now power steering problem

Topic: now power steering problem (Read 1131 times) previous topic - next topic

now power steering problem

November 10, 2015, 03:59:11 pm

Now stranded on Hwy 98 about 30 miles south of Tallahassi Florida with a big leak of oil from top (looks like) of box. The flange that the steering shaft is attached too coming out of box.
OK experts who have been there. What do I need to do to get this thing off the coach as it sure looks a small area. Pulling the gen set out on slide does not seem to give much room but can be done. Does not look like a hose problem but right now again have lost the oil. I have a supposed older Diesel guy coming in morning to see if he can/wants to help. Sure getting fed up with all these issues but life has to go on. we are in an older RV park off hwy so that is good but not sure of we need to get towed into Talla" to get this fixed. If I can get it out then will go from there. ANY ideas on which way to attack this??
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #1 – November 10, 2015, 04:09:32 pm

Searching the forum for Sheppard remove brought up these as a place to start till others chime in

Sheppard Power Steering Gear Box Rebuild/Maintenance

Steering box

steering gear box

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #2 – November 10, 2015, 05:06:09 pm

Thx Michelle, just read Lon and Cheryl's account and we will see what comes of the AM when the "mechanic" is supposed to get here. I think I can get the area all cleared out ready to remove the piman arm and hyd hoses so unit can be removed.
Funny a few hours before this happened we were wondering were to head to spend some time, so I guess it is here and the other campers are all HUNTERS and to Ruth who is an animal lover that is the worst situation for her to be in listening to all the guns going off. They even have a "skinning rack " by us and that is really upsetting her.
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #3 – November 10, 2015, 05:12:05 pm

John, if it is the top seal, it can be a roadside repair without having to dismantle much at all.

It sounds like the top seal may have failed. You can detach the steering column from the dash, pull the pinch bolt on the u-joint at the top of the steering gear, then remove a plate on the top of the steering gear. The seal is in that plate. It can be replaced, and then everything is put back together. The seals are probably available at a Kenworth repair facility. You can call Sheppard's Field Service Representative at the factory. I talked to him when the top seal failed on our coach. He was very helpful.

If that seal failed quickly and totally, be sure to check the setting of the pressure relief plungers.

Your problem may be something else, but the description is similar to our failure. You may call me at 713-419-0313 if you want more information on my experience.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #4 – November 10, 2015, 05:14:25 pm

Quote from: John Haygarth – November 10, 2015, 05:06:09 pm

... I think I can get the area all cleared out ready to remove the piman arm and hyd hoses so unit can be removed.
...
JohnH

John, if the problem is strictly with the top seal or the plate into which the top seal is mounted, the box does NOT have to come out.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #5 – November 10, 2015, 06:23:05 pm

PM sent.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #6 – November 10, 2015, 07:32:43 pm

JD, it deffinitly is the top plate seal as I watched the oil pour out with engine running. There are no leaks at hoses or side seals that I can see.I will call you as well as Lon who also has given me their #
Thanks
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #7 – November 11, 2015, 03:41:49 am

John, I hope I was able to help with our conversation. I was a bit distracted because I was at work when we talked, If you call back Wed. I will be home till late afternoon.

I would call REDHEAD steering in Washington State ( 1-800-808-1148). Even if you don't use them for repair they will be more than helpful in giving you advice. One of the few places that really are willing to go out of there way to help without having to drop money into there pocket.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #8 – November 11, 2015, 11:16:04 am

update after a semi sleepless night.
The mechanic I called came out and between us we got that top plate off and the seals look ok but after talking to a Sheppard rep mike- he said this is a common failure and 15 yrs is pretty good service. He gave me the seal part # 5544861 and said any half decent truck place should have them in stock !!!
We will now take a trip to Talahassi and see if any are open today and if not will go back in morning.'
Looks like we should be ok in a few days, so now try to get parts. This seal kit is just for the top plate and does not include all the others. Feeling more positive and this park is friendly.
Thanks Lon and JD for your phone help. It makes a big difference if you know what has to be done.
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #9 – November 11, 2015, 11:25:35 am

Quote from: John Haygarth – November 10, 2015, 05:06:09 pm

Funny a few hours before this happened we were wondering were to head to spend some time, so I guess it is here and the other campers are all HUNTERS

John,
see if any of those "hunters" have a rabbits' foot that you could have for good luck!!

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #10 – November 11, 2015, 05:02:50 pm

update 2---
We we drove to Tallahasee to see if a truck place was open and did we luck out, not only open but the seals in stock $25 for top ones. Got some oil as well and asked the service head if they would be good enough to pull out old and place new ones in for me as I was stuck on the roadside!!! Well they not only did that but "no charge" and would not take some Beer money either.
Drive back to coach and I have put plate back in but now will wait for the mechanic to come back in AM and help me replace steering wheel and he can tighten up bolts on st box. This hopefully has that problem out of way if we do not have any more leaking there and I feel the seal is a slightly firmer fit on shaft as it should be so with oil pressure the seal should grip more as is designed.
Thanks to JD telling me that it can be fixed without removing as that sure made a different job of it.
Lon, I have not get hold ofKen yet but will as a "just in case". Awesome Forum guys!!!
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #11 – November 12, 2015, 10:20:45 am

Quote from: J. D. Stevens – November 10, 2015, 05:12:05 pm

If that seal failed quickly and totally, be sure to check the setting of the pressure relief plungers.

