Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Topic: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap (Read 1229 times) previous topic - next topic

Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

October 13, 2013, 10:05:33 pm

My winter project is to paint, gelcoat or partially wrap my coach. Would it be better to gelcoat coach in the color I want, then stripe it, Paint it or wrap it. I'll be doing all the prep work, removing all exterior parts and sanding.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #1 – October 13, 2013, 10:09:30 pm

You are going to do all the hard work doing the removal and prep work. If it were me I would have a pro paint it.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #2 – October 13, 2013, 10:18:34 pm

I've got most the stripes off already. I've got all winter and a shop big enough to do it in, will be doing some custom mods to coach. I work next door to Chrome Shop Mafia (the Trick My Truck guys) So I'm gonna have a unique RV come next spring (hopefully)

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #3 – October 13, 2013, 10:22:06 pm

Quote from: Jeff and Victoria Moses – October 13, 2013, 10:18:34 pm

I work next door to Chrome Shop Mafia (the Trick My Truck guys)

Steve and I loved the original seasons of that show!

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #4 – October 13, 2013, 10:25:08 pm

This thread is worthless without photos, lots of them we all hope.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #5 – October 13, 2013, 10:31:12 pm

I will post before and after pics as the work gets done.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #6 – October 13, 2013, 10:35:25 pm

We all wish you luck and want you to know we all will want to see the transformation.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #7 – October 14, 2013, 12:02:09 am

I recently read that wraps are only good for a few years.

Gelcoat: your coach is already gelcoat (all white). You could refinish (wet-sand/sand and buff) to get the shine back but there will still be shadows from the old striping. Shadows will fade with time. Refinishing the gelcoat is a lot of work but there is the Polyglow (acrylic wipe-on finish) route that is much less work.

If you want to add color I think your only reasonable option is to paint. Applying gelcoat is usually done only on repairs as it is a major PITA. You can do a full body paint or just paint the areas where you want color. If the later you still then need to refinish the exposed gelcoat areas.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #8 – October 14, 2013, 12:06:58 am

Quote from: Jeff and Victoria Moses – October 13, 2013, 10:05:33 pm

My winter project is to paint, gelcoat or partially wrap my coach. Would it be better to gelcoat coach in the color I want, then stripe it, Paint it or wrap it. I'll be doing all the prep work, removing all exterior parts and sanding.

Is the coach used as a dry camp Rv? Versus always plugged in in an Rv park someplace?

I will be the other guy. I prefer the ability to take small bushes scraping the sides and not cringing.

Max guard 29 gel coat re apllied and maybe painted graphics would be my style

Still like the yacht idea cm fore built. Paint is hot. And tender. Too many years in ftx's and grand villas and unihomes. Drove them into places you would not believe because they could be used that way without damage.

Windows open up to 85 degrees and with light colored awnings out, air conditioning was not needed. Quiet. No gen. No campground. Just us.

Walk over to a painted Rv in the sun and touch the side. Then yours....

Bob

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #9 – October 14, 2013, 01:03:24 am

Quote from: Jeff and Victoria Moses – October 13, 2013, 10:18:34 pm

I've got most the stripes off already. I've got all winter and a shop big enough to do it in, will be doing some custom mods to coach. I work next door to Chrome Shop Mafia (the Trick My Truck guys) So I'm gonna have a unique RV come next spring (hopefully)

Jeff how did you take the vinyl stripes off, what process did you use?

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #10 – October 14, 2013, 01:07:53 am

"Gelcoat" it can be reapplied? I thought once the factory Gelcoat is gone, it is gone, no?
Roof on my GV is chalking, I get the white stuff run down on the sides, not much but still annoying, so instead of paint Gelcoat can be applied? I am thinking about getting roof painted but then again occasionally getting brushed by a tree would not be good on paint ... what to do?

