Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Topic: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road. (Read 1901 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #25 – July 20, 2015, 11:12:57 pm

Quote from: car54 – July 20, 2015, 11:00:03 pm

Michelin says 75. Any coincidence that is faster than any legal commercial vehicle speed limit on the road? They need to put a number down. So they did. I see plenty of semis that work 5 days a week at the drag strip on saturday on the same commercial tires we run on going 120mph. I see dump trucks going 80-85 down I95 in the morning.

Do you have any proof of a max speed other than one column on a michelin website? Id love to see it.

If you went 70 across the 10 interstate in Arizona you would be trampled by the big rigs going the legal speed limit of 75.

110 degree. 75mph continious for 300 miles at max load. Seems to back up the legally libel manufactures public spec page?

No crashes. I assume some are running the best lasting big rig tires from Michelin? 220,000 to 280,000 miles are the normal reports on the Internet.

I personally did five hundred mile stretches at 90 mph on old Michelin 10r/80?/22.5's on a 1987 ORED 300 cat. But that was in the winter so maybe it does not count?

Done 50 thousands of miles over the manufacturers speed spec long ago.

Half the fun. Not recommended btw. Do whatever you feel comfortable with.

My old Foretravel customers loved me as I tested every suggestion personally on my nickle and my neck on the line.

Do not go faster than your info and comfort level tells you to.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #26 – July 20, 2015, 11:36:31 pm

Glad you are ok!

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #27 – July 20, 2015, 11:53:25 pm

Tim, Glad you came to a safe landing. (I've driven through two front tire events and don't like the experience.) Also pleased that you kept driving the beast to a "controlled stop" when things got exciting.

We have shadowed your pretty coach from shop to shop in Nac for weeks. Now I learn that I'm chasing your rig to Lake Geneva! Staying there for the ILYA Championships. All the best! Paul

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #28 – July 21, 2015, 08:34:20 am

Fastest I've gone is 83. Driveshaft starts to vibrate at that speed now with the 4.33 gears. Before the same vibe came in about68mph. I normally cruise 70-75. Last tank was approx 8.3 mpg with maybe 20 hours of gen time on pretty flat ground towing dolly+tercel

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #29 – July 21, 2015, 01:27:38 pm

Quote from: Gary Bouland – July 20, 2015, 02:10:08 pm

Seems like the blowouts that I hear about are all Michelins ? Why is that, just that many Michelins in service or a fault in Michelins ?
Gary B

Gary, That is my observation as well. The tire expert at Lazydays told me that they have the thinnest sidewall for a smoother ride but are more prone to blowouts.
Mark

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #30 – July 21, 2015, 01:32:51 pm

Quote from: MAZ – July 21, 2015, 01:27:38 pm

Gary, That is my observation as well. The tire expert at Lazydays told me that they have the thinnest sidewall for a smoother ride but are more prone to blowouts.
Mark

Probably the biggest reason I like stiff sidewall radials. We still have a nice ride even at max pressures.

Long off season storage with less than recommended pressures and high weight set any tire up for failure. Compressed airbags during storage don't do them any good either.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #31 – July 21, 2015, 01:36:34 pm

My understanding of the differences that I researched long ago was that there were two designs used in being able to control a vehicle after losing tire pressure.

One is thick sidewalls like the toyos have.

The other is the one Michelin uses that shreds the sidewall thin rubber so the rim comes down flat on the tread belt.

The results shown in the picture here match my old info. Destroyed tire but driver maintained control.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #32 – July 21, 2015, 01:48:33 pm

Unless overloaded or top heavy, any Foretravel with a halfway sharp driver that has not been drinking should be easily control any blowout. Will take the thick sidewall anytime. At less than $300, Alcoa wheels are dirt cheap compared to glass/body damage.

