6V92TA oil pan heater

Topic: 6V92TA oil pan heater (Read 1489 times) previous topic - next topic

6V92TA oil pan heater

October 17, 2015, 06:26:52 pm

If you were considering a self adhesive oil pan heater for your 6V92TA you should reconsider. The problem is the oil pan doesn't have any flat places large enough to stick the heat pads on. I bought one that's separated into two small pads so I can put one on either side of the oil pan. If there's even the slightest curve to the oil pan the adhesive won't stick. When I turned on the heater it started melting and smoking after a few seconds in the spot where the curve is in the pan. A magnetic heater would probably work better but I'm not sure it would stay on when I hit a bump driving down the road, so I might have to remove the heater every time before I drive away. That doesn't sound like a reasonable solution because I know I'd forget to remove it at some point. The 6V92TA has a metal oil pan. The threaded drain plug in the oil pan is supposedly 1/2" NPT (pipe thread) and the best solution would be to install a plug heater in there. I'm not sure how much clearance there is inside the oil pan or how much oil I'll lose as I'm installing the plug heater. I'll probably order the shortest possible plug heater and wait for a really cold morning when the oil is thick and slow flowing to install it. My oil is very clean currently so that will cut down on the mess. I don't think a dipstick heater would be a good solution because the dipstick is really long on my coach. I'm not interested in heating the water jacket except as a last resort if I can't get any type of oil pan heater to work. I only want to heat the oil. That's been discussed endlessly and I don't want to get into that again. I just wanted to warn anyone with intentions of installing an adhesive oil pan heater that it probably won't work, even if you order the heater with two small pads for the sides of the oil pan.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #1 – October 19, 2015, 12:25:13 am

@Scott I'd be very worried about baffling in the oil pan preventing you from inserting a heater via the drain plug plus it would be a hassle everytime you change oil.

I have a magnetic oil pan heater. I've never used it. The shape of the oil pan would make it very difficult to attach plus it's only 250watts. Only the magnetics touch the pan and there is about a 1/4" to 3/8" gap between the heater and the oil pan. It just doesn't look like it would transfer very much heat. It will probably be showing up on ebay very soon.

Let me know if you're interested.

I know you say you are not interested in water-jacket heating but....that seems to be the best solution I've seen so far. @JohnFitz has already gone down that path and come up with a great solution.

Alternate Block Heater on 6V92 Detroits

You can buy one on ebay for $39.99.

Genuine Kim Glo Hotstart Block Heater V71 Series Detroit Diesel DDV 151B New...

I've purchased one but haven't installed it yet. It's on my project list.

If you do proceed with the oil plug heater let us know how it goes. I can see using both if I ever decide to pull my skis out of storage.

PS Thanks for letting us know the issues you had with the stick-on heater.

see ya
ken

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #2 – October 20, 2015, 12:33:10 am

I haven't completely given up on the adhesive oil pan heater yet. I've been thinking about it a lot and I'll probably try injecting JB Weld into the area where the curve is to fill up the air gap. If that doesn't work I may try to move the pad that started melting to another location on the oil pan. I only let the heater run a few seconds and it doesn't appear to be damaged... yet! haha... Hey I paid $115 for this thing and I don't want to give up without a fight!

...Still, I wouldn't advise anyone else to do this because it's likely to fail.

The engine can't crank fast enough to start with cold, thick oil in the pan. Heating the water jacket won't heat the oil in the pan. That's why I'm not interested in heating the water jacket. It's been discussed on here several times before. Everyone thinks I'm completely wrong and I'm okay with that. I just wanted to write about what not to do, which obviously includes buying an adhesive pad heater that sticks on the oil pan. I didn't want to get into a discussion of how stoopid I am for wanting to heat only the oil in the pan, or for only wanting a two cycle engine that runs on straight 40 weight oil that's so thick the engine can't crank it in cold weather. I like being different.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #3 – October 20, 2015, 01:28:49 pm

Scott,
What temp are you expecting that requires oil heating ?

