Length of time looking for a coach

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Length of time looking for a coach

October 04, 2015, 11:10:30 am

I see many posts within a newb thread about how folks have looked and researced for many years before buying their coach. Of course the first thing my wife says is that if we don't take years to find our coach that it must mean we are doing something wrong. I think on a certain level this can have a newb passing up a nice coach because it "only" took 2 months. Yes research what makes a good coach, but if one is perhaps expecting the perfect used coach with zero faults and is priced below market. Then maybe it would take a life time of searching.

That is why I would like to hear of WHY it took folks 5-10 years of research to find a coach.

I know people that are like that with buying a home. Darn, the wall color is wrong, next house!!!

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #1 – October 04, 2015, 11:27:16 am

Doing mechanical inspections on coaches, I meet a lot of different buyers.

As you mention-- not sure it is different than house shopping.

Some start researching years before they plan to buy-- nothing wrong with having a dream and "dreaming".

Some, as you mention are very picky-- may be aesthetics, may be condition and previous "care and feeding". Dianne and I have personally turned down 2 coaches that we had agreed prices on when a complete inspection revealed structural issues. And, on one of these we had driven from Texas to S Florida to pick up the coach. An hours inspection and we headed back home.

The process is the same on boats-- some start dreaming years in advance. Others, particularly those who have previously owned can make the decision very quickly.

So, bottom line, there is no "here is the process". And, no reason there should be.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #2 – October 04, 2015, 12:21:13 pm

Why it took us (only) one year to find our coach:

1. It HAD to be a Foretravel.
2. It HAD to be a "non-smoker".
3. We desired a 40' coach.
4. We desired a particular floor plan (WTBI)
5. We did not want a slide.
6. I (the designated mechanic) wanted a Cummins engine.
7. We needed to stay below a certain price point.
8. We preferred certain interior and exterior colors.
9. We more highly valued a coach that had been well-maintained (with documentation).
10. It would be nice if we could find one within a reasonable driving distance from our home.

The more "picky" you are, the longer it will take to locate suitable candidates. We were lucky, and by being patient we satisfied every item on our want list. To make it even sweeter, the coach was sold to us by respected Forum members, and we made some new friends in the deal!

PS: We walked away from one seemingly ideal coach, after a Brett Wolfe PDI revealed serious structural and mechanical problems.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #3 – October 04, 2015, 12:27:55 pm

Brett describes the process well. Budgets vary from a few pennies on the dollar to list price for a new coach. DIY ability is a big factor as coaches age. But, as we have seen, even newer coaches can have major malfunctions. Traveling lifestyle makes a huge difference in coach choice.

We just wanted a big VW Vanagon for camping with just a larger fridge, shower and a little more room. Pristine cosmetic condition was low on the list with price, engine manufacturer and 36 foot length at the top.

The years have gone by but our coach, even with it's complexity, has been more trouble free than our fleet of Vanagons (still three in the driveway).

While some may quote a figure of at least $10K to get a used coach ready to go after buying, we budgeted ZERO. Other than fuel, oil, insurance and a few low dollar minor replacements, we have only had to add the extras we wanted for comfort and convenience.

PIerce

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #4 – October 04, 2015, 12:40:05 pm

How long it takes to find and buy a motorhome will depend on what YOU decide your requirements are!
A certain floor plan, certain colours, and cost, but do not care which manufacturer or fuel can be done in two or three months.

I was a professional engineer and approached my search for a motorhome like a project, a structured methodology with timelines, feasibility, requirements, objectives and definite final decision parameters. This, I admit, is referred to as "nerd" mentality - however, it worked for me.
Like Brett, after two years, I thought I had found my coach, had money in hand, hundreds of miles from my home base, but after fluid analysis and inspection, I rejected the coach because it did not meet all my final decision parameters. It took another five months before I decided to buy the coach I still have.