Not kidding about the drinking. Good percentage of RV drivers and pilots have a drink or two or three late in the day.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #33 – July 21, 2015, 01:53:29 pm

Unless overloaded or top heavy, any Foretravel with a halfway sharp driver that has not been drinking should be easily able to control any blowout. Will take the thick sidewall anytime. At less than $300, Alcoa wheels are dirt cheap compared to glass/body damage.

Not kidding about the drinking. Good percentage of RV drivers and pilots have a drink or two or three late in the day.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #34 – July 21, 2015, 08:11:58 pm

Cm fore told us at the unihome introduction that the suspension and settings were specifically designed around the Michelin's side walls and driving feel.

Like the Europeans do is what he said at the meeting.

Country coach switched to toyos on their first independent front suspension coaches to try to help a wander issue.

I think the michelins have been oem ever since?

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #35 – July 22, 2015, 02:39:12 am

Quote from: Caflashbob – July 21, 2015, 08:11:58 pm

Like the Europeans do is what he said at the meeting.

The Europeans have a wide choice of tire brands with the sidewall stiffness depending on the speed rating. Many cars there are capable of cruising at 150 mph and are mandated to have at least a "V" rated tire. In the case of Michelin tires, the tires fitted to cars with a lower top speed were much lighter and more flexible. The V rated tires that came OEM with the new S class Mercedes we sold were very heavy, had a thick side wall, were super sticky even in the rain but paid the price in faster tread wear. They were like magic on a wet road. Now, some vehicles can approach or even exceed 200 mph on the Autobahn so there are higher letters to designate the maximum speed. The higher the rating, the stiffer the tire. Here is a chart with the latest speed rating designation in the U.S. or abroad:

SPEED SYMBOL SPEED MPH SPEED KPH
M 81 130
N 87 140
P 93 150
Q 99 160
R 106 170
S 112 180
T 118 190
U 124 200
H 130 210
V*(VR) 149 240
W**(ZR) 168 270
Y**(ZR) 186 300

Many new cars in Europe like Mercedes and BMW are electronically limited to 156 mph. Without extensive chassis modification, the occupants would not survive crashes at higher speeds. (not that they would at under 156 mph.) At high speeds of about 150 mph, the tire will go from an unloaded shape to a loaded shape and back 35 times a second. This causes the maximum weight as stamped on the tire to decrease about 20% at these high speeds. Translation: better not have too much luggage or passenger weight if approaching the car's maximum speed.

The V rated Michelins were my favorite tire and we made sure all the new S class came with them. I have translated the sidewall thickness they had to RV use and feel more secure with a thicker sidewall even though it may give a slightly firmer ride.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #36 – July 22, 2015, 07:33:36 am

Quote from: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart – July 22, 2015, 02:39:12 am

I have translated the sidewall thickness they had to RV use and feel more secure with a thicker sidewall even though it may give a slightly firmer ride.

Pierce,

You have said 3 times (in this thread) that you prefer "thicker sidewall" tires. Since you are apparently not talking about Michelin, what brand name tire does incorporate this feature? Is it the Toyos mentioned above, or some other brand?

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #37 – July 23, 2015, 12:12:21 pm

I also had a blow out at 60mph on 59 north hear in east Texas this past weekend. The temp was 98 deg. the dot age of the tire was 9 yrs. the tread was real good. The side wall was cracking some. It blew out and the FT slowed and I steered it off to the side with no problems. The side wall that blew out was on the inside, so no damage to the 93 U240 at all. The LORD was with us and at 6:00pm Saturday afternoon, I bought a r9x22.5 tire in Nacogdoches. I did not believe it when I saw the NEW tire that had a dot date of 2405(10 yrs old). We had it mounted on the FT on the side of the road by road service for only $50.00 and drove home with no problems. I looked at the tire this morning and if I did not look at the date code, I would think it was made this year. I also looked at the blowout tire and the steel cords were rusted. So I think it was not the rubber failing but the rusted steel belts that failed.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #38 – July 23, 2015, 12:24:59 pm

Quote from: Chuck & Jeannie – July 22, 2015, 07:33:36 am

Pierce,

You have said 3 times (in this thread) that you prefer "thicker sidewall" tires. Since you are apparently not talking about Michelin, what brand name tire does incorporate this feature? Is it the Toyos mentioned above, or some other brand?

