Trailer Connector Miswired?

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Trailer Connector Miswired?

September 09, 2014, 05:10:45 pm

Hello all,

Our motorhome has the 6 way plug. I found out today that our brake lights aren't working. Apparently the foretravel only puts out 12v on the electric brake wire and not on the individual left and right turn wires. I think that's wrong and that both the turn wires should light on brake. Am I misinformed? I only have a 4 way harness running through the toad so I wouldn't be able to make use of the separate brake wire unless I go buy another diode. (I would have to connect the left and right brake lights together and hook to the brake signal which would cause both lights to light when either turn signal was activated). I wasn't able to follow the trailer wiring very far and it didn't look modified. Does it go all the way to the front? Any help/info is most appreciated.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #1 – September 09, 2014, 05:37:57 pm

You should be getting power to left and right brake pin when turn is selected and to both when you step on the brake. The electric brake pin is for activating the electric trailer brakes.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #2 – September 09, 2014, 05:40:34 pm

Right so it is miswired. Are they all miswired or just mine? I think I might go to NAPA, get a trailer converter box and fix it on the toad side for now.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #3 – September 09, 2014, 06:15:54 pm

More likely you have a failure of some sort. You need to get your wiring diagram out and trace it from the source to the pins. You are testing the voltage at the coach connector pins aren't you?

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #4 – September 09, 2014, 06:28:50 pm

Your Foretravel has individual amber rear turn signals. The connector is apparently wired so that the left and right turn signals go to the left and right turn signal pins, with the brake light signal going to the brake pin. It's likely that it was used with a towed vehicle that had individual rear turn signals.

(Personally, I believe amber rear turn signals provide superior safety, and I believe they should be required in the U.S, just as they are in most of the rest of the world.)

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #5 – September 09, 2014, 06:46:00 pm

Connector wiring.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #6 – September 09, 2014, 07:22:39 pm

I might be missing something but why not get a plug that goes from your 4 pin connector to the 6 or 7 pin connector on your motorhome that way it should be correct. Thats what I do and it works great.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #7 – September 09, 2014, 08:51:06 pm

joeszeidel, you might be missing the problem. While my Lexus GX470 toad has amber signals and red brake/running combo lights, the previous Winnebago I had it hooked up to had the US standard combo red brake/signal lights. As such the Lexus has only left turn, right turn, tail and ground running through the chassis to the rear. While some day I could run the additional brake light line back and change the brake lights to the signal lights to flash, I didn't want to mess with that today just before departing on a cross country trip. My solution to the problem was to wire this in NAPA 755-1086 tail light converter NAPA AUTO PARTS which will handle combining the split signal/brake wiring from the foretravel into my "US style" wiring. The parking/brake lights are a little close in brightness but it gets the job done for now since we don't often drive at night at all. My bet is that the tail light converter is cutting power to the running light filament while the braking filament is lit which probably isn't right.

The Foretravel (mine at least) is not a properly wired 6 way plug. The brake connector is to be used for an electric brake. This might be up for interpretation because I see diagrams that refer to this pin as brake and I find other guides that refer to it as electric bra1ke. An electric brake pin is variable voltage and would be used by a controller. It's an entirely different thing.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #8 – September 09, 2014, 09:16:31 pm

SAE J560 calls for the 6 pin connector to power the electric brake. Stop lights are concurrent with the turn signals.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #9 – September 10, 2014, 06:19:37 am

PIKU thanks for the response I have never seen that napa device before. I'm still puzzled about your connections maybe because I have only owned american cars. As far as brightness you may want to make sure your getting a good ground that may be the reason your light is dim. Good luck and have a great trip.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #10 – September 10, 2014, 08:30:29 am

Trailer wiring is standard. That's the reason for the color coded wires. This is probably what you need. I use one.

New Hopkins Trailer Harness 47305 Wiring Kit 6 Round 4 Flat Adapter | eBay

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #11 – September 10, 2014, 08:44:28 am

Piku,
I had the converter just like your pictured napa device and it failed recently. My lights where always dim. So I installed a powered converter like this one Curt Circuit Protected Powered Converter w/ SMT Curt Custom Fit Vehicle Wiring. My lights work great now and are very bright.

Mark

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #12 – September 10, 2014, 08:50:58 am

Piku, it is possible that the wires tapped into the turn signal wires are either loose or the connection is bad. I had a similar problem with our coach. 'Bout drove me nuts until the DW told me to do one thing at a time. It turned out the wire where it connected to the right turn light wire on our coach was not indicating any power on my probe. I ran a new wire from coach wire to the connector and--Problem solved!!

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #13 – September 10, 2014, 10:01:46 am

Quote from: piku – September 09, 2014, 05:10:45 pm

.........................Apparently the foretravel only puts out 12v on the electric brake wire and not on the individual left and right turn wires. I think that's wrong and that both the turn wires should light on brake. Am I misinformed?......................................

