Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

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Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

May 14, 2016, 01:54:13 am

Im attempting to get a Grandville U225 36 ft with 5.9 cummins with 4 speed Allison tran will this be a real slow coach,
We will go over mountains pulling a bass boat.
Im told a Banks will improve it tremendously.
I just do not want to be disappointed.
Can anyone please help
Thank you
Ric

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #1 – May 14, 2016, 08:17:19 am

They all get to the top. I would worry more about braking. Jake Vs pac vs retarder is the issue really.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #2 – May 14, 2016, 08:44:54 am

Assume you are looking at a U225.

While the engine can be "turned up", you would need to verify with Allison that the MT643, 4 speed transmission could handle more HP/torque.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #3 – May 14, 2016, 10:11:02 am

Yes it will be slow in the hills. What you will find is that the transmission gearing is critical. Perhaps it will pull 3rd gear full throttle at the max rated rpm and you do pretty well up the hills. If it won't pull 3rd, then you drop to 2nd and find that it will be singing along just fine at part throttle max rpm but you are going SLOW. Just enjoy the view.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #4 – May 14, 2016, 10:26:48 am

Also remember there are a lot of 5.9 engine coaches out there. Most all of them were rated at 190 hp, up some what higher, to 210 as I remember. But Foretravel spec. their engines at 230 hp. I drove a brand new 1994, 190 hp coach, Denver to Seattle, to Portland to Dumas TX. We were not towing, but it went everywhere.

My rich uncle suggested that I not add a Banks system to our 5.9 Foretravel, but save the money, and just leave a half hour earlier.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #5 – May 14, 2016, 10:49:33 am

I have a 36ft u225 and live in the mountains. Have made it up every pass but not before looking for the easiest ones to do. It can be very slow going and a little bit stressful on the big ones. Have had to pull over on some passes to let it cool down.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #6 – May 14, 2016, 10:56:26 am

I had one. This coach was made back in the day when the speed limit on the highways were 55 MPH. At that speed with out pulling anything it was great. Put my boat behind it and it was a different story. I made it everywhere I wanted to go, just that the MH took it time getting up to speed. I had a problem with it running warm when I had the boat behind and was trying to push it (60+mph). I took the radiator out and had gone thru but that did not help.

I remember back then a friend had just bought a new FT that had the 8.3 His comment to me was"When you want to pass someone and look in your mirror to see is anyone is coming up on you, before I had to wait, now I just pull out and gun it."

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #7 – May 14, 2016, 11:09:33 am

I do remember asking a question after we'd bought this coach about the lack of a Boost Gauge & Pyrometer that we'd had in our Airstreams. The answer was they were not needed unless the engine was "hot-rodded" for increased h.p.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #8 – May 14, 2016, 12:12:43 pm

My recommendation is not buy a coach with a smaller engine planning to boost its power with a Banks or something else. Buy the engine you want first as Banks does not make it a different engine.
For us, we felt that Cummins B-5.9 is a minimal engine installed to keep the manufacturer's selling price low, when a C-8.3 is really the engine some of these heavy coaches should have. We did not consider any 5.9 engines when we bought our rear diesel pusher.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #9 – May 14, 2016, 01:21:39 pm

If you are asking the question my experience is that you would like a more powerful Rv to start with.

If you are a right lane person in a car it's ok. Not good but ok.

The 5.9's 643 Allison trans does not lock the torque converter until mid rpms in third gear.

Slipping torque converter causes the trans to heat up and the power to the rear wheels to be reduced.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #10 – May 14, 2016, 01:36:40 pm

Your question is going to get different opinions for sure. My opinion is if you like the coach it will work. My 1981 40' Foretravel only had the Cummins 555 with 225 HP. and had a GVW over 33,000 LBS. We used it for 18 years and pulled a 1984 Cherokee then a 1996 Grand Cherokee then a 1998 Grand Cherokee an finally the 2001 Grand Cherokee we have now. Pulled up the Bishop grade 2 times a year. Never over heated and the trans never went over 205 It had the 643 Allison and when the convertor would unlock on the grade at times it was like a passing gear feel. My brother only would reach the top abut 4 minutes earlier than me with his 325 HP Cat in a 35' HR.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #11 – May 14, 2016, 06:57:49 pm

quote" Buy the engine you want first as Banks does not make it a different engine. "
Banks sure does not make the engine different, but it sure feels different when you press that throttle down and want to climb hills!!
I would NOT want my Banks to pack in as it cannot be replaced anymore and believe me the 350 does not have the same power without it.
JohnH

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #12 – May 14, 2016, 07:49:18 pm

I had a 93, U225. We loved the coach but did not love the power. I would not want to go back to the 5.9 Cummins untless we were running very light and not towed.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #13 – May 15, 2016, 05:50:30 pm

rwoley,

And, what MPG are you getting?

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #14 – May 15, 2016, 05:59:38 pm

We get about 9.5 mpg towing the truck; about 9 or slightly more towing the big trailer with the sand rail, etc. A lot of hills and we drop to 8-8.5.

We love this coach; it could be our last one.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #15 – May 16, 2016, 04:32:21 pm

How 'slow' is 'slow' ? Our '94 - U225 - 5.9 Cummings fits us just fine. We tow a 26' enclosed trailer that weighs 7200 lbs loaded a lot of the time and have no problems. We do not have a lot of mountains to travel in. Most I can think of is around Nashville Tn. ?

I like to drive between 60 and 65, at about 2100 rpm. I know most of you think that's probably too 'slow'.

I don't like to drive interstate hwys any more than I have to. Nothing to look at except concrete and trucks (& pot holes). The back roads lets you see if people have better junk than yours in their yards .