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #11 – October 14, 2013, 06:41:03 pm

To remove stripes I used Vinyl Off($70 a gallon) and 3m stripe remover wheel. The problem I have is my coach before I bought it spent most of its life in Florida with no care taken to the outside finish. When I removed stripes, the old gelcoat had actually erroded away to the point where the stripes were is raised out above the old gelcoat. That's the reason for re-gelcoating. I know I have my work cut out for me but I love my old U300. Wouldn't get rid of it for nothing.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #12 – October 14, 2013, 08:45:26 pm

Thank you. I am very curious about the application of gelcoat; please keep us posted with progress and information.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #13 – October 14, 2013, 11:10:24 pm

Quote from: propman – October 14, 2013, 01:07:53 am

"Gelcoat" it can be reapplied? I thought once the factory Gelcoat is gone, it is gone, no?
Roof on my GV is chalking, I get the white stuff run down on the sides, not much but still annoying, so instead of paint Gelcoat can be applied? I am thinking about getting roof painted but then again occasionally getting brushed by a tree would not be good on paint ... what to do?

I've done some crack repairs on my roof and applied gelcoat over the fiberglass repair. Original gelcoat thickness on my roof is quite thick - maybe too thick - I read that excessive thickness can lead to cracking. If your roof is chalking you can just refinish it by sanding down the oxidized layer on top (there's probably plenty of thickness if it's like mine). Yes it's a lot of work and you need to maintain it (by polishing and sealing) to prevent future chalking. More work would be trying to apply a new layer of gelcoat on top - in fact it probably wont work because of the thickness and will crack. I've never heard of it being done. I have heard of replacing the gelcoat by grinding off the existing and then spraying new gelcoat. Spraying and curing gelcoat is difficult for multiple reasons. (But gelcoat works great for initial manufacturing in a mold, which is the real reasons our coaches have it)
It's much easier to apply paint (but still need to sand off the top layer of oxidized gelcoat) and have a nearly maintenance free roof. The paint will not oxidize nearly as fast as gelcoat.
Tree scraps? Seems rare. I don't know why you couldn't apply touch up paint.
I'm no expert at this. This what I've learned over the years. Maybe others have some counter advice?

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #14 – October 14, 2013, 11:50:13 pm

Thank you John.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #15 – October 15, 2013, 12:30:24 am

Quote from: JohnFitz – October 14, 2013, 11:10:24 pm

It's much easier to apply paint (but still need to sand off the top layer of oxidized gelcoat) and have a nearly maintenance free roof. The paint will not oxidize nearly as fast as gelcoat.
Tree scraps? Seems rare. I don't know why you couldn't apply touch up paint.
I'm no expert at this. This what I've learned over the years. Maybe others have some counter advice?

Difficult to touch up sikkens paint and clear coat.

Factory changed to max guard 29 gel coat around my year. My 16 year old coach was mildly polished out by Richard Bark before me (thank you) and is very shiny.

Old Foretravel gel coat not so much. I regularly look at tight pretty spots to put our coach into. Well worth the tiny invisible scratches IMO. Versus park in a parking lot?

I used to build show cars. Chrome and metal flake. It did not go so I chromed it.

Our coach is still as cm fore designed it. An Rv. Hooked up or gen on constantly and painted is what he fought.

I remembered walking him and carol white and don shipe through a new 1991 marquis 40' at dons suggestion after I had left Foretravel at an FMCA rally. Had forgotten this until now.

As usual he said little but he obviously saw the workmanship.

Lots of things in that coach are still not done.

Hung side walls, marine 12 volt panel, manual switching for power, multi cylinder jake that worked on cruise control, adjustable fan speeds hot water heating, jacuzzi bath tubs, dual pane penisula windows, power front drape, solid wood walls and cabinets. Multi fluorescent bulb kitchen ceiling light with a wood panel framing , higher ceiling, opera front living room windows with cabinet delete in the bedroom sides and living room sides, four speaker dash stereo where you were exactly in between the front and rear speakers, outside stereo speakers....

Or keep it an Rv IMO. Most would not think of driving a 40' in dry camp forest service small campgrounds but we do it a lot. Much prettier camping.

Most like the Rv lifestyle and enjoy meeting new people at the campgrounds.

We like real wood campfires under the trees and stars. Need an Rv for that.

I understand in the east this is not easy to find. Too many fences. New Mexico and west the fences become much less.

