Cheaper 8D AGM...

Topic: Cheaper 8D AGM... (Read 2404 times) previous topic - next topic

Cheaper 8D AGM...

August 30, 2017, 09:19:47 am

I am not looking at replacing batteries, but I would have checked out these if I had seen them when I was looking;
Apex APX12-250 12v 250ah Deep Cycle Battery (Group 8D) Apex Battery
8D AGM for under $300! They rate them at 250AH, but they weigh only about 150lbs. and have 1300 CCA compared to the O'Reilly (made by Deka/East Penn) 8D's that we have. No idea about the quality, but the price is attractive! I head about them from somebody in a Solar Boondocking group on FB.
Don

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #1 – August 30, 2017, 09:29:23 am

I ordered some Orielly's batteries yesterday. The only difference I noticed with these is the the Oriellys batteries have 1450 CCA. Looks like a possible option.

Mark

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #2 – August 30, 2017, 09:58:50 am

I have two of those apex 8D's (i bought them under a different name, but they are identical chinese imports). They work great. Youll need to modify your terminals if your cables have automotive post connectors like mine did, but I have been happy with them.

Dont be fooled by a discrepency in weight. They still break your back trying to install them. It took two of us to wrangle them into position.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #3 – August 30, 2017, 10:29:31 am

Even though the title says AGM, the description says they are SLA, Sealed Lead Acid. That is a big difference! Then at the bottom it says AGM again. Which one is true?

TOM

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #4 – August 30, 2017, 10:48:20 am

Quote from: OldManSax – August 30, 2017, 10:29:31 am

Even though the title says AGM, the description says they are SLA, Sealed Lead Acid. That is a big difference! Then at the bottom it says AGM again. Which one is true?

TOM

I've found Chinese manufacturers are frequently as truthful as used car salesmen when it comes to product descriptions and specifications. It's all about selling at any cost.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #5 – August 30, 2017, 10:56:04 am

I have installed three Orielly's batteries in my coach. So far no problems. I did not have the funds for the Lifeline batteries.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #6 – August 30, 2017, 11:13:55 am

Quote from: Tom Lang – August 30, 2017, 10:48:20 am

I've found Chinese manufacturers are frequently as truthful as used car salesmen when it comes to product descriptions and specifications. It's all about selling at any cost.

While this has been true in many cases in the past, Apple and the solar cell industry have been excellent examples of what the Chinese can do. Apple is arguably the world's largest company and not only are Chinese solar panels excellent quality but they are responsible for the price dropping over 80% since 2008. Our commercial Yingli panels have proven to be very well made and dependable with 500,000 of their brothers installed in the southwest.

Pierce

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #7 – August 30, 2017, 01:51:11 pm

Quote from: OldManSax – August 30, 2017, 10:29:31 am

Even though the title says AGM, the description says they are SLA, Sealed Lead Acid. That is a big difference! Then at the bottom it says AGM again. Which one is true?

TOM

What is the difference between SLA and AGM?
I thought that AGM, Gel, and Maintenance Free batteries were all SLA.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #8 – August 30, 2017, 01:53:45 pm

I have had three Apex 8D batteries since Nov 2015 - working OK today, will see how well they work in another three years!

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #9 – August 30, 2017, 04:54:54 pm

Quote from: P. Wyatt Sabourin – August 30, 2017, 01:51:11 pm

What is the difference between SLA and AGM?
I thought that AGM, Gel, and Maintenance Free batteries were all SLA.

Very true, AGM and Gel are subsets of the class SLA, they are all sealed lead acid.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #10 – August 31, 2017, 12:57:13 pm

SLA is a sealed lead acid battery. But that does not necessarily mean that it is an absorbed glass mat battery. Two different animals in my mind. I suppose you could say that AGM batteries are all SLA but not all SLA are absorbed glass mat. Confused yeah me too.

Roland

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #11 – September 01, 2017, 09:21:18 am

There are significant differences. One relatively simple explanation is here:

VRLA battery - Wikipedia

TOM

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #12 – September 01, 2017, 11:01:40 am

I wonder about the longevity of these batteries. They have the same first year warranty as O'Reilly's but they also say their products typically last three times the warranty period. I'm thinkin' that's a bit short of the 11 years on my