Let me expand a little on this:

The physical stops (bolt with lock nut) on the steering knuckles should have 1/8" clearance. If shiny, there is zero clearance and the PSI can go up exponentially. This WILL cause seals to blow out. It can also bend suspension components.

So, the physical stops should be set so that the tires do not contact the body, suspension components, etc.

Then the relief plungers on the steering box, which set how far in each direction the steering box will turn (tiny exterior screws top and bottom of Sheppard M100 box) should be set for the 1/8" clearance.

This gives max safe cut angles.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #12 – November 12, 2015, 01:53:50 pm

The Shepard steering gear on my 1996 U320 has "AUTO" cast into the case, and the steering full lock adjustments cannot be done manually. Instructions are to jack both wheels up, start engine and turn full lock both right and left. Adjustment is done with sliding valves. i am not sure which models or which years Foretravel installed the "AUTO" Shepard steering gear, perhaps Caflashbob would comment about this.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #13 – November 12, 2015, 02:10:06 pm

wy6att were n the casting is the auto stamp?
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #14 – November 12, 2015, 02:29:20 pm

Quote from: P. Wyatt Sabourin – November 12, 2015, 01:53:50 pm

The Shepard steering gear on my 1996 U320 has "AUTO" cast into the case, and the steering full lock adjustments cannot be done manually. Instructions are to jack both wheels up, start engine and turn full lock both right and left. Adjustment is done with sliding valves. i am not sure which models or which years Foretravel installed the "AUTO" Shepard steering gear, perhaps Caflashbob would comment about this.

Was gone by that time. Running a country coach store in the same park

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #15 – November 12, 2015, 02:55:12 pm

Sorry, I have never worked on an "auto" adjust Sheppard box, so do not know the correct procedure if you do not see the tiny standard screws on bottom and top of box for adjusting the plungers.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #16 – November 12, 2015, 03:16:57 pm

I saw the "AUTO" when the steering gear was on the shop floor. I just got under my motorhome to checked with mirrors and flashlights and it is not easy to see. I appears to be on the mounting side (opposite to the Shepard Co M100 markings). This means I could only see it through the narrow gap between the pump body and the frame where it mounts and only at a steep angle. The Shepard instructions on BeamAlarm indicated that the plastic caps in the adjustment holes have "AUTO" on them also. My bottom one is missing, even though it was there when the pump was installed. The adjustment holes are beside the input steering shaft on top, and clearly visible on the bottom from underneath. If yours was adjusted properly there is no need to adjust it unless the steering gear is removed/reinstalled. You can check with someone turning the steering wheel (engine running) and observe a small gap in the steering stop (left and right). No gap means very high pressures and premature blown seals. My pump leaked at the seal that is opposite to the pitman arm shaft. I could have replaced the leaking seal but the recommendation was to rebuild. You may want to get your pump rebuilt when it is convenient. The dudes who did mine had quite a battle to get the pitman arm off.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #17 – November 12, 2015, 03:58:30 pm

well to be sure of any clearances etc between positive stops I put it into both left and right locks and found that the right one was hitting the stop before coming to a return/pressure drop on the box. I took the screw stop off and found that this has been hitting the sq head of bolt for a long time- amazing this issue had not caused earlier seal blowout but I guess I had never really gone to max lock before.
I could not adjust it in any more to make a gap so I took it off and cleaned the threads out really well and did a bit of measuring etc. Once I could move that threaded bolt in a few turns I put it back and strted it up and did a full lock right again. I immediately found that the plunger cut in and no more movement was allowed so then brought it back away. Got under to see if any marking on bolt head and now none so now I have that gap you need/ or close to it. NOW i feel confident ( as much as you can till you have a thousand miles on it with no issues) so-
Thanks again to JD for taking my call and doing some more explaining etc and to Brett who sent me a pm on this issue too.
I hope this is the last bloody issue for a long time and we can get back to enjoying this trip.
Nice talking to all the experts out there though.
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #18 – November 12, 2015, 04:21:27 pm

Quote from: John Haygarth – November 12, 2015, 03:58:30 pm

I hope this is the last bloody issue for a long time and we can get back to enjoying this trip.

Assume you're keeping files of all this: it's gold for the next owner!

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #19 – November 12, 2015, 04:43:01 pm

yes and maybe I should sell ths one now as it is in better than new condition what with all the extras we have done inside and out. This is one special unit and looks like almost new too.
80k any offers to full price???
JohnH

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #20 – November 12, 2015, 06:05:19 pm

Quote from: John Haygarth – November 12, 2015, 04:43:01 pm

yes and maybe I should sell ths one now as it is in better than new condition what with all the extras we have done inside and out. This is one special unit and looks like almost new too.
80k any offers to full price???

We paid asking because of all the upgrades/paperwork.

Re: now power steering problem

Reply #21 – November 13, 2015, 05:50:10 pm

well a last update to put this topic to rest so to speak.
we have only driven for around 200 miles today but had some very tight turns to do and so far not one leak of oil from seals on steering box. I feel very confident that this issue is behind us (famous last words!!) and am ever so gratefull for the imput from the members I have mentioned before. It was at their suggestions that the steering stops etc be checked after doing the replacement and that is how I found one side to be needing it. This most probably caused the big leak of oil. and still amazes me it not happened before in our ownership.
Well done Forum.
JohnH

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