Another Air Problem

Topic: Another Air Problem (Read 1422 times) previous topic - next topic

Another Air Problem

December 08, 2014, 04:26:59 pm

I am currently dead in the Sears Parking lot at Hwy 21 and Loop 304 in Crockett, Tx

Well, at least immovable.
5-7 miles outside of Crockett the "level System" light came on and the white air pressure gauge had dropped to 65 or so.
I knew I was in trouble.
By the time I got here I was 60 and below on both tanks. I'm down to about 40 now.

With the engine still running I felt around the D2 governor and the top port was exhausting air. The pressure was low enough for me to hold in closed with my finger.
I taped a Kleenex to the end of a broomstick and used that to determine I could not detect air exhausting from the bottom of the Air Drier.

Should the D@ be constantly exhausting?

I ran the engine foe a good while and air pressure never built up.

Suggestions appreciated.

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #1 – December 08, 2014, 04:41:06 pm

Elliott,

It sure sounds like either the D2 is stuck in the unload position or the stem inside broke. I would sure swap out with a new governor. (Do the cheep stuff 1st) Make sure that you install the plugs in the proper places on the new one.

Pamela & Mike

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #2 – December 08, 2014, 04:41:43 pm

I would guess that the D2 governor is bad....but if an airline or plug came out of a port that should not be open, it would leak air...check out this Bendix troubleshooting link.. http://www.bendix.com/media/documents/products_1/compressorsgovernors_1/troubleshootingguide.pdf

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #3 – December 08, 2014, 04:42:38 pm

Here is the info on your governor.

Keith

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #4 – December 08, 2014, 04:44:10 pm

CUT-IN POSITION
Apply soap solution around the cover and to the exhaust
port. Slight bubble leakage permitted. Excessive leakage
indicates a faulty inlet valve or lower piston o-ring.
CUT-OUT POSITION
Apply soap solution around the cover and to the exhaust
port. Slight bubble leakage permitted. Excessive leakage
indicates a faulty exhaust valve seat, exhaust stem o-ring,
or o-ring at the top of the piston.
If the governor does not function as described or leakage is
excessive, it is recommended that it be replaced with a new
or remanufactured unit.

I thought you may have a sticking gov' and copied the above from Bendix web. I would let all air pressure out then spray into Gov' someWD40 or very thin silicon spray and then give the thing a bit of a thump with heavy tool. Run engine and see if it loosens up if it is sticking. If that works then for sure you need a new one.

JohnH

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #5 – December 08, 2014, 04:52:12 pm

Elliott,

If you need a parts store there is a NAPA out on the NE Loop IIRC. There is also a O'Reillys on the loop that may be closer to your location.

Pamela & Mike

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #6 – December 08, 2014, 04:54:20 pm

Try these people. I called and they have them BUT take old one as you may need to match it. They close at 6pm
Keith

Address
1407 East Loop 304
Crockett, TX 75835
Get Directions
Phone Number
Tel: (936) 544 - 3287
Fax: (936) 545 - 0667

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #7 – December 08, 2014, 07:19:24 pm

Well, not a great day.
The mobile mech. replaced the D2.
Still doesn't air up. Says the Purge valve is leaking.

I will look back through the forum comments on this rather extensive topic and go from there.
I did a DQ6026 replacement last April but don't know as yet whether the Purge valve was part of that, whether I can/should replace just the purge valve, or whether I should just replace the entire dryer.

The other issue is which part number(s) to obtain. My current Haladex unit has the external Eco valve like Barry's.

In any event, the Sears lot is nice and big and empty.

later

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #8 – December 08, 2014, 07:51:25 pm

Pump the brakes until air is gone then start the motor. My d2 was sticking badly the day I picked up the coach. Had to go to zero to get it to release and fill.

Had brakes lock up several times.

New D2 went from 90-110 to 120-130 and now the brakes work better

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #9 – December 08, 2014, 07:53:02 pm

Haldex DQ6026 is basically a filter change kit, with both filters and spare high pressure relief valve that often is not installed. Purge valve is part of a 'bottom' maintenance kit, that is much more difficult to install than changing filters. Our current philosophy is to replace the whole dryer with a factory rebuilt unit, which comes with new filters. Difficulty of replacing the unit is related to the large tight air fittings. We sometimes change just the two filters with the DQ6026 kit.

