New member with a question on values of Foretravels

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New member with a question on values of Foretravels

September 18, 2015, 02:33:55 pm

The wife & I are in the market for a Motorcoach. We have heard a lot of good things about Foretravels & are looking for one to buy, But it seems that I have run across an issue with determining used Foretravel values.

Case in point. I found a dealer that has the following Foretravels:
1996 36' U295, $39,500. NADA at $17-20K
1997 36' U270, $39,500. NADA at $12-15K
1998 36' U270, $39,500. NADA at $17-20K
2000 36' U270, $53,500. NADA at $24-29K

Yet the 2001 40' U320 on the same site is priced at $84,500 has an NADA value at $119,000!!!! Something seems wrong with this.

I'm confused. How do I tell if a Foretravel is set at a fair price?

Re: New member with a question

Reply #1 – September 18, 2015, 03:10:56 pm

There are not many FOretravels on the market that are used and they sell for more then book as do Born Free coaches. So many of the older coaches have had so many upgrades that you have to allow for them. For instance, some have already had fuel lines replaced and many have been remodeled inside too. MOT is a good source for pricing ideas.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #2 – September 18, 2015, 03:55:17 pm

Too many variables, you have to take into consideration all that John just mentioned + mileage, upgrades inside & out, condition of all major components, & many other factors...some have doubled what they paid for their coaches (don't ask how I know this!) & are not done yet! So you can't really go by what 'the book' says, not in the case of Foretravels, they are all different, many custom built & modified. Check out Luxury Pre-Owned Motorhome Dealer for Foretravel Newell Country Coach. (as John has referred you to) for a good idea of what some current coaches are going for & a list of their upgrades. Good luck, you cannot go wrong with this brand....considered by many "in the know" to be the finest built motor coaches on the planet....

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #3 – September 18, 2015, 03:58:33 pm

I believe all of big dogs prices are from the MOT website?

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #4 – September 18, 2015, 04:08:41 pm

Yep, & those prices were just reduced very recently....the '99 by $10,000 & the 2000 by $11,000.....both look in fine condition....nice headlight upgrade on the newer one.... probably more upgrades but didn't take the time to read it all....am headed to Nac in Oct. (to MOT & FOT) & those 2 coaches are awfully tempting, just afraid I've got too much invested in this ol' girl to even sniff around at another one right now....still......

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #5 – September 18, 2015, 04:20:55 pm

NADA Values vs. Real World

Buying Process Improvement Discussion

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #6 – September 18, 2015, 04:23:25 pm

My brother Gordon (gkemper) on the Foreforum is licking his chops for the 1996 u295.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #7 – September 18, 2015, 04:24:33 pm

Shop a bit.

Usually coached at MOT are realistically priced

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #8 – September 18, 2015, 05:24:26 pm

I lurked here for a year and learned as much as I could. As a result I decided only a FT would do. I bought my coach at MOT in June. My experience there was fantastic. They are honorable, fair and it felt good to do business with a company run as well as that one. I dealt with Mel and Jason at MOT. If I am ever in the market again for another Foretravel I will be calling Mel without hesitation.

Spend lots of time here learning: Foretravel Motorhome technical help and information links

NADA is pretty useless when it comes to pricing these classic coaches. Spend some time here researching to figure out what to look for and look out for. If not for this forum I wouldn't own a Foretravel. The coach has exceeded all of my expectations. I am grateful to own it and wouldn't change a thing if I was doing it again.

The members here are incredibly knowledgeable, patient and generous with their time, especially so with Newbs like myself.

Happy hunting!

Jeff

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #9 – September 18, 2015, 05:26:00 pm

Howdy Bigdog, Here's a link to Elliot's great pricing schedule. I think it's pretty close and more real world. You may have to fill in a couple of dates.
Coach financing chatter (split from 1996 Foretravel U270 For Sale)
Good Luck, Dave A

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #10 – September 18, 2015, 06:22:44 pm

Quote from: Michelle – September 18, 2015, 04:20:55 pm

NADA Values vs. Real World

Buying Process Improvement Discussion

Thanks Michelle. Those links were interesting to read.

Yes these Foretravels were at MoT. I called MoT this morning and the salesman (Mel) said he gets calls nearly everyday concerning the very wonky pricing models at NADA. I could see that Mel was correct, But Mel had to put himself into the situation of telling a customer that, Yes it's double the book value. But it's worth it because the book is full of hooey. The poor guy is probably correct, But boy oh boy. Does that sound like the stereotypical used car salesman.

As I said. I'm sure Mel was on the up & up. As I priced out a 2000 Winnebago Ultimate 36'. It had an NADA value that was about 90% higher $43-52K than the 2000 Foretravel $24-29K at MoT

It just makes it very hard to do my due diligence to reassure not only me but my wife as well, that a seller is asking a fair price. Especially as we live in Walla Walla, Wa. Which means HUGE travel expenses to even go and poke my nose past the MH's door.