I spent thirty exhausting months in total, learned a great deal of important facts, but have owned, for 5.5 years, the last coach I will ever buy. This forum has been a very valuable resource, and met one of my basic requirements.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #5 – October 04, 2015, 12:42:30 pm

It took me about two weeks. Looked at a few, ran into a few problems, and ended up bidding/buying the one I have sight unseen.

NOT the last coach I will ever buy. Just a stepping stone. I'll probably end up with a Prevost.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #6 – October 04, 2015, 12:46:37 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – October 04, 2015, 11:27:16 am

Some start researching years before they plan to buy-- nothing wrong with having a dream and "dreaming".

That was the case for us.

ScubaGuy and I first started looking at coaches and doing research 4 years before we bought our coach. This time frame had everything to do with finances and setting our life up to be fulltimers. We always strive to be the most educated and learned on a particular subject (as much as we can be) before purchasing anything, so that is where all the research and looking came in. We would have bought much sooner if the timing would have allowed it.

Also, I think that once potential buyers do a *little* bit of research and narrow it down to exactly what they are looking for, the market of used Foretravels in that particular year, trim, etc. might not be available at that time, which is why more time passes until one pops up. I know for us, we actually ended up purchasing our coach 2 months before we *really* wanted to, but we knew that it was exactly what we wanted.

--Funny story--there were only 3 Foretravels in America for sale at that particular time that peaked our interest. The first one, we put an offer down and upon inspection, backed out of the contract, just like wolfe10 said they did. The 2nd coach was the one we purchased, and the 3rd coach was the one the Forewheelers scooped up online. It all works out.

I think the magic formula is:
you know what you want + you have the finances to do it + one is for sale you like = YOUR NEW COACH

*note: the formula doesn't state anything about a length of time; more about timing.*

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #7 – October 04, 2015, 12:47:10 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – October 04, 2015, 11:27:16 am

So, bottom line, there is no "here is the process". And, no reason there should be.

How true. When we decided to retire our diesel Airstream after twenty-five years of stellar service, I looked at Foretravels all over the country (including this forum) to get a grip om a coach that I knew virtually nothing about, except I liked them! I had an idea after searching what coaches were worth in our price range and was lucky to find a coach close to us. As I've said before, the fact that she had two previous owners who paid attention to detail and provided files the size of a New York phone book, sold us. Other than a quick walk-thru (which confused me after 10 minutes), we drove her out. Zero regrets, both POs have been super helpfull in answering the many questions I had getting used a fresh coach. I paid a little more, but it was (and is) totally worth it!

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #8 – October 04, 2015, 01:07:42 pm

In our case: Saw it on Tuesday, bought it on Friday. (See, God does look out for idiots!!)
Pros:
1. Had the layout we desired.
2. Had the door by the kitchen.
3. Had leveling jacks.
4. Only 36' long.
5. Lots of documentation.
6. Condition was exceptional for the age.
7. Price was reasonable.
8. Fell in love with paint scheme, interior wood, and body shape. (didn't look like any other coach we had seen, and we do like individuality)

Cons:
1. Didn't know of any until getting on this forum and learning what people thought of the "Fuel Pincher" engine.

Total cost for repairs the first year? $5.65 for one circuit breaker for the block heater. $50 for emergency road service at FOT to replace a valve stem. About $10 for a thermocouple for the water heater (at FOT)

All that for $65.50 to travel over 4,500 miles and have such a great experience and so many comments on how beautiful our coach was.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #9 – October 04, 2015, 01:30:02 pm

Quote from: car54 – October 04, 2015, 12:42:30 pm

It took me about two weeks. Looked at a few, ran into a few problems, and ended up bidding/buying the one I have sight unseen.

NOT the last coach I will ever buy. Just a stepping stone. I'll probably end up with a Prevost.

Other than a H-3 I wouldn't myself. Metal body was not made to be lived in. HVAC cannot be turned off.

Very low to the ground. Made for the super slab. Round top of body loses storage.

Glued on skins have delamed on owners if painted and in hot climes.

