Refrigerator Fire

Topic: Refrigerator Fire (Read 1530 times) previous topic - next topic

Refrigerator Fire

August 28, 2015, 08:24:39 am

Have seen this fiver on my regular route between houses for 8 or so years. Yesterday went by and saw that it had burned out. Stopped and saw the owner who was working in the yard. Nice guy, he and his wife were getting ready last Friday to leave on a 2 week camping trip - went out in the AM and turned on refrigerator to cool it down. Said he did not smell any ammonia smell, and went outside to get his pickup and bring it around to connect to his trailer. As he came back towards coach in his truck he heard a "whoosh" sound and saw flames coming out the side of the coach at the refrigerator vent. Grabbed an extinguisher, but could not really get at the source of the fire, and gave up fearing how fast the fire was spreading. Wife had called 911, fire department came from about 2.2 miles away but this is what they could save.

Would not have wanted to be in there when the fire started. I say it again, really glad to be on the residential refrigerator user list.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #1 – August 28, 2015, 08:40:45 am

After so many fires like these - I ask myself why would anyone not want a residential refrigerator in their rig? I would and have replaced my refrigerator with a residential unit, installed an induction cooktop, and removed all traces of propane out of my rig. This surely makes it much safer and practical. Thats is my opinion.
Bob

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #2 – August 28, 2015, 08:50:35 am

Quote from: bobnkathy – August 28, 2015, 08:40:45 am

After so many fires like these - I ask myself why would anyone not want a residential refrigerator in their rig? I would and have replaced my refrigerator with a residential unit, installed an induction cooktop, and removed all traces of propane out of my rig. This surely makes it much safer and practical. Thats is my opinion.
Bob

Hard to argue safety.

Offset by the potential $10k cost and the limit on dry camping without altering the weight balance of the coach a bit and adding $3 an hour for the gen run time.

My guru buddy mentions not getting a residential refer with the motor tipped on its side as the unit can be damaged trying to compress liquid versus gasses. Those in particular were not made to be in a moving vehicle. Says residential

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #3 – August 28, 2015, 09:05:57 am

Well, I boondock with no issues with my residential and pulled my stove too. I have no issue running my generator too. It will use about a half gallon or so an hour on light load recharging batteries or cooking. Diesel was just filled up at 2.32 a gallon so not even close to 3 dollars an hour. Residential so have been in coaches a long time now and I hear less about failures then I do the gas models.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #4 – August 28, 2015, 09:24:35 am

Couldn't agree more. The electric fridges run so much better, are safer, definitely give me peace of mind. I am going to run the generator anyway, even with our solar, because I watch TV in the evening. VERY happy with our new fridge. We were recently boon docking in front of our daughter's home ... the only time the solar couldn't keep up with the needs of the fridge were when it was over 90 degrees and the sun was hitting the coach. Otherwise, it maintains just fine.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #5 – August 28, 2015, 09:33:35 am

Over 90 degrees and we turn on the AC so that is not an issue. Heck if it is 85 it is on as it is always so humid out here in the SE.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #6 – August 28, 2015, 09:34:26 am

You know also what can catch on fire? Engines, and brakes, and generators, and inverters! In fact, I wonder how many inverter/battery systems cause fires.

It is well known that the fridge needs to be kept clean behind from animal nests, spider webs, etc. I think newer RV fridges are likely safer. Fires happen in many systems.

If the fridges were so dangerous and caused so many casualties, the insurance companies would be tired of paying out. Thus, they would either not insure RV's with propane fridges, charge extremely high rates, and thus force the industry to not install them in new RV's.

I love my propane fridge. It's quiet, works, and gives me no trouble. Could it catch fire? I guess so. But I'm more worried about the massive battery bank with that heavy wire that just takes some cable chaffing to melt down the whole place.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #7 – August 28, 2015, 09:41:04 am

Hey guys just showing a picture not trying to start a religious debate! Bob's never going to change his mind and I'm never going to change mine so it is what it is. as Dave M says do what makes you happy.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #8 – August 28, 2015, 09:46:18 am

Actually insurance companies will ensure anything.
And the propane fire risk is a factored into the rate based based on the loss history.
Luckily very few of these refrigerators do catch fire however they are the preeminent cause of casualties and catastrophic loss in stationary RV's. You cannot opt out of wind damage, etc., it will occur when and where decides to. But you can opt out of the propane refrigerator.
Interestingly enough I've yet to hear anybody who has residential want to go back.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #9 – August 28, 2015, 10:00:02 am

Just curious, how many (modern) Firetravel coaches other than mine have had refrigerator fires? How many have had real damage result, damage other than to the refrigerator itself?

