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Topic: 6V92 No Start Update (Read 965 times) previous topic - next topic

6V92 No Start Update

Decided to start a new thread - update on getting coach running again on North Dakota trip.

Reading the DDEC computer codes, the techs were able to determine that one of the TRS (Timing Reference Sensor) sensors is not providing a signal. These tell the computer the speed of the camshaft and the signal is used to time the fuel injectors. So, no signal, no injectors, no start. This is a fairly common failure I'm told. These sensors are 25 years old, so not surprising.

There are 2 at $300 each - both will be replaced. Not bad, but some of the turbo piping has to be removed for access. Parts had to be ordered, will be in tomorrow, so my wife and son will be in the Hampton Inn another night.

Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #1 –
Good news Peter,

Do you know which codes were triggered and were there any warning signs before the shutdown?  I would think several fault codes would show when there was no injector response.  Sounds like a possible preventive maintenance item for those of us with the older 6V92's.  Glad your tow went smoothly thanks to the lowboy trailer and Good Sam's.

Jerry


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Jerry and Cindy Maddux
1993 U300/36WTBI DD6v92TA
build 4271  "Miss Lou"
1995 suzuki sidekick 4x4 toad
Gulfport, Ms

"Pride of Ownership"

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #2 –
Jerry

Don't know the codes. My son was on an entrance ramp and it was just a sudden shutdown. He was able to coast backwards and pull to the side at the bottom of the ramp. Temps and everything were normal, no check engine lights lit up. At first we thought he was low on fuel, and he had lost prime. In the process we found out Foretravel installed a prime pump next to the fuel/water filter. It is a black knob that you can release with a slight turn, and it has about a 4" stroke. We added fuel and tried pumping that to see if that would re-prime the line, but it turns out that wasn't the problem after all.
Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #3 –
Thanks Peter,

The code flasher under the the dash will retain any historical codes until cleared.  Active codes will cease when the problem causing them has been fixed.  Your situation looks like everything was fine until the sensor failure.  I don't know with DDEC II if a Pro-Link or any other reader would have detected the problem with an injector test before the TRS sensor went out.  I'll keep investigating.  Hope all is well.

Jerry

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Jerry and Cindy Maddux
1993 U300/36WTBI DD6v92TA
build 4271  "Miss Lou"
1995 suzuki sidekick 4x4 toad
Gulfport, Ms

"Pride of Ownership"

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #4 –
Update

TRS and SRS sensors arrived and were installed. The 6V92 fired right up.

Correction, the sensors were $150 each, total of $300.

Wife and son expected to be back on the road about 3:00 Mountain time.
Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #5 –
Quote from: prfleming –
  The 6V92 fired right up.

I'd bet there were smiles all around.  ^.^d
1993 U-240 "La Villa Grande"..CAT 3116 w/ Pacbrake PRXB...Allison 3060 6-speed..
Previous: 1983 Airstream 310 turbo diesel, 1979 Airstream 280 turbo diesel
                                      Build # 4297
                                      PNW natives
                      Home base:  'Cactus Hug' (Ajo, Arizona)
                        DW Judy & Chet the wonder dog
                        Full-Timers 'Sailing the asphalt sea'

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #6 –
Peter,

If the historical codes haven't been cleared, it should have one or both of these codes stored:

Code 41 - Timing Reference Sensor Pulses Fault (TRS)
Code 42 - Synchronous Reference Sensor Pulses Fault (SRS)

How much shop time was involved and is this possibly a DIY job?  I'd like to have these spares on hand when the time comes.

Thanks,

Jerry

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Jerry and Cindy Maddux
1993 U300/36WTBI DD6v92TA
build 4271  "Miss Lou"
1995 suzuki sidekick 4x4 toad
Gulfport, Ms

"Pride of Ownership"

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #7 –
Update

Have the final repair info, had a little misinformation.

Both SRS and TRS sensors were actually good once they got to them. Somehow the TRS sensor wire connector had broken and the sensor wires were damaged going to the wire harness. Could a rock or something have bounced up off the road? Anyway, the connector was replaced, and the wiring repaired. New sensors will be returned - no charge.