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #4 – October 20, 2015, 01:42:09 pm

I'm thinking you want to heat the mechanical parts of the engine that need to move (pistons, valves, crankshaft, bearings, etc). The oil pump doesn't begin pumping oil of any quantity until the engine is running.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #5 – October 20, 2015, 01:44:31 pm

I would expect to require heat for a straight 40 weight at any temp below 20 degrees or so. The oil pump starts pumping as soon as you crank and will slow down cranking enough at low temps that you wont be able to start.

A block heater would help, i had an 8v92 twin turbo airstart unit for starting jets and we installed a gear driven oil pump that circulated oil from the sump into a T fitted where the oil pressure sender was. It pumped oil anytime the water jacket heater was on and with oil flowing thru the heads and turbo, everything was lubed, oil and water got heated to 120F and ready to run at full output 24/7 during the winter. At engine temps below 120 it automatically locked itself out and restricted operation to idle. It could take 30 minutes to warm up in the winter if it would even start at all, usually it would melt battery posts trying to crank in the cold.

Well worth the investment in heating equipment for that application, a 30 minute delayed flight is expensive.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #6 – October 20, 2015, 01:50:45 pm

Yes, if the warm oil is externally pumped, that is a great way to get the mechanical parts of the engine warmed up.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #7 – October 20, 2015, 01:53:01 pm

Pumping of the oil was more to transfer heat from the water jacket heater to the oil. The sump will never get warm as the jacket is higher and as we all know, heat rises.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #8 – October 20, 2015, 02:13:18 pm

Sure, actually I was referring to the original idea of heating just the oil pan.

But, heat in any location will definitely help these big engines.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #9 – October 20, 2015, 06:50:30 pm

My engine wouldn't start last winter at 18 degrees with the 1000 watt water jacket heater running full time and three 8D batteries cranking. I put a small electric heater under the oil pan for an hour or so and it cranked right up immediately. Heating the water jacket doesn't heat the oil in the pan. I just want to heat the oil in the pan so the engine will crank fast enough to start. I think a 250 watt oil pan heater would probably be enough, but I installed a 500 watt heater, which is really two 250 watt pads with one located on either side of the oil pan. Again, don't waste your time and money ordering one of these because it probably won't work. Unfortunately I already wasted $115 on one and I'm gonna try everything I can think of to get it to work. I'll let you know if / how I get it working.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #10 – October 20, 2015, 09:58:33 pm

if pride and determination are steering the ship you could pull the oil pan and weld enough flat surface onto it for the blanket. That would also mean an increase in oil capacity which doesn't totally hurt either. Or you could weld a extra bung into the pan for a heater element.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #11 – October 20, 2015, 10:03:18 pm

Do not most engines use a block heater? The combustion chamber needs to be hot enough to ignite diesel.

Used to ski a lot and 60 second crank times were not unheard of.

As far as I am aware of all Foretravels diesels came with ether start which worked great.

My m11 has an ether start port built into the side of the engine. Only works below 50 degrees

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #12 – October 20, 2015, 10:15:45 pm

The either start can be dangerous. I have seen more that a few of them stick on injecting the whole can into the engine.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #13 – October 20, 2015, 11:22:38 pm

While JB Weld supposedly transfers heat reasonably well, Arctic Silver Thermal Adhesive is supposed to be better.