Chuck,

Michelin and Goodyear make RV tires with a different spec than normal truck tires. It could be for a variety of reason. Extra UV protection, softer ride, better life with long storage periods, etc.

A lot of truck tires have a little stiffer sidewall. We used only Cooper on the FD and our U300 came with a set. Toyo tires are a little stiffer. Best to talk to a high volume truck tire shop for their opinion. Bus companies are also good. Bridgestone has a reputation for excellent casings.

Wish I could say more but while I have done a lot of tire selection in the past, now it's only an occasional set. All my information about the V rated Michelins was from about 30 years ago. Like computers and cars, tire technology changes so good to talk to some independent truck tire dealer for the 2015 scoop.

Moisture in the tire along with long off season storage may have a lot to do with rust as in the above post.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #39 – July 23, 2015, 02:21:25 pm

Quote from: pthurman48 – July 23, 2015, 12:12:21 pm

I also had a blow out at 60mph on 59 north hear in east Texas this past weekend. The temp was 98 deg. the dot age of the tire was 9 yrs. the tread was real good. The side wall was cracking some. It blew out and the FT slowed and I steered it off to the side with no problems. The side wall that blew out was on the inside, so no damage to the 93 U240 at all. The LORD was with us and at 6:00pm Saturday afternoon, I bought a r9x22.5 tire in Nacogdoches. I did not believe it when I saw the NEW tire that had a dot date of 2405(10 yrs old). We had it mounted on the FT on the side of the road by road service for only $50.00 and drove home with no problems. I looked at the tire this morning and if I did not look at the date code, I would think it was made this year. I also looked at the blowout tire and the steel cords were rusted. So I think it was not the rubber failing but the rusted steel belts that failed.

I wonder if the oft mentioned inspection by a Michelin tire dealer as to whether to continue to use a older set of otherwise good tires IS to check for rusty cord belts.

My non expert opinion after seeing many rusted cord belt tires was that the thin rubber coating covering the tire carcass allowed moisture through it after many years of 100 psi use and high temperatures.

If memory serves me all the shredded tires I looked at showed the same rust as yours.

Which is why I am paranoid about any water in the tires. No water, no rust. If no cracking and proper storage I think the tires can be safely used for much longer than the life's posted here.

Again that's why I bought the Mylers mounting non water lube.

And use the coaches dry air and my nitrogen tank at home to add to the tires.

Seen a lot of dry air climate tires go way longer than the life's shown here long ago.

Anyone have a blowout without rusty belts or extensive sidewall cracking would be my next question?

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #40 – July 23, 2015, 10:49:08 pm

My take on the Michelin tires that most put on their coach's is that generally speaking (now this does NOT include all of the knowledgable people on this board) RV' ers are like sheep "they follow the crowd" because if Joe Blow is doing it then it must be good. Now, with FMCA giving them the passing grade and pushing that Brand only then of course why should it be questioned as to the road worthiness etc of Michelin??
I spent many months and emails asking Truck tire shops from Phx to here what they thought would give the best service and safety factor. Pheonix Tire said Toyo and the outlet over the Border here at Les Schwab said the same. Bridgestone was highly recommended here at Kal Tire and when I tried to get Toyo's here in Canada I finally spoke to the Rep' in Ontario and he said they do not have what I want for at least 6 months but the Firestone F95 was the closest one to the Toyo 147 which I have on the front.. I look at the tires on every truck that stops alongside me on highway and Firestone-Continental and Toyo are the ones on majority of them. I personally think that Michelin are not the best but the most expensive soft ride in town that can come with a big bang!!
IMHO
JohnH

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #41 – July 23, 2015, 10:58:32 pm