H-3 is a different idea but the 18" drop in front seperates the driver and passenger from the rest of the coach IMO

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #10 – October 04, 2015, 01:50:53 pm

We decided we wanted a motorhome. Looked at an Airstream -- that was what was being sold in our town. Hemmed and hawed about it. A friend told us about seeing a Fore -something at a motorcycle rally and it was really nice. The next week, another friend gave me a copy of an FMCA magazine. It had a Foretravel ad and there was a dealer just north of us. We decided we'd go look. Wow, they were sweet! But expensive! But a month later, we bought it anyhow -- a used '96 for 3 times what we had budgeted. No research, no nothing; just dumb luck

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #11 – October 04, 2015, 02:11:08 pm

We decided to go full-time Mid November in Destin, Florida a few years back. In Destin we were sitting next to a 2001 FT. Had never heard of them nor seen one. Stopped at every major and some minor RV lots between there and Las Cruces, NM where we happened upon our Ol' Girl and bought her from a widow lady in early December. The following March we had sold everything we owned in the Seattle area except enough stuff to cram into a 4' x 6' Uhaul and started our adventure. Almost 3 years later we are happy about what we did, how we did it and what we are blessed to be living in. (Wish we had gotten another 50K for the house - sold the Duramax and the BMW too cheap - but..... )

1. Had to be in budget - blew that one.
2. Had to have at least one slide - got 2.
3. Wanted a private toilet - got that one.
4. Wanted 450 HP, retarder and Aquahot - got that one. Of course didn't really know what a retarder was or what to do with it.
5. Wanted colors we could live with both inside and out - this worked out too.

We have put a fair amount of $$$ in our Ol' Girl - new tires, new floor, new inverter converter, new salon TV, reupholstered couch, new kitchen faucet and new re. refer, new 8d batteries, rebuilt air dryer and some other stuff I do not recall at the moment.

I think that the time it takes to find your coach is relative to your need. We had a need and we found our coach. Was another one out there that would have been better for us? - Maybe.

We were fortunate enough to have been able to do what we wanted when we wanted. Spent a little too much here and there but here we are.

As many have said - This FoFum is full of wonderful giving people. We could not be doing what we are doing with out their support. We knew very little about DP when we started. Had a couple of TT and didn't know much about them either. This is a complicated piece of machinery and is quite overwhelming when looking at it in aggregate but when broken down into individual components it becomes manageable. We do most of our own repairs,replacements and upgrades.

Take your time if you have it and you will find the right one for you. Or push the edge of the envelope and let 'er rip. We decided to let 'er rip.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #12 – October 04, 2015, 02:24:02 pm

One day. How many 97-99 u320 WTBI mid doors were we going to find? The odds were it needed everything. Which was disclosed prior to our purchase.

Not for the faint of wallet. Just have to have a want. And a need. And the knowledge of what's needed which is available here and local service guys to help do it.

Way cheaper than a later model inferior SOB IMO.

So far we have touched nothing for beauty. Only mechanical.

Long list of things fixed so WE can get another 10-15 years of good out of "moby".

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #13 – October 04, 2015, 02:34:10 pm

We had owned and camped in every type of camp device except a pop-up tent trailer. Years of backpacking, sailboat cruising, tenting, travel trailering, pickup-campering (is that a word?), 5th wheeling and even a small Class A (the infamous VW Le Sharo). Sue's parents had owned many RVs from campers to Class A motor homes while she was growing up. So we were not naive when we decided that a diesel pusher might give us the retirement lifestyle closest to the lifestyle we had when we were sailboat cruising. We had also considered a mountain cabin but even in 2011 climate conditions with associated severe storms and unpredictable wildfires were looming. With an RV we had mobility that we would not get with a cabin. But we probably would not get any investment appreciation.

I had seen Foretravels; just not that many. And talked to the owners; all of whom seemed ecstatic about their rig. I liked the looks and the build quality seemed pretty good so we began to check craigslist and look at the few that showed up.

