Speaking of tires...

Topic: Speaking of tires... (Read 1637 times) previous topic - next topic

Speaking of tires...

June 03, 2015, 12:09:15 pm

Well it was finally time to say good by to the 90% there 2003 XZA2's that were sitting under our coach.

Signed up for the Michelin advantage program and had a set of 6 XZ3A's located at a local dealer... Walked in to get the job going and I made the mistake of asking if they had ever put Xones on a motorhome. The guy behind the counter perked up really quickly and said no but they would sure like to try it. I asked what the price difference would be for this change and it went something like this.

XZ3A's $560 or so a tire
Xones $1080 or so a tire

(...hmmmmmm that is pretty much a strait heat on the rubber cost)

"What about the wheels?" I say.

Wheels were $470 each... OK that's a bit of a show stopper for rubber that does not appear to have a clear advantage in this application. But wait the counter guy says. Michelin is offering up a rebate right now to get folks to switch of $170 per wheel. Hmmm this is getting more interesting! The counter guy then goes out and looks at my wheels and says they are like new and he would give $125 each for them.

OK doing the math here we have $170 plus $250 carry the nine divide by pi... Holy Moly we can get into these things for $100 bucks!!!!

Suffice to say they are on the coach and we are off on the first trip this Friday. The five miles between home and the tire shop makes me think these will be better from an NVH standpoint. The twisty two lane between Portland and the beach will be a great test of handling...

(to be continued...)

Cheers

Chris

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #1 – June 03, 2015, 02:01:18 pm

Which wheels did you get? Alcoa makes two for the wide base tires--one (84360x) has an outset of one inch and the other (84362x) has an outset of two inches. The reason I ask is that I've read that trucks using the two-inch outset wheels have experienced accelerated wheel-bearing wear because of the extra load with the center of the wheel being spaced farther out on the hub. I don't know if this would be a problem with the relatively few miles typically seen in motorhome use, but it might be something to consider.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #2 – June 03, 2015, 02:29:19 pm

What's the difference between outset and offset?

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #3 – June 03, 2015, 02:44:54 pm

Quote from: D.J. Osborn – June 03, 2015, 02:01:18 pm

Which wheels did you get? Alcoa makes two for the wide base tires--one (84360x) has an outset of one inch and the other (84362x) has an outset of two inches. The reason I ask is that I've read that trucks using the two-inch outset wheels have experienced accelerated wheel-bearing wear because of the extra load with the center of the wheel being spaced farther out on the hub. I don't know if this would be a problem with the relatively few miles typically seen in motorhome use, but it might be something to consider.

We test fit both and went with the 2 inch outset wheels.

I went over he wheel bearing issues (that some guys bring up) on trucks with a friend of mine who works for Freightliner and we just did not see it as a major concern in this application. (We are not at axle capacity on this chassis and the motorhome duty cycle is a fraction of what an OTR truck sees.)

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #4 – June 03, 2015, 03:07:41 pm

Nice! I would love to have to monitor "check" tire pressure of a single tire instead of a dually ... so many pros an cons here ... there could be mpg savings too? But it is always good (for me) to think that if i get a flat on one tire it is good to have 4 of them back there.
All my tires are new so I won't be able to experiment with it anyway ... not anytime soon ...
Enjoy your new shoes :-)

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #5 – June 03, 2015, 03:11:12 pm

Interesting... is there any unsprung weight savings with this setup? Keep us apprised of you're experience with these as you go. I'm sure that many will be interested to hear what you think in a year or so... Which, Coincidentally, might be about the time we will ready for a new set of rears...
Don

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #6 – June 03, 2015, 03:25:33 pm

Just remember that the other tire in a dual configuration can't handle the load alone. If you drive any distance at all with a flat dual you'll soon blow its mate.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #7 – June 03, 2015, 04:47:41 pm

The coolness factor alone is worth $100! Beautiful wheels

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #8 – June 03, 2015, 05:53:19 pm

Quote from: cajk – June 03, 2015, 04:47:41 pm

The coolness factor alone is worth $100! Beautiful wheels

Not ashamed to admit that the coolness factor weighed very heavily in this decision...

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #9 – June 03, 2015, 05:56:20 pm

Quote from: acousticart – June 03, 2015, 03:11:12 pm

Interesting... is there any unsprung weight savings with this setup? Keep us apprised of you're experience with these as you go. I'm sure that many will be interested to hear what you think in a year or so... Which, Coincidentally, might be about the time we will ready for a new set of rears...
Don

I have seen estimates around 300 lbs an axle...

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #10 – June 03, 2015, 06:24:21 pm

Quote from: amos.harrison – June 03, 2015, 03:25:33 pm

Just remember that the other tire in a dual configuration can't handle the load alone. If you drive any distance at all with a flat dual you'll soon blow its mate.