John

I can tell you I sold TOYO's for years and they are awesome tires. STuck in nowhere MO, the only load range H tires in my size available were Michelin's, so that is what went on the coach. Would put on Toyo's any day

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #42 – July 24, 2015, 12:11:53 am

Yeah I know, sometimes the timing is just not there.
We had a situation a few weeks ago on a small Island off Vancouver as we were looking at Ocean front Property to buy and just before getting to the ferry terminal Ruth's CRV fuel pump packed in. Well the part had to come from another Island and the mechanic was not going till 2 days later and of course guess who has to pay his ferry ride etc. The guy was fine just that we now had to pay for 2 extra nights at the B+B and the repair which was on the heavy side to say the least. That fuel pump finished up costing over $1000 all things added up and if it had happened at home I could have done it myself and cost of Pump (from same dealer as he got it, but our local branch) was $75.00
Go figure.
JohnH

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #43 – July 24, 2015, 01:21:43 am

The reason I'm running Michelins is they came with the coach..
When I'm going to replace them, they will not be Michelins (unless someone is giving them away.)
Toyo (then Bridgestone or Goodyear) is my pick for a steering axle. If you cannot find them, wait until they can be located.
Decades back, Goodyear Imperials were the steering axle tire of choice with the Class 8 guys I ran with but in the last couple of decades the Toyo's have gotten the respect of most OO's (owner operators) that can afford to buy a quality steering axle tire.
Buy a higher (more capable) rated tire, it only hurts your pocketbook.
Motorhomes are typically front end heavy (plus 12,000 lbs.) MH owners get away with it because they don't have to stop at scales.
When it's a hot day, keep an eye on your steering tire temps. You would be surprised how hot they will get in the summer months.
Slow down and enjoy the ride, especially in hot weather.
I've never had a steering axle blowout (ever) in over forty years as an OO.. (knock on wood.)
You can't adjust steering axle weight with a MH..sad fact.
I've never run a Michelin on anything but a four wheeler (for good reason.. IMO.)

When someone passes me in a MH whistling down the road,
I get a tight feeling in the seat of my pants (especially in SUMMER.) pc

PS.
TIM, Mercy.. I'd hate to have gone through your experience. I hope its made you a tougher traveler.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #44 – July 24, 2015, 01:45:16 am

I just stopped at the scales. 9520lbs up front and 19,060 rear. Full fuel, water, propane, all my crap. Glad to see the front is a bit lighter than i thought.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #45 – July 24, 2015, 10:19:19 am

John,

Yep. Also, Bridgestone has owned Firestone for a while. Never heard a bad word about Toyos. Bridgestone has an excellent article about off season storage weight loads and recommended air pressures.

Another reason to have a spare is Tim's post above. Too easy to ruin a tire in some obscure town with no replacement to match with only donkey express to get it to you.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #46 – July 26, 2015, 10:51:54 am

Six Michelin XZA3 lr. H installed four years ago. Two have been replaced, one with a sidewall knot which was warrantied, one with a sidewall blowout not warrantied. These tires are rated for much more weight than my light U295. Toyos will most likely be the next set though I will look hard at Hankooks. Had a set of V rated on a BMW roadster which were great tires. Given my once every two year blowout program, I installed a Safe-T-Plus to hedge a bit. Nice benefit to directionality also.

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #47 – July 26, 2015, 11:43:45 am

Chuck,

Not including you here so please don't take offense. I know I have posted this before but off season storage can have a lot to do with keeping tires in the best possible shape with less worries about tire failures while enjoying summer trips. Making sure the coach is at minimum storage weight, keeping tire pressure at recommended storage pressures on the best type of surface and using jacks to take off at least some of the weight off the tires will lower the possibility of an incident spoiling a trip.

Pierce

Re: Left Front Blow out at 60 MPH on a two lane road.

Reply #48 – July 26, 2015, 06:12:18 pm

Check to make sure you don't have a hung caliper. The additional heat could have sent it over the edge. Honestly with that damage I would consider myself very lucky and had a good day.

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