It was a bad time to sell any motor home but, conversely, a good time to buy one. The market was at its lowest. Just a few years before we bought our motor home the Previous Owner had paid almost $40,000 for it. We watched its price on craigslist go from $30,000 down to less than $20,000 before we called and drive the 200 miles to look at it. (We might get some appreciation, after all.)

Our requirements were pretty few. Cummins engine. Unihome. No slides. Reasonable shape. I liked the U225 for its relative simplicity. We drove home and then made them an offer. They countered. We bought it. We drove over in a sedan towing a dolly and came back towing the sedan on the dolly.

At the time I really did not appreciate the true value of the Banks system on the Cummins 5.9. Neither did the buyer, I think, because he never gave it a mention. Nor the Pacbrake. I find this inexplicable now; knowing just how high this should have been on my want list (although unlikely to find them... the combination on a U225 must be very rare and boosts performance considerably).

We were not picky about floor plan. After you've lived 5 years ocean cruising on a 32-foot sailboat your ability to adapt to changing conditions is well tested. Sue wanted a walk-around bed after making beds while kneeling on them. I wanted a nice place to sit down and read or watch TV. All the rest was a bonus.

It took us six months and 4 or 5 Foretravels.

We didn't "budget" anything for replacements but we've probably spent $2,000. We've put about 10,000 miles on the coach with mostly short camping trips, family visits of 300 miles each way, and one big 2,000 mile round trip.

I think far too many people pick motor homes based non-critical details. Bathroom (it has a shower, a sink and a toilet; what more do you need?). Bedroom size (we only sleep in there... how much room do you need?). Or easily changed details: Upholstery. Rug color. However, I admit that it is far more complicated to change wall colors, appliances, and furniture in a motor home than it is in a lake cabin so cabinetry in a wood you hate (pecan, maple, walnut, or whatever) is going to be hard to change.

My personal criteria included access to the engine area (high priority; and a bedroom slide can preclude this), proven engine/transmission, driver's seat arrangement, visibility and comfort. All Grand Grand Villas have these (although the tambour doors get iffy after about 1994).

Right now I would give priority to a coach with 1kw of solar, larger black/gray/fresh water tankage (or working composting toilet), diesel generator, residential refrigerator, 3kw pure-sine inverter. Awnings over all windows (although power awnings might be a deal breaker). No slides (almost inevitably condemns you to pre-1998 motor homes (if "condemn" is the right word). UBDII systems access.

But I would be realistic enough to know that things I can change are not deal breakers. I can't change basement storage but I can add solar panels. I can't wall (wood) color but I can change the upholstery colors (or add covers) and even change recliners. The bedroom size is fixed but the rug isn't. It pays not to focus on details that you can change. But it also pays to be able to work on the engine; this may not be important in a cabin getaway but it can be very important on the road; even if you don't do it yourself.

Craig

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #14 – October 04, 2015, 02:37:16 pm

Took us about a month. Kind of a weird story, but was bought online and delivered to the farm. Sight unseen. We looked at ft about two weeks before and when this one came to see us we still couldn't spell foretravel. Over the years, I've been more disappointed in new stuff that needs fixin than used stuff that usually just needs loving care. There is a saying on the farm, all it takes to repair something is patience, duct tape and baling wire. Probably not true, but sounds good. I also think it may be a leap of faith, timing, and an alignment of the stars.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #15 – October 04, 2015, 02:55:34 pm

A couple of hours. We decided to get a FT on the way back to Livingston, TX from our summer walk about in the Lazy Daze. Got on the net and found our coach on this forum. I wanted a 270, 36', single slide. It was in Maine, we were in Nac, so went to Livingston, called Dean a few times, and got tickets to Maine. Bought the coach after a couple of days and headed south in front of their first winter storm. That was Nov last year. Since then we have been border to border and coast to coast, haven't any regrets.

You think that was Quick ? Married my first wife after being around her about 3 weeks...I was in Calif.,she was in Neb...