We prevent junk or water from entering the D2 governor's open vent, by screwing a brass hose fitting into the vent and running a hose down.

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #10 – December 09, 2014, 12:32:40 am

the DQ6020 kit is the purge etc kit and I feel the part that many do not do as well is the 6026 filter kit. easy job and makes you old dryer just like a replacement one. I do it every 2 yrs for safety and lack of problems on the road.
JohnH

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #11 – December 09, 2014, 09:10:12 am

John,

I agree. It is OK to just do the filter replacement, perhaps once. But after that, I go with a factory reman or factory new (price dependent). That way the filters, VALVES AND HEATER ARE NEW.

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #12 – December 09, 2014, 10:55:03 am

Does not replacing all the parts as I mentioned make it NEW again. The heater can be done by buying that too, but what I do is put 12v on it while off and check it still works, so in essence the unit now is a remanufactured one at less price?
Yeah, I know some cannot do it but most here on forum are willing learners.
JohnH

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #13 – December 09, 2014, 10:59:45 am

Is every two years often enough? Is there any maintenance required between the complete rebuild every two years?

Larry

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #14 – December 09, 2014, 11:06:26 am

Larry, every 2 yrs is more than enough but as I like little things to do I have no problem doing it for the peace of mind- or at the least I have done more than I need to and if it does cause problems while on road it is not because I did not keep up maintenance on it. No interim work required except drive it.
John

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #15 – December 09, 2014, 11:08:41 am

Our dryer has not been rebuilt / replaced in 5 years.

When Bernd took it out it was dry as a bone.

Is rebuild still called for?

best, paul

Quote

Is every two years often enough? Is there any maintenance required between the complete rebuild every two years?

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #16 – December 09, 2014, 11:15:28 am

Paul, for peace of mind yes the filters need to be replaced and hopefully he did that being the person he sounds like and with his knowledge of Diesel trucks etc. When you think about all the times the purge valve and Turbo valve have moved while driving I would suggest it behooves you to replace no matter how "dry" it all is inside. Of course this is just my opinion but this Dryer has caused quite a few problems with members lately while on the road and most cannot work on it when it does pack up as it is usually in an awkward spot to get too. It is called "Preventative Maintenance"
JohnH

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #17 – December 09, 2014, 11:21:31 am

I agree with John.

Dryers can fail in a number of ways-- and as we have seen here on the forum, some very expensive (i.e. when desiccant breaks down and gets in all the valves and brake parts).

Wish they had a "red flag" that said "I am about to fail", but not possible.

Unless you drive a LOT of miles and/or drive in a very humid climate, I see three years as a reasonable service interval.

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #18 – December 09, 2014, 12:20:29 pm

Was wondering if the Brays got moving again? Their problem sounds EXACTLY like the one we had in August - replacing the dryer with a new one did the trick. We first replaced the governor also, but that wasn't the problem.

Dryer is right up there with tires and brakes for me now - things not to skimp on!

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #19 – December 09, 2014, 01:01:06 pm

Update
Monday early afternoon
Called FOT and spoke to James T.
Was advised that there are really only three possible problem areas, D2, Dryer, Compressor.
Said shop policy would not allow FOT techs to moonlight and work on the coach.

Called Good Sam and eventually got a mobile mechanic out of North Zulch, about 60 miles away.

Monday late afternoon
Replaced the D2 but didn't solve the problem.
Mechanic crawled under the coach and said air leaks from purge value.

I paid him for the trip, thanked him, and said I would ask Good Sam to arrange a tow into Nac in the morning.

Called Good Sam and started the process.

Tuesday Morning
Since I have an appointment with Berndt Ramspeck on Wednesday I wanted to decide where to deliver the coach, FOT for the alignment and repair or Brendt..

Called FOT Service Writer 7:30 and told him my problem. I said I would probably not be able to keep my appointment with Wayne. He said maybe Wayne could look at it while he was doing the alignment. I suggested that that would be a problem with no air and probably brakes locked.

Asked what would happen if I got the coach to FOT today, could it be worked on? Was told the next service appointment time was in Feb but maybe they could squeeze it in sometime between now and then.