Would a water pipe heat cable work? It could be wrapped around the oil pan multiple times. You could use JB Weld to glue brackets to the pan to hold it in place.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #14 – October 20, 2015, 11:24:56 pm

It's very hard on the engine to crank it with cold thick oil. Heating the water jacket or injecting ether won't do anything to help thin the oil... Again, I only want to heat the oil in the pan. I've thought about this a lot over the past three years and I'm sure this is what I want to do. I realize everyone disagrees with me and I'm okay with that. My goal here was only to warn anyone thinking of buying a self adhesive oil pan heater to reconsider because it probably won't work.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #15 – October 20, 2015, 11:28:19 pm

Hmmm, I actually have some Arctic Silver thermal adhesive with me, but it's several years old and it's in a tiny tube so I don't know if there's enough of it to fill the gap. It's always been kept refrigerated so maybe it's still good? I suppose that's another option I could consider.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #16 – October 20, 2015, 11:57:37 pm

Can you post a picture of your pan so I have a better idea of what youre trying to stick on and where? I havent seen a 6v oil pan in awhile. Ive got a few ideas...

What brand/model heaters did you try?

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #17 – October 21, 2015, 04:19:41 am

If your DDC 2 stroke is n good tune, has good compression, you can start it a couple ways, simplest is to crank 5 seconds, wait 5 seconds and repeat. Aby the third cycle it will start at 15f. F course you need a good starter & good battery setup.
I used a water jacket heater, at -5f with heater on for 1 hour, 50 wt oil, my 600 hp 8V-92 started like a summer day. Being a DDC lover, I kept my toys up to snuff, no leaks, no spun rear mains, why the 50 wt.
We do use oil heaters on all generators along with block haters when located in areas where temps drop below 20f Normal use thermostat on block/water jacket heater, on @ 80f off @ 100f.
Of course you need to do the happy thing.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #18 – October 21, 2015, 10:19:37 am

Dave,

I read your posts with great respect as I figure you probably know more than the rest of us combined. Lot of Walter Mittys out there but few have actually turned the wrenches.

Lets keep this a happy group.

Pierce

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #19 – October 21, 2015, 11:56:26 am

Your intent to heat the oil makes lots of sense.Stone cold oil will take a whole lot of heat out of a warm block. And yes they do spin a lot easier with warm oil, on big trucks that wont go I point a salamander heater at the oil pan and away we go. I am lucky to have access to several excellent tig welders so altering the pan doesn't cause me a lot of concern but it really isn't for everybody. How is the blanket constructed could you possibly cut it and fit it?

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #20 – October 21, 2015, 01:14:21 pm

Dave, with 4700+ posts, you have my respect.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #21 – October 21, 2015, 04:32:36 pm

Actually it might be more effective to delete the offending poster entirely than just their posts.
BTW, a poster can delete their own post, as trolls have been known to do to create controversy.
Also, if you initiate a thread, and later delete your original post (say if you find some posts in a thread offensive) by deleting the original post that you "own" as the original poster, all posts associated with that original post will disappear. So anyone can in fact (and often do) take actions that cause post deletion that are not related to the Moderators.
Please do not feed the pigeons, bears or especially the Trolls

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #22 – October 21, 2015, 04:45:33 pm

Guys just keep it on topic and it will get better.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #23 – October 21, 2015, 07:42:31 pm

I guess I musta missed something? I don't check this very often. I'm not offended and I didn't delete anything but I'm not interested in heating the water. I've heard all the arguments for heating the water, thought about each of them carefully with an open mind, and decided to heat the oil in the pan instead. I'm okay with every person on this forum disagreeing with me. I only started this thread to warn others to reconsider if they were about to buy a self adhesive oil pan heater. I spent $115 on mine and I'm not gonna give it up without a fight, but I advise others to avoid it.

Toby, the heating pad specifically says not to cut it. I presume it would cause an open circuit and render the pad useless. It still works at this point so I'm gonna mess with it some more... but it's pouring rain currently here at Bandelier NM.

Re: 6V92TA oil pan heater

Reply #24 – October 21, 2015, 08:12:14 pm

Quote from: its toby – October 20, 2015, 10:15:45 pm

The either start can be dangerous. I have seen more that a few of them stick on injecting the whole can into the engine.

Good info. Never seen or heard of an Oshkosh or Foretravel ether issue myself but anything is possible.

Need to check mine out as I really prefer backups to the backups in rving.

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