The reason I ask is that my fire caused no damage to the coach itself. My coach is a 2003 build, the refrigerator had a sheet metal plate directing the flame upwards, and unlike other RV's, the refrigerator was well away from flame resistant foam protecting the side wall rather than right next to luan and wood framing. The flame was intense and loud, very visible through the side vent. I was able to remove the vent cover and put the fire out, but it would have run out of hydrogen gas and gone out on it's own about that time. I was running on AC (auto select) at the time, not cooling very well.

After the fire, I compared my refrigerator compartment to other RVs in the campground. On mine, the flame was about three inches away from blue foam insulation. On others, that flame would have been 1/4 inch away from the luan inner sidewall and wood framing.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #10 – August 28, 2015, 10:09:48 am

Hi Tom,
I think there was a bus style front Foretravel that was a total loss years back. I remember seeing pictures here, or the old forum. It may have been a forum member. It looked like the fifth wheeler in this posting. Not much left.
Raymond

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #11 – August 28, 2015, 10:16:22 am

Son just bought a Forest River 5th wheel and it came with inverter and residential fridge.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #12 – August 28, 2015, 10:17:07 am

One great item about having a residential refrigerator - No Defrosting by Hand!

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #13 – August 28, 2015, 10:27:50 am

Quote from: bobnkathy – August 28, 2015, 10:17:07 am

One great item about having a residential refrigerator - No Defrosting by Hand!

AMEN to that!!! I HATED that job, and it was more and more frequent.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #14 – August 28, 2015, 10:35:23 am

So purchase an Atwood 8cf helium RV fridge for $999 new with inexpensive shipping. 110V/propane operation. Does away with the ammonia fire danger. 4.8 out of 5 rating from 14,000 reviews. Could be switched to 110V only if someone wanted to take the propane out of the equation. No worries about installation or doors coming open, etc. when residential unit is used.

Helium Refrigerator for RVs - by Atwood - PPL Motor Homes

We almost never run the generator as any noise or vibration drives me crazy. Still going to make the generator compartment fire resistive for those times we need it for the AC.

You can never get too smug about OEM fire protection. Lots of photos of coaches that have burned.

Pierce

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #15 – August 28, 2015, 11:38:40 am

Quote from: Caflashbob – August 28, 2015, 08:50:35 am

Hard to argue safety.

Offset by the potential $10k cost and the limit on dry camping without altering the weight balance of the coach a bit and adding $3 an hour for the gen run time.

My guru buddy mentions not getting a residential refer with the motor tipped on its side as the unit can be damaged trying to compress liquid versus gasses. Those in particular were not made to be in a moving vehicle. Says residential

Your guru buddy's theory is not correct, the Coleman Mach 8 AC low profile uses a Scroll compressor that lays on it's side, so I guess we should not buy this type of AC for our coach's.
Do what makes you happy.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #16 – August 28, 2015, 12:14:02 pm

Gee, mine was less than $1000 installed for everything and I got to keep the cherry panels from the old gas refrigerator. One might be hard pressed to find anyone who spent even $5k to just have a refrigerator installed.

We are happy with our choice. You should be happy with yours. I am not switching back. Roger

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #17 – August 28, 2015, 12:15:07 pm

Quote from: Tim Fiedler – August 28, 2015, 09:41:04 am

Hey guys just showing a picture not trying to start a religious debate! Bob's never going to change his mind and I'm never going to change mine so it is what it is. as Dave M says do what makes you happy.

Your 2000 has a quiet gen in a box does it not? Mine does not. Funny enough the noise inside is fairly low. Externally the low frequency noise is audible for a considerable distance in a quiet enviournment as is the diesel smell downwind.

Last gen I could not hear or especially smell was a 20k Martin turbo charged gen set on air feet inside of a sound insulated compartment on prevost busses.

We prefer seperated forest service campsites with probably no pedestal.

And prefer not to have to close the windows if we are downwind of a Diesel engine running.

And someone in a tent or small trailer or pop up downwind seems to be the norm.

Been dirt riders in the dez for more than 40 years and any noise mars the experience to us.

The three dollars an hour was factoring in periodic maintenance to the gen and assorted system parts.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #18 – August 28, 2015, 12:20:03 pm

Quote from: Roger and Susan in Home2 – August 28, 2015, 12:14:02 pm

Gee, mine was less than $1000 installed for everything and I got to keep the cherry panels from the old gas refrigerator. One might be hard pressed to find anyone who spent even $5k to just have a refrigerator installed.

We are happy with our choice. You should be happy with yours. I am not switching back. Roger

Did you upgrade your inverter and add extra or new batteries?

2812 magnum is $2k plus install. Four 8G8d's are 2,400 plus cabling and installation.

$2-3k worth of solar if you prefer no smells or noise camping.