Used to sell occasional all white coaches brand new. Customers were going to use the coach.

Had one guy that had a turquoise mine in New Mexico that it took three days to get the coach up the reservation roads to finally park it. Gravity water fill. Bring gas in for the gen.

Picked a pail full of turquoise one afternoon with a rake.

Just my ramblings on choices. My understanding always was that the gel coat is very hard and can be re applied.

Even white paint is physically hotter to the touch versus white gelcoat.

Loved the old ftx's with the three piece center slide open windows for a nice breeze and the roman drop shades and Mylar window pull down mirrored blinds and later the insulated velvet draw drapes.

Or do you want a "bus". Different idea.

Bob

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #16 – October 15, 2013, 07:15:12 am

The gelcoat on my coach is very thick and scratches, small nicks, shadows, oxidized surface sanded right out. You might try an aggressive wet sanding before deciding to re gelcoat. Don't presume to know your skill level but for mere mortals re gelcoating an entire coach outside a mold and obtaining a factory finish would be a herculean task. While I also prefer the durability of gelcoat to paint, there's a reason coaches are painted nowdays and it's not just looks.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #17 – October 15, 2013, 01:09:08 pm

"gelcoat to paint, there's a reason coaches are painted nowdays and it's not just looks. " is it cost?

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #18 – October 15, 2013, 01:23:05 pm

It is extremely difficult to obtain a satisfactory finish on gelcoat when it is not used in a mold process. Spraying it is about the only option, and you would need a gelcoat specific gun to do it. You're talking gallons of gelcoat here, shot in small batches as it has to be catalyzed. I've had some luck on small areas using Duratec additive which also provides the airtight overlay necessary for gelcoat to cure but this leads to color match problems. At the end of it you would need to wet sand the entire coach to get a smooth surface as gelcoat, unless you are a master with it, will have a pebbly finish.

Paint, on the other hand is relatively easy and foolproof if you've done your prep well. It levels out easily, successive coats blend and bond, inexpensive for good quality PPG paint and is pretty simple to shoot a good quality basic job. To sum it up, spraying gelcoat can be done successfully for small repairs. If a whole coach I'd go for paint.

Now, on the other hand, if I needed to refinish my roof, I'd prep it well, tape it off and roll catalyzed gelcoat on it with a smooth roller. I've done many boat decks this way, every few years roll another coat on. It's not entirely smooth but neither are the other roof finish products. Yes it's true gelcoat too thick can crack but this is primarily a problem during the molding process. Given a good quality fiberglass layup underneath, thick gel won't have a tendency to crack during use unless it can flex too much. That is up to the qual of the mtl under it.

I'd sure try wet sanding with varying cuts of wet and dry to see if you can expose new gelcoat before doing either. Mine was perfect under the oxidized layer. The gelcoat on every FT I've looked has been very thick and high grade. I am entirely with you on retaining the gelcoat finish as it's far more durable than paint. Paint is purtier, though.

One more thing, and I'll quit editing this post. As long as you can't see through the gelcoat, and if your aim is to have the gelcoat shine, an easy solution is to use one of the acrylic floor coating products on it, i.e., Red Max Pro. After sanding out the biggest nicks I decided I really didn't want to have to do the periodic waxing and buffing, so gave it three coats of this mtl. It is similar effect to PolyGlo, but a major difference in cost. I'm very happy with the look, most people wipe on another coat every year. It's a pretty low effort, fabulous results deal. It's probably not for someone who's fanatical about exterior appearance, but had quite a few people comment on how good my glass looked for an old coach. It works.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #19 – October 15, 2013, 01:34:47 pm

Chuck,
Thank you very much.
Wet sending I can handle on my own or hire labor only. Although i was younger and more eager back then, I have done some wet sanding on a 69 Chevelle. So I understand a bit of wet sending I will not hurt it and be able to get rid of the chalking. And after that as long as it can be kept in covered parking most of the year, i should not see chalking for a long time?
If i can do this it be best to keep the gelcoat, for me, instead of paint.