I may have to enlist the help of Miz Dani to poke around those coaches. And perhaps do a little very, very basic tire kicking for me. Hint, Hint

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #11 – September 18, 2015, 06:44:07 pm

How would that schedule account for a 42" TV, upgraded Inverter/converter, new floor, recovered couch and res. refer. just to name a few. I think the value is in the mind of the owner and the prospective buyer. If the prospective buyer has no value in the upgrades/replacements then the added value is not perceived and therefore not paid for. However those upgrades/replacements would probably help to move the coach faster. Just my thoughts.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #12 – September 18, 2015, 06:53:50 pm

Also keep in mind that we are still able to get parts & service on our coaches after 25+ years....can't say that about several other brands who've gone out of business over the years....so factory help is also always close at hand....a huge factor to consider.

bigdog, just now saw your note above, thanks, but am not qualified, relatively new to FT's myself....there are many on here much more able (as we've discussed in PM's) to help you with kicking tires, etc. but you've also got plenty more 'homework' to do before you get to that stage....

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #13 – September 18, 2015, 08:07:43 pm

The "x-factor" on buying a used coach is: "what paperwork is on-board, can you meet the previous owner(s) (POs) to get a handle on why they are selling her ?" In twenty-five years of owning an Airstream, I inspected prolly 50 coaches for others. Very few of them were "road ready". In other words, they were at the 80,000+ mark and had no service due at those miles: belts, hoses, etc. Easy to drop a few (o.k. LOTS) of money bringing her up to snuff. Finally, sit down and surf the net to see what era coach you're liking. You should get a handle on pricing, they will differ because of what I posted above. If you can find your choice where you can look her over, so much the better. When we retired the Airstream, I looked for our choice Foretravel all over the country, lucked out to find her in Phoenix, close to us. The fact that both the POs were no b.s. kind of guys and the paperwork and manuals were volumes convinced us this was our coach! We paid top dollar for her, no haggling (o.k., I tried), but got a beautiful coach I would not hesitate to go to Nova Scotia & back! Good luck, do your homework!

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #14 – September 18, 2015, 08:15:21 pm

Quote from: bigdog – September 18, 2015, 06:22:44 pm

I could see that Mel was correct, But Mel had to put himself into the situation of telling a customer that, Yes it's double the book value. But it's worth it because the book is full of hooey. The poor guy is probably correct, But boy oh boy. Does that sound like the stereotypical used car salesman.

As I said. I'm sure Mel was on the up & up.

Yup, he is (on the up & up). We have asked him questions on certain coaches and gotten straight answers. No typical salesman double-speak.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #15 – September 18, 2015, 09:19:33 pm

I found Mel to be the polar opposite of a stereotypical 'used car salesman'. I suggest that you spend some time learning about what these coaches are and how they are valued so you can take advantage of the knowledge that Mel would share with you.

You will find intrinsic value from upgrades and upkeep, not listed in a NADA guide. Every coach is as different as the owner(s) that owned them.

I assure you it will be worth the effort. You have already found the perfect place to learn.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #16 – September 18, 2015, 10:09:14 pm

Welcome, Bigdog. You are where we were a few years ago. As others have said, NADA is fine for high-volume vehicles, but lousy for low-volume ones. Try to find a NADA value for a Newell. I couldn't. The reason is that Newell only made coach #1500 this year, and they have been in business since the 60's. BTW, the same NADA question comes up on other low-volume brand-specific forums (Airstream, Bluebird, etc.).

Since you are kind of up in a corner of the country you will have to do a lot of your research online. Spend some time checking FOT, MOT, and PPL, as well as checking the classifieds on this forum. After a few months you will have a pretty good idea of what a Foretravel is really worth. When you get ready to purchase one, have Brett Wolf inspect it for you. Also let us know what you are looking at, because someone may well know the coach and can give you some inside information privately. Remember that an asking price is just that - an asking price. You may or may not want to pay that, and the seller may or may not be able to come down. Don't be afraid to offer what you think is a fair price. If the seller totally rejects your offer you can continue looking.

Our coach isn't really for sale, but recently someone asked me how much I wanted for it. I have him a reasonable (but on the high side) number. I didn't hear back from him. If he had, though, I wouldn't have come down much. On the other hand, if we were serious about selling it, I'd advertise it at the same figure, but I'd be willing to come down a bit more.

Keep researching and keep on asking questions. I haven't used this for a while, but when we were researching I asked a ton of questions. I kept saying that I'd rather ask a thousand questions before writing a large check than ask one question a thousand times after writing that large check. Enjoy the research and eventually the hunt.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #17 – September 18, 2015, 10:27:33 pm

1997-1999 you're looking at 25-50k range. I missed a nice u320 1999 that sold for 47k. I think a forum member here bought it. I know somebody got a nice 1998 u270 for 29k out the door.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #18 – September 18, 2015, 11:15:47 pm

Part of the search process is discovering what all of the different years and models have in common and what differences there are. Looking at an ad is one thing but going to see as many coaches in person will give you a sense of how owners have taken care of their coach and why one coach will have a different price than one of the same model and year. Care, condition and updates make a big difference. Pride of ownership shows. Milage and gen hours do too but with very good care 80,000 or 150,000 may not make much difference.