Bill was $1100, I won't have the labor breakdown until I actually see it. I did find out the labor rate is $130. We also had fuel filters replaced for good measure.
Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #8 –
Might you want them for spares?
1999 40 ft. U-320 wtfe build 5563 Chuck & Lynda's "Rollin' Inn"  2030 watts solar
prev. mh's 71 GMC 5 yrs. 73 Pace Setter 1 yr. 78 Vogue 5 yrs 81 FTX 40ft all electric 18 yrs. 1996 Monaco Signature 3 yrs.
2014 Grand Cherokee Overland
Dream as if you will live forever. Live as if you will die today.  James Dean

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #9 –
Possibley a rock a piece of old tire rubber your guess is good as mine,I"ve had that happen on my semi truck. also at least on my semi wires at those connections get weak after all those years,My semi,95 peterbilt has about 2.5 million miles on it,I have small issues with those connections on and off every couple months. Vibration etc. Also carrying spare TRS and SRS is fine,I do that myself, But be prepared that they don"t Usually just pop out the hole  like they are supposed too. Usually they are stuck and break causing the entire simple job to turn into a half day project, So if your at a facility,be prepared to PAY!!
91 GV U300 Unihome 40' Build 3811
6V92TA Detroit

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #10 –
Stump
That might be why they didn't want to pull them if not absolutely necessary. What engine is in your truck?
Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #11 –
I run a series 60 in my Pete. I had a sensor go bad where I park at and went and bought a sensor,One of mine is behind the air compressor the other is down on the backside of the timing chest,The easy to get to one failed,I figured 1 bolt pop it out new one in no problem,Well it was STUCK,It broke I was basically screwed laying on gravel,simple job turned it a PITA anyway had it towed to a nearby shop the drilled it out fixed me right up about 450.00 if i remember including tow 3 miles. The problem is they don't fail when you are in your driveway in front of your workshop which has every tool imaginable in it to handle about anything that might come up! They fail in the middle of nowhere,and you have to get towed and pay pay pay. It's just the way it is. Too make you feel better these sensors very seldom fail. A great design and almost bulletproof system . Most of my electrical issues are OLD fragile wiring.
The problem is you go to a shop and have a chafed wire,You or Me would get out the solder splice in a new piece,seal it weathertite fix it, etc But these new age Technicians don't do that they have to replace the whole thing. Thy don't know how to repair,Just Replace!
I just cant go into a shop with a Cart Blanch possible invoice at the end. When my rear end went out last Feb, Peterbilt wanted $12,800.00 for a new front chunk!! I choked !! Needless to say I had truck towed and fixed elsewhere.
91 GV U300 Unihome 40' Build 3811
6V92TA Detroit

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #12 –
It can be hard to decide what to carry as a spare but I have seen roadside mechanics not be able to get new sensors without waiting a day or two so having the sensors may really pay off.
Toby a 94 u280
Cummins 8.3
6 speed Allison
Exhaust brake


Adopted by Derek and Annabelle

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #13 –
Quote from: its toby –
It can be hard to decide what to carry as a spare but I have seen roadside mechanics not be able to get new sensors without waiting a day or two so having the sensors may really pay off.
Good advice. But, there are probably 8-10 oil pressure, cam speed, air temp, engine & radiator water temp, boost, etc. sensors on a computer controlled diesel engine. So, which spare sensors would you want to carry...In my experience there is no predicting these failures. In my case it wasn't even the TRS sensor itself, the wiring was disconnected - we don't know what caused it.
Peter and Tammy Fleming
1991 U300 GV 40 - Sold, owned for 4 years
Downsized to Roadtrek Popular 210 class B

Re: 6V92 No Start Update

Reply #14 –
its quite a balance, I have seen many trs and srs sensors fail without warning on series 60 engine but cannot fully speak for a 6v92.  that being said the older they become the less chance of finding places with stuff in stock.  if you travel with no deadlines or premade reservations not having parts on board is fine but if you regularly tend to travel to put miles on to a set destination this could lead to issues.
Toby a 94 u280
Cummins 8.3
6 speed Allison
Exhaust brake


Adopted by Derek and Annabelle