Piku,
Every FT I've ever worked on has been connected in the standard trailer wiring convention, just as Steve has given in this thread. If your FT 6 pin connector is not configured in accordance with Steve's schematic, someone (PO?) has "mucked" with the FT Connector Wiring based on some other Toad configuration (which he may have also have "mucked " with).

Quote from: MAZ – September 10, 2014, 08:44:28 am

.................I had the converter just like your pictured napa device and it failed recently. My lights where always dim. So I installed a powered converter like this one Curt Circuit Protected Powered Converter w/ SMT Curt Custom Fit Vehicle Wiring .................................
Mark

BINGO, Mark!
When one converts the Foretravel 6 wire lighting convention to a 4 wire Toad (car or trailer), in order to be safe, one must use a POWERED convertor, or the Toad turn and brake (and emergency flasher) lights will be dimmer than normal.
Why?
Two reasons:

Increased wire length/additional friction fit connections lead to an increase in the overall wire resistance which drops more voltage which leaves less voltage to light the lamp filaments (perhaps even enough voltage drop that if the Toad brake or stop lights are LED, the LED won't even turn on, which typically happens at around 9 Vdc decreasing).

UNPOWERED convertors use diodes to prevent the backfeed of "commoned-up" wire voltages on the toad side from feeding back to the separated wires on the coach side.

For example, if those diodes weren't there in the convertor, every time you put a left or right turn signal on, all of the coach brake light filaments would flash......brake and turn use one common filament on the toad side but separate filaments (bulbs even) on the coach side, etc.

Because the diodes are there in the convertor, toad side brake voltage is automatically 0.7 to 0.9 Vdc lower than on the coach side of the connector, which if you have a weak flasher or poor contacts in an automotive brake relay, may already be at 11.0 Vdc, maybe even 10.0 Vdc or less.

Don't drive at night so dim lights are not a problem?
Very incorrect.
Even dim lights are generally detectable in the dark, but dim lights in the day time all but disappear from detection. Dim brake and signal lights in the daytime highly increase accident risk because ALL drivers are accustomed (per-disposed) to react to bright turn and stop signal lights. Conversely, dim signal lights are all but automatically perceived as a momentary shadow or reflection, not an intention to turn or stop.
Neal

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #14 – September 10, 2014, 10:23:15 am

Quote from: Twig – September 10, 2014, 08:30:29 am

Trailer wiring is standard. That's the reason for the color coded wires. This is probably what you need. I use one.

New Hopkins Trailer Harness 47305 Wiring Kit 6 Round 4 Flat Adapter | eBay

Look carefully at what you are buying.
Adapters and Convertors are usually two different animals:
Adapters just change the physical configuration of the connector plug from 6 on one end to 4 on the other.
Convertors change a six wire set of electrical information/conductors/six bulb filaments to a four wire set of information/conductors/bulb filaments.
Because of the overall length of the wiring and the number of connection points, to be safe and trouble free (especially with LED lights on the Toad/Trailer), one must use a POWERED Convertor, not just a diode convertor.
Neal

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #15 – September 10, 2014, 12:10:03 pm

AND, it takes very little to "blow" a converter. Take it from one who knows!!

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #16 – September 10, 2014, 01:44:18 pm

I have had no problem with my adapter or dim lights in 7 years. I have also towed doubles with the car hooked to the motorhome and a trailer hooked to the car using the same wiring with no dim light problem.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #17 – September 13, 2014, 10:57:02 am

Actually the lights were pretty dim because the engine wasn't running and the boost wasn't on. When the engine is running hte brake lights are quite visible. I will consider hte powered converter as a final solution as I do care about safety.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #18 – September 14, 2014, 07:11:21 am

FT installed a powered convertor on my 1999 U320. Doesn't your wiring diagram show one? Mine failed, which caused me much consternation until I diagnosed it. I found quite a spread in quality of available convertors. FT had used one of the top ones.

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #19 – September 14, 2014, 10:34:03 pm

My wiring diagram does not show a powered converter. Only a connector going to another connector. I haven't traced the wiring yet. I believe it is ultimately up to Foretravel to install a proper powered converter if they provide the trailer connector. The trailer connector should work to a specification of some sort and reasonably be able to light the trailer lights. I do wish they ran aux power. 3 days of driving was enough to kill the toad battery. I'm glad the brake buddy didn't spazz out and lock the brakes as I have heard they can do in low voltage conditions.

Where in relation to your connector was the converter located? Do you have a 6 or 7 way connector? Does your connector have aux power wired up by the factory?

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #20 – September 14, 2014, 11:10:05 pm

Mine is taped to the cross beam above the electrical connection point. It may also have some of that plastic ribbed cable protector over a pile of wires. I think FT put them all in the same spot.
JohnH

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #21 – September 15, 2014, 12:10:12 am

Hi piku,
Our 1997 U 320 has the converter where John H's 2000 coach has it. My buddies 2000 U 320 had it in the same place.
Raymond

Re: Trailer Connector Miswired?

Reply #22 – September 15, 2014, 05:58:59 am

Same here, to 6 way connector. I've changed it to 7 pin.

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