The bottom line is that a coach is worth what a knowledgable buyer will pay. If you make an offer based on what you have seen during your search and can explain what your offer is based on the seller will take your offer more seriously. At that point a resonable negotiation will take place and if successful you will buy the coach you want.

Most suggest that you buy your last coach first. That means buy what you will be happy with. Size, features, age, slides or not and floorplan. We studied and searched for almost four years. Five years after we bought our coach we are still learning. This forum is probably the best reason to buy any Foretravel. It is why you are here, right?

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #19 – September 18, 2015, 11:20:33 pm

I am new here and just bought a 1998 U320 for $55K yesterday, the seller's asking price. I shopped at both MOT and FOT looked at a dozen or so coaches. I luckily looked at RVtrader on Tuesday and found mine for sale, bought it on Thursday. The seller's Dad bought it new and sold it after a few years to the son. The coach was advertised as immaculate and looked like a 2-3 year old coach inside and out. All maintenance records dating to 1998 were provided as well as all records of repairs and updates. I believe that I paid $10k-20k below market value and look forward to many years of adventures in this coach.

I talked to Mel at MOT and believe he is a very reputable sales person. I did not get any of the typical salesman BS with him.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #20 – September 18, 2015, 11:35:44 pm

My buddy is a current Rv sales manager and sells used coaches.

I have mentioned this before that you need to add for every single thing in the book.

Long list of adds.

That's the way the banks want it to justify the loan amounts is what I understand.

Essex in particular.

Just the way it's done.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #21 – September 18, 2015, 11:42:49 pm

The best answer is they are worth whatever someone will pay. The book value typically is BS, based solely on nothing because they almost always sell for a price pretty far away from book value in one direction or another.

Some would say I got a steal of a deal on my 1995 U300 for less than most spend on one visit to NAC for basic maintenance. I think I overpaid given the overall condition, but it was solid and well cared for as far as interior and exterior, but when it came to mechanical/electrical systems, it is clear from the stack of invoices and the items I encountered that the previous owners had absolutely no clue what they were doing (and no money left to fix anything, defaulting 14 years into a 20 year loan)

pay the inflated MOT prices if you aren't handy and unable to fix or diagnose anything. They are going to sell you a working RV and do it ethically, at a premium price.

Buy a repo'd clunker sight unseen at an auction for next to nothing and spend the next year slowly fixing all the systems, cheaply, yourself and end up with an RV that cost less than anything around. This worked for me. I'm young, just barely into my 3rd decade on this planet, and able to either fix everything myself or find a cheap, competent shop to help me.

If I was older and had more money to spend, I would have purchased from MOT or another reputable dealer, or even from a fellow forum member. Lots of really good deals out there if you can deal with unknowns.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #22 – September 19, 2015, 12:03:44 am

A "fair price" is what you're concerned about? Well, NADA is not the place to find it, at least for Foretravels. Lots of good advice has been offered above; I'll just share what I learned.

If you want a Foretravel, and you're stuck on NADA values, you'll never get to buy one. Just offer NADA for a good one, and see what happens.

Markets are made of willing buyers and sellers. My humble advice is: look at some coaches ( Foretravels, and others); drive them, touch and feel them. When you find one that you love, decide what it's worth to you, and make an offer. You'll quickly know if you're in the market, or not.

All the best,
Chris

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #23 – September 19, 2015, 03:40:26 am

Quote from: car54 – September 18, 2015, 11:42:49 pm

The best answer is they are worth whatever someone will pay. The book value typically is BS, based solely on nothing because they almost always sell for a price pretty far away from book value in one direction or another.

Some would say I got a steal of a deal on my 1995 U300 for less than most spend on one visit to NAC for basic maintenance. I think I overpaid given the overall condition, but it was solid and well cared for as far as interior and exterior, but when it came to mechanical/electrical systems, it is clear from the stack of invoices and the items I encountered that the previous owners had absolutely no clue what they were doing (and no money left to fix anything, defaulting 14 years into a 20 year loan)

pay the inflated MOT prices if you aren't handy and unable to fix or diagnose anything. They are going to sell you a working RV and do it ethically, at a premium price.

Buy a repo'd clunker sight unseen at an auction for next to nothing and spend the next year slowly fixing all the systems, cheaply, yourself and end up with an RV that cost less than anything around. This worked for me. I'm young, just barely into my 3rd decade on this planet, and able to either fix everything myself or find a cheap, competent shop to help me.

If I was older and had more money to spend, I would have purchased from MOT or another reputable dealer, or even from a fellow forum member. Lots of really good deals out there if you can deal with unknowns.

I'm not sure that $39K is an overly inflated price for the coaches I was looking at on MoT's web page.

I was an electronics tech & repaired nuclear missiles in the Air Force, Built a few fast cars, Owned a trucking company and worked (when I could) on my Kenworth W900. I'm now retired and want to enjoy life and want to at least limit my time on my back under a chassis. I can fix things. But prefer to not make a full time job of it.

Re: New member with a question on values of Foretravels

Reply #24 – September 19, 2015, 03:52:22 am

BigDog,
Welcome to foreforum. My wife and I were up your way last July for a nephews wedding. We really love the Walla Walla area. The nephew works in the wine industry up there. Great wines!

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