Went to the web.
Read what I could find on the Forum on replacing Air Dryers. Thanks guys!! Determined that the part I needed to replace the entire dryer is a DA33100X .
Billie Jack said they had sold their last one last week.

Went to the web again.
Found a remanufactured DA33100X in stock at the Napa store in Center, Texas and told them I'd be there to get it sometime today.

Tuesday mid -Morning
Called Berndt (after he got to work) and said I was out of air in the parking lot in Crockett. Without prompting or further explanation he said "...let me see what I can do to get somebody out there".!!

I explained what had happened to date and that I had the part waiting in Center.
He said since he is a Napa dealer he will have the part sent from Napa, Center to the Napa, NAC (or him, I wasn't exactly sure) and someone will pick it up and come here to install it !

Called Good Sam and cancelled the tow.

Tuesday 11:45
Just got a call from NAC. Repair truck is on the way!!

Hope springs eternal!!!

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #20 – December 09, 2014, 01:43:26 pm

Howdy Elliot,, Thanks for the update and great write-up.
Good Luck on repair.. Dave A

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #21 – December 09, 2014, 03:54:00 pm

Well one thing for sure this Berndt guy knows Public Relations!!
He is smart as evryone reading these posts that has a breakdown fairly close to NAC is definitly going to call him instead of FT as he realises the predicament you are in when stuck someplace. I am surprised FT does not have a "Breakdown Policy" for times like this as they sure as heck get lots of work from all you guys during the year but something like this would frost me off to be honest. Why not have a guy go after shop hours and charge a bit more for labour so that they become the first place to call.??
Beats me!
JohnH

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #22 – December 09, 2014, 05:26:25 pm

Quote from: John Haygarth – December 09, 2014, 03:54:00 pm

Well one thing for sure this Berndt guy knows Public Relations!!
Why not have a guy go after shop hours and charge a bit more for labour so that they become the first place to call.??
Beats me!
JohnH

Road calls not a part of the manufacturer's business plan. Not aware of any factory that will send out a service vehicle/man to service a broken down coach.

Roland

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #23 – December 09, 2014, 08:39:52 pm

Success!!
Almost exactly 24 hours (and a not inconsiderable amount of dollars) after we limped into the Sears parking lot in Crockett we rolled out toward Nacogdoches.

The young man from R&B Automotive Services (Bernd's shop) got to the coach with the new (reman) dryer. After determining that the dryer was in fact the problem and checking part numbers to make sure we had the correct unit he went to work.

My diesel mechanic buddy told me (when I talked to him about the proposed air dryer by-pass kit) several things. He said I would never fit under the coach, I didn't have enough big tools, and I was not strong enough to take the hoses off.
After watching the young man work I decided I would never fit, I didn't have enough big tools, and it took someone stronger than me. I am even more in awe of Don and his roadside by-pass.

One of the coolest things about the exercise was where we were. Not the almost deserted nature of the mall with its great expanse of vacant parking places but the people who worked there. There were signs at all the entrances that said "No Trucks" - "Violators will be Towed and Charged", etc. Mary went in search of the mall manager to explain our situation who told her "Oh, No, Its just the 18 wheelers that tear up the pavement". That night she came by to see if we were ok. It was cold last night and she wanted to offer us the use of the power outlet up on the side wall. The next day the lady from the Resource Center walked across the (still empty) parking lot to bring slices of cake from their office get-together. Nicest people!! They even invited us back.....

We are in Camp Foretravel for the night. I missed the alignment appointment so I'll have to see when I can get in again.

Good to be settled in and connected to power.

Re: Another Air Problem

Reply #24 – December 09, 2014, 11:29:58 pm

Roland, my answer to that is "well it should be" especially as FT has a Motorcade Club(that we contribute to) that is supposed to be designed to help us all and project a kind of Family attitude with the factory! I could understand it if they did not do service or custom refitting work but a large part (maybe bigger than the actual selling of coaches) of their bottom line is "service" I would think.
I think they are missing out on what may be another good business tool. What is the big deal on having one of the techs assigned to any "call outs" with a truck for after hours. if I had broken down within a couple hundred miles of factory and knew someone with experience would be at our coach after 3.30pm I would feel good and sit waiting, rather than phoning all over the place trying to get help from unknown places. If this was done next time I wanted work done it would make me call them first
That is my take on this.
JohnH

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