Plus the refer and installation.

Plugged in to a pedestal every day makes for a different decision than the forest areas we prefer.

Probably the same reason we have not painted over the white gel coat.

Neighbor next to us at the beach yesterday in a painted four slide diplomat had the a/c on at 9 am because the coach heated up as the sun hit it quickly.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #19 – August 28, 2015, 12:34:20 pm

Quote from: Bill Willett – August 28, 2015, 11:38:40 am

Your guru buddy's theory is not correct, the Coleman Mach 8 AC low profile uses a Scroll compressor that lays on it's side, so I guess we should not buy this type of AC for our coach's.
Do what makes you happy.

Obviously engineered to be in a moving vehicle. The intake for the internal pump was probably designed to suck in gas not liquid in the Rv while moving.

Bill said he can hear the compressor piston making noises while braking as liquid enters it from the laid over compressors.

But he is a 30 year Rv cooling system engineer and was vogues design guy way back when.

The hat style compressors do not seem to have as much of an issue with the compressors piston trying to compress liquid he mentioned.

The larger capacity new refers are the ones he noticed the noises in. Space was made by laying over the compressor.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #20 – August 28, 2015, 01:18:31 pm

No need to upgrade inverter, no new batteries but the pulling of the stove after I had the fridge in was made easier and I had room for one more battery. Run my generator a couple hours in the morning after dry camping if I am moving anyway to prevent overtaxing the alternator. It is not made to recharge but to maintain. I paid about1800 dollars to have my fridge installed. I have no issue running a generator once a day for a bit or if I wanted solar then no real gen time. I had solar on my 99 and found where I stay has shade so it does not work out east as well.

No risk of fire and no issues. I pulled my coach out of the garage in the morning and the next morning at 10 am I started up the generator manually and got on the road. I can go over 24 hours without being plugged in with my residential. Oh and I bought my gel batteries for about 300 bucks each after core return. So three new batteries as they were aged out was 900 bucks.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #21 – August 28, 2015, 01:31:36 pm

When I looked into RV fridge fires a while back I came across a figure of 4,000 per year. If that's true then it's a serious problem. 40,000 over 10 years! Manufacturers should have fixed the problem not just patched it.

Keith

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #22 – August 28, 2015, 02:23:59 pm

Bob, I did not have to change inverters or add batteries. I did the install myself, sold the LP refrig, bought my Samsung for under $1K. Final out of pocket was closer to $850 all in.

I am glad your setup works fine for you. Others have different ideas and different needs. You have made you opinions known but most of us with residential refrigerators have actual experience that is quite different from what you and your guru friend think we should be experiencing.

Camp and use your coach the way you want to for your needs. Everyone else will do the same. And it may be different from what you do but not wrong.

Roger

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #23 – August 28, 2015, 03:52:43 pm

Quote from: Tom Lang – August 28, 2015, 10:00:02 am

Just curious, how many (modern) Firetravel coaches other than mine have had refrigerator fires? How many have had real damage result, damage other than to the refrigerator itself?

The reason I ask is that my fire caused no damage to the coach itself. My coach is a 2003 build, the refrigerator had a sheet metal plate directing the flame upwards, and unlike other RV's, the refrigerator was well away from flame resistant foam protecting the side wall rather than right next to luan and wood framing. The flame was intense and loud, very visible through the side vent. I was able to remove the vent cover and put the fire out, but it would have run out of hydrogen gas and gone out on it's own about that time. I was running on AC (auto select) at the time, not cooling very well.

After the fire, I compared my refrigerator compartment to other RVs in the campground. On mine, the flame was about three inches away from blue foam insulation. On others, that flame would have been 1/4 inch away from the luan inner sidewall and wood framing.

You can add my Foretravel to the list.
Thats the refrigerator laying on the sofa.

Re: Refrigerator Fire

Reply #24 – August 28, 2015, 04:31:12 pm

Quote from: Tim Fiedler – August 28, 2015, 09:46:18 am

Actually insurance companies will ensure anything.
And the propane fire risk is a factored into the rate based based on the loss history.

If it was a huge problem, we all would be asked by our insurance agent, "Do you have a propane refrigerator?" Kind of like homeowners insurance asks if you have a pool and/or a trampoline.

Anyway, the previous owner replaced my norcold about 3 years ago, so it's the updated design. It has a high temp sensor on the stack. It works great, no complaints. Quiet. Sure I have to defrost once in a while.

My RV isn't a house. I boondock and camp away from power quite a bit--often in the shade. I dont need huge amounts of food storage. For people that stay places where there is a power plug, a residential works fine. We all have different usage requirements. I like quiet. I easily can go 5-7 days without starting any engine....in the shade.

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