When I first started looking for a diesel I talked to a buddy of mine with a trucking company about the engines.
His first choice was the 5.9 Cummings - easiest maintenance - least expensive to repair - long life - etc.
He said the Cats are real good, just cost more to fix.
Of coarse he's talking millions of miles .

The 'little' 36' x 8' wide U225 is probably the simplest of the FT's and I just love it.

Hope every one's got the Foretravel that fit's them...........................Be Well.................~JL~

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #16 – May 16, 2016, 06:15:09 pm

Quote from: Johnnie & Susan Laird – May 16, 2016, 04:32:21 pm

How 'slow' is 'slow' ? Our '94 - U225 - 5.9 Cummings fits us just fine. We tow a 26' enclosed trailer that weighs 7200 lbs loaded a lot of the time and have no problems. We do not have a lot of mountains to travel in. Most I can think of is around Nashville Tn. ?

I like to drive between 60 and 65, at about 2100 rpm. I know most of you think that's probably too 'slow'.

I don't like to drive interstate hwys any more than I have to. Nothing to look at except concrete and trucks (& pot holes). The back roads lets you see if people have better junk than yours in their yards .

When I first started looking for a diesel I talked to a buddy of mine with a trucking company about the engines.
His first choice was the 5.9 Cummings - easiest maintenance - least expensive to repair - long life - etc.
He said the Cats are real good, just cost more to fix.
Of coarse he's talking millions of miles .

The 'little' 36' x 8' wide U225 is probably the simplest of the FT's and I just love it.

Hope every one's got the Foretravel that fit's them...........................Be Well.................~JL~

As a former U225 (happy) owner I approve this message

One other thing to note: to change the Serpentine belt, radiator fan, alternator and harmonic balancer, you do not need to remove the radiator ... been there done that and all was very easy.
Oh BTW U225 does go 75-80 mph all day long .. I know! You just need good new balanced tires, good suspension, wide open road ... and just let sweet 5.9 Cummins do what she does best :-)

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #17 – May 16, 2016, 09:56:10 pm

The 5.9 like a lot of coaches has adequate power.

Best east of the Rockies and for non type "A" owners.

The impatient people who drive a lot in the Rockies will not like the right lane nature on hills and the lack a secondary braking system.

Air drum brakes worked ok but not over poweringly strong like the air disks.

Altitude use reduces the power even more.

Offset by the actual time in any grade is a small fraction of your normal trip hours.

Had these conversations with many customers when these were new in 93'

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #18 – May 17, 2016, 12:26:19 am

I agree with the Lairds; about 60-65 and off the Interstate when possible. I used to be a petal to the metal guy; but, I found that going a little slower takes me a little longer to get there and saves me a few bucks. I try to do maybe 250-300 miles a day; so, not really pushing it too hard.

An update on my fuel economy: just filled up today from my last trip from Tucson to the Imperial Sand Dunes pulling the 24' trailer with the sand rail, etc. Pretty flat road (Interstate

and no wind; 10.1 mpg. Pretty pleased with that.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #19 – May 17, 2016, 11:57:17 pm

As I recall, the "sweet spot" on that '93 coach with the 5.9 was about 62 mph. We towed our '98 Jeep Cherokee Sport (which was the garage) loaded with stuff, and they bays were pretty full, as well. We also saw about 9.5 to 10 mpg. Our preferred distance was about 250 miles ... not more unless we were pushing for a destination. It is too much fun to

Quote from: Kent Speers – May 14, 2016, 07:49:18 pm

I had a 93, U225. We loved the coach but did not love the power. I would not want to go back to the 5.9 Cummins untless we were running very light and not towed.

Our rigs were actual twins. Kent always ran hotter than we did. We actually weighed our coach and the load was "full", but within the allowable range and distributed. Kent had more tools and more stuff than we did ... and he has a religious obsession about NOT weighing his rig. He called us at one point when he was driving it really empty and was totally perplexed as to why it was so peppy and not over heating. Massive silence when I pointed out that the WEIGHT was GONE!! These things are really reliable and easy to maintain and work on ... but it is just a machine, and you can't expect miracles. If you are gonna try and suspend the laws of physics and cram more than you should in your rig, there are gonna be issues.

That being said ... these coaches are tough. we took them into the desert in Terlingua and down dirt roads in Texas and into ditches in North Carolina and and had a LOT of fun and many misadventures ... most of which have been related in detail on this Forum!!

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #20 – May 18, 2016, 12:31:50 am

Had two different u225 customers add additional cooling.

One had a front cooler installed and a discontinued water bag/spray bar system to spray over it.

The other one put a left to right mounted radiator in the empty space next to the engine I think on the drivers side?

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #21 – May 18, 2016, 02:27:14 am

Carol,
not OUR U225 in Carolina ditches?! haha. I had it stuck in really soft sand in the Imperial Sand Dunes last fall. After a couple of hours of digging to no avail, I called my roadside service; took them 4 hours to get there and 15 minutes to tow us out.

Re: Will a 5.9 cummins be enough motor

Reply #22 – May 18, 2016, 12:05:21 pm

Kept all liquids fresh; Flushed the Allison Trans with transient oil & did not have cooling issues. From what i can tell compare to other U225 owners I ran mine less loaded (we were not full time) but ran it a bit faster for the most part about 65 mph but did step on it to pass trucks by going up to 75-80 mph, where it was safe to do so.
When i say less loaded; I was still towing a Jeep Wrangler, had tools and a spare tire.
IMHO depending on ones budget a U225 is a great FT. I never thought I would ever sell mine but the 03 that we own now came out of a left field so we sold the U225. I would further add that IMHO it is one of the best FT build ... its configuration is just the best.
I plan on doing some upgrades to our 03 where I will mimic the U225 interior.

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