators and we watched him do his magic. He also was a teacher by explaining what he was doing. We saw the new parts and cleaned parts for our starter. His shop was a mess, but it works for him as he knew where everything was.

I think these one-man shops are all over the country, but may be hard to find.

Re: Starter Problem

Reply #11 –
Quote from: Barry & Cindy –
Nacogdoches has an old-timer who rebuilds starters & alternators and we watched him do his magic. He also was a teacher by explaining what he was doing. We saw the new parts and cleaned parts for our starter. His shop was a mess, but it works for him as he knew where everything was.

I think these one-man shops are all over the country, but may be hard to find.

Barry, I have to agree that the one man old timer shops are disapearing, I retired 5 years from commercial laundry equipment repair and rebuilding, to this day I have people calling me to come and do repairs, because they cannot find people to repair it the first time and back up there work, it is sad to think that one day we will no longer be able the repair anything.