Yes. I understand that but i can limp 10-15 mph to a close by tire shop :-)

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #11 – June 03, 2015, 06:56:31 pm

Quote from: propman – June 03, 2015, 06:24:21 pm

Yes. I understand that but i can limp 10-15 mph to a close by tire shop :-)

Tires dont go when there is a close by tire shop.

(Insert component here) NEVER goes when there is a (Previously inserted component) shop anywhere even close...

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #12 – June 03, 2015, 08:43:00 pm

I hope you keep us posted on your new tire configuration. It will be interested to hear the pros and cons. I see a number of advantages to the big singles, am considering it myself. Good luck and look forward to hearing more.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #13 – June 04, 2015, 03:09:32 am

FANTASTIC!

Please keep us all posted on the tire / wheel combo.
I can't recall any body else actually trying this combo.
Always nice to see somebody thinking out side the box.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #14 – June 04, 2015, 07:52:13 am

Quote from: amos.harrison – June 03, 2015, 02:29:19 pm

What's the difference between outset and offset?

When discussing wheels the "inset" or "outset" is the distance from the mounting face of the wheel to the centerline of the rim. These terms are typically used when discussing wheels used as duals. In this case, discussing wide-base wheels replacing duals, the "outset" would be the offset from the mounting face to the centerline of the wheel.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #15 – June 04, 2015, 10:27:42 am

I am so glad someone has done this. I am due for new tires next year and had made a few inquiries but no one had actually done it so of course info was no where to be found. My big goal is weight reduction and along with that a little fuel economy improvement would be a nice bonus. Looking forward to follow up postings.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #16 – June 04, 2015, 11:09:16 am

How the heck are you going to find a spare if you get a flat in the middle of nowhere?

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #17 – June 04, 2015, 01:13:28 pm

Quote from: krush – June 04, 2015, 11:09:16 am

How the heck are you going to find a spare if you get a flat in the middle of nowhere?

This was of course the hardest point of the decision making process... The limp along on a single is a false assumption with duals and we are dead in the water (hopefully not literally) when a steer tire goes.

The fact that they are the same height as our standard tires makes it possible to locally source a set of take off steels plus tires and get on the road again. Thats a worst case situation as Michelin has these things in stock at the majority of the locations one would buy an XZE3.

This would not be my tire of choice to drive the Alcan without a set of mounted spares but then again this would not be my rig of choice to drive the Alcan.

First real test drive is tomorrow.

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #18 – June 04, 2015, 03:17:47 pm

My brother drives a big rig with both trailer and tractor having super singles. He tells me that in the three years that he has been using them that he has never had a flat and that the super singles are generally stocked by larger tire dealers now.
Gary B

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #19 – June 04, 2015, 03:34:16 pm

I wonder how the wide tires handel wet roads?

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #20 – June 04, 2015, 04:16:37 pm

Again i'll chime in, brother says that they are no big problem, like with all rigs, rain calls for lower speed and longer following distance, and if its bad enough its time to take a coffee break. He has 3 million miles of safe driving under his belt so I think its worth listening to him.
Gary B

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #21 – June 08, 2015, 01:46:42 pm

Hey Travelers,

We are back from a quick trip to the coast so here is the first official feedback on the Xones.

The most noticeable trait is how much smoother they are. The "road roughness" driven constant vibration levels are way down. With this is also an obvious reduction in noise. Not necessarily tire noise alone, but also general coach noise that result from normal vibrations. Larger bumps (like pot holes) felt less harsh as well. General dips and woops didn't feel all that different except for the fact that I was hitting them 5-10 MPH faster than before.

Thats the second point. Not sure if it was a characteristic of the tire itself or just the driver knowing he had brand new rubber instead of very old rubber... But I found we moved faster in all situations. Not going to say it is the sole result of handling improvements, or rolling resistance, or

?. But I found myself having to back out of the throttle because of the speed limit way more often than before. (And for those unfamiliar with the drive from Portland to the coast 3/4's of the trip is twisty 2 lane.)

Lastly there is a day use parking lot at the beach we were at that has various amount of sand blown onto it so I made a point of driving through a few of the "dunes" and then checking tire tracks. Did not measure anything but the front tires sunk in at least 50% more than the back.

So far I would give the tires two thumbs up from a performance standpoint.

Cheers

Chris

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #22 – June 08, 2015, 02:20:28 pm

What size X ones did you install?

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #23 – June 08, 2015, 02:37:45 pm

Quote from: GKCigar – June 08, 2015, 02:20:28 pm

What size X ones did you install?

X One Energy 445/50-22.5's

Re: Speaking of tires...

Reply #24 – June 09, 2015, 05:54:42 am

Quote from: squeezer – June 08, 2015, 02:37:45 pm

X One Energy 445/50-22.5's

Great tires I have ran super singles on my semi for 9 yrs now. I am running the 455 size but they are tough as all get out. I am a member of OOIDA and can buy them on national account through michelin X One xda energy 445/50-22.5 $879.and change

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