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #20 – October 15, 2013, 01:42:14 pm

Quote from: Chuck Pearson – October 15, 2013, 01:23:05 pm

It is extremely difficult to obtain a satisfactory finish on gelcoat when it is not used in a mold process. Spraying it is about the only option, and you would need a gelcoat specific gun to do it.

Your coach has max guard 29 gel coat which according to Barry's site started in 1995. Much more durable from my personal experience.

After Richard rubbed my coach out when he owned it I noticed that after a recent heavy rain I still have no streaking on the coach.

And mine before Richard and Betty owned it was Arizona deserted enough to have large amounts of window seal creeping.

Bob

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #21 – October 15, 2013, 01:46:36 pm

Bob so 94 had a different quality gelcot ... they changed 95 you said. Still should be ok to wet sand a bit no?

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #22 – October 15, 2013, 02:48:05 pm

Great discussion here.

Caflashbob:
Is white gelcoat more heat reflective than the most heat reflective white paint?

I did not know that paint is hotter in the sun on a motorhome then gelcoat, I thought it depended mainly on colour and a little on how reflective the paint or gelcoat is. Darker paint or gelcoat will be dramatically hotter then white paint or gelcoat. Reflective white paint (or gelcoat) will be slightly (not dramatically) cooler in the sun then less reflective white paint (or gelcoat).

My coach is mainly the Foretravel OEM white (slightly pink hue) with painted maroon/gray/black stripes. At 85F, an infrared heat gun indicates 95F on white gelcoat, 155F on maroon paint and 165F on gray paint. I did not measure the black because it is along the bottom.

I can only imagine how hot coaches are which are painted black and wonder if anyone who has owned one for years is happy with how hot it becomes (maybe in Alaska).

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #23 – October 15, 2013, 04:01:43 pm

@Wyatt Was at Stewart & Stevenson once when a blacked out Prevost band touring bus pulled in. It had 5 air conditioners on it. Must of had a huge generator in it with lots of hours on it!

see ya
ken

Re: Paint, Gelcoat or Wrap

Reply #24 – October 15, 2013, 06:28:26 pm

Quote from: P. Wyatt Sabourin – October 15, 2013, 02:48:05 pm

Caflashbob:
Is white gelcoat more heat reflective than the most heat reflective white paint?

For years I would walk customers from my Foretravel lot after touching the white gel coated ftx body and go next door and touch the painted country coaches Bruce Lassiter had next door.

My remembrance was that white paint was made up of metal, titanium dioxide? While gel coat is epoxy white. No metal.

The experts here can correct my facts but any white motorhome I ever used for my heat gain demo was always way hotter than the ftx or grand villa.

There was a reason on top of the money why Foretravel used gel coat.

Plus the money was a big point I assume.

Foretravel made their own wall skins in house. Paint tends to delaminate the walls from the heat gain.

That's why beaver had free floating hung walls. Secured by the windows and top and bottom rails.

Side walls would grow 1/2 inch in lenght in the desert sun in summer.

Some of the old ftx's would have delam at the decal areas in the middle.

The body was engineered and glued for the gel coats heat input. Touch your graphics? Tell me how hot it gets....

Marquis had more sidewall layers for the heat gain from the sikkens paint.

According to Barry's site the 95 and up were the marine grade max guard 29. Supposedly the best.

Paint with caution. Regarding Foretravels cracking issues I have now heard of here I wonder if they were not helped by the paint jobs heating?

Coach was maybe not made to be painted then in a high heat and sun area.

They are made in Texas where its hot. Painted coaches with lighter interiors were made in the northern states. Less sun heat. You can get away with the paint easier I would think. Especially if the coaches shell has loose skins.

Newmar? Was on TV showing aluminum side wall framing and hung walls and dark paint.

Makes the side flat in the sun. Painted coaches the sidewalls in the sun normally were less straight than the shaded side. Look for yourselves. Used to be noticeable in laminated sidewalls. Maybe not so much anymore but all these things were selling points for me to sell ftx's and grand villas.

Never needed a/c up to the mid 80's plus outside temp. Lighter awnings helped greatly on the radiated heat gain. My dark cranberry I might change out.

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