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #16 – October 04, 2015, 03:50:05 pm

Took us about a day. Gary Omel showed me his coach (15 min) while he was hooking up in FL just after New Years 2013. On the way home to OH from FL, our Ford truck blew up and we decided it was time to move from the 5th-wheel to a motorhome. Got on the forum and started doing some reading. Found our future coach listed in the classifieds. Two weeks later, flew to Portland OR, looked her over and made a deal. I figured, "I've been RVing with a 5th-wheel for 15 years, I can checkout the coach." Got lucky and got a good coach inspite of my ignorance (even after reading almost the whole forum). Flew back 4 weeks later to pick her up and drive home. Had to go all the way south to AZ/NM to avoid the blizzards on the drive home. We expect she will be our first and last coach and continue to upgrade and improve it. We've driven almost 40K miles since we bought her (FL to AK and CA to Newfoundland) and hope for a lot more.

Rich

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #17 – October 04, 2015, 03:53:37 pm

Like Brett says, there is no correct process. We did homework for several years, tried to learn all we could, went through the almost buying process on a U270, it had sat for almost two years and the owner wanted too much. Then we rethought things and adjusted towards a 2001, 36' U320. We saw a couple of those, one in pretty tough shape. And then we found it in CA. It took about three months back and forth with the owner, he started high. And then he adjusted the price and agreed to replace house batteries. An offer, an acceptance, an inspection, he fixed the major things (not many), we flew out inspected it, money changed hands and we though what have we done? Never thought that again.

Never did look...

Reply #18 – October 04, 2015, 04:40:12 pm

Was not looking for an RV at all let alone a Foretravel...

In-laws were in town for the month of December and they were talking about renting an RV and touring the East coast of Canada and the US. I suggested that they buy then sell after as it gave a ton more options, like parking the beast in storage and completing the trip in Spring/Fall etc. I was suggesting a Roadtrek, Chinook or the like and my FIL says that he had always wanted to drive a big diesel bus style RV. I mentioned that a good friend of mine had one and would probably take us for a ride if we wanted. We arranged a ride (without realizing his coach was for sale) which ended up being a test drive... Before we were done our 10 mile loop we had agreed to a deal. (A 1999 36' U320). This was December, our adopted son joined our lives in Feb and our daughter was born in December. The Foretravel sat for almost a year being utilized as a guest quarters as the house is now full. I run it down the road once a month to excercise the systems. Its kept fueled and watered to act as our "Prepper Shelter" in case we have a disaster scale event here in Portland. We take weekend type trips to the coast and did an 8 day family trip this summer... We will use it more and more as time goes on as I am setting it up as a family weekender to suit our needs.

The key to our buying experience was 100% trust in the previous owner. I did not need to know anything other than that I trusted the sellers word. Almost three years later I realize the coach and deal were better than we thought at the time! That experience is going to be nearly impossible for most to duplicate but if I was looking the first thing would be to let everybody here know what it was that would fit the bill and be ready with funds if somebody was wanting to sell. Word of mouth is always the best way to buy something like this.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #19 – October 04, 2015, 05:05:55 pm

We weren't looking when we bought ours. We studied up for a year figuring out what we wanted. Our coach was listed for sale on consignment at MOT.

A kind member here posted it and I pounced, making a deposit via credit card pending inspection. Fortunately Brett W. was in town and available. I flew down the following week with a friend and met Brett and his lovely wife. I had never seen or driven a Foretravel until the inspection. A few items popped up on the inspection and MOT fixed everything. I also had them do a full service on the motor and generator, all new filters, air dryer rebuild and coolant flush and change.

The first time I drove a motorhome was to bring it back to North Carolina.

I will always be grateful to this forum, the amazing experience at MOT and to Brett W. for helping us make a long term goal a reality.

We love our motorhome and our appreciation for what we have grows each time we use it. It may be our last coach, time will tell. If we end up going mostly full time we may consider a 320 with a slide for the extra room and the season extension that an Aquahot provides.

My opinion is that if you found this forum, you are heading in the right direction. Good hunting!

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #20 – October 04, 2015, 06:40:03 pm

I had to think about whether I wanted to post this and be thought the "village idiot" or not. We have owned two diesel pushers and I bought both of them sight unseen off of Ebay. After owning a travel trailer, we decided to make the jump to a DP and after researching different makes I decided I wanted a Barth. Found one on Ebay in Arizona and bought it. It was a 1993 32ft Barth Regency. The year was 2007 and at that time the "book value" of the coach was about $55,000. I paid just over $26,000 with the knowledge that there would be work required and I wanted to have it painted, but a $5,000 paint job not a $30,000 paint job. Flew to Arizona and drove it back to Georgia. For the next seven years I was constantly updating and improving the coach. We thoroughly enjoyed the coach and took one trip that last about 3 months, 8,000 miles, and 34 states.

Last year I decided I wanted a larger coach and it had to be a Foretravel or Bluebird. I found a 1999 40ft U295 on Ebay located in Alabama. Now for a VERY significant detail. The coach was a bank repossession!!!! Who knows what the previous owner may have done to the coach. At that time, both MOT and FOT had 99 40ft coaches listed for sale. Both at the same price. $79,900. I bought the coach on Ebay for $32,000. Now I might not be too smart but I figured that gave me an awful lot of room to repair anything including an engine. I mean we're talking $48,000 here. So far we have had no significant problem with any of the systems on the coach. I'm still as busy as ever updating and improving the coach but then again that is what I enjoy.

Maybe not for the faint of heart!!

Nick

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #21 – October 04, 2015, 07:51:47 pm

Good for you, Nick. Some times you just have to jump in to the deep end and hope for the best.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #22 – October 04, 2015, 08:53:57 pm

I bought ours at a yardsale.

I had known the PO since I was a child. The husband passed seven years ago and a few years after that she closed down the business. I knew she had been selling stuff off and when she had the auction the auctioneer told her she would be lucky to get much of anything because the motorhome was too old to get a mortgage. I knew I needed enough room for two adults one child and a dog but didn't have the budget for a pusher. Without looking I told a mutual friend if she ever got to a certain dollar amount let me know. Honestly I never thought it would get there and I had two years or so before I was really worried about bringing the whole family to the races. I got a call on a Wednesday a couple months later she was in the price range Becky got to see it and we decided we would wait and keep saving hoping it would be there in a year. On the Saturday after running numbers at the bank we bought it at the yard sale the PO was having and she started putting everything that had been taken out of the motorhome to sell back into the cupboards. She is happy we bought it and that it will be appreciated and taken care of.

I had no idea what a Foretravel was just that I knew it was very well taken care of and didn't have to worry about issues being hidden.

every one I see listed here makes me a little guilty about how low of a price I paid.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #23 – October 04, 2015, 11:27:35 pm

Thanks for all the interesting answers. I think it really helps us newb's to have a clearer idea. I guess in my head (mostly empty at times) I would probably break down the time to research what coach I wanted, then the time to actually locate the coach that the research lead me to as two separate entities.

I will continue my thoughts over on my "off to Canada" thread.

Re: Length of time looking for a coach

Reply #24 – October 05, 2015, 04:48:36 pm

We started out researching about full-timing, then moved to what sort of coach (MH, 5'er, TT). Researched several brands in each category. Eventually decided that a MH suited our needs and wants. That much took between 2 and 3 years. Since we were going to buy used, and at a fairly low price point, we had a couple of brands on our short list. When the time came to actually search for a coach to buy we went to look at the closest one. On the way home Jo Ann said "I'm unhappy." I asked why. She said "I didn't want to like it, and I love it." We talked for a couple of days, and then called the sellers. We explained that we couldn't meet their asking price, but would like to make an offer. They hesitated for maybe two seconds before accepting our offer. That's how we ended up with our Foretravel. We were prepared to spend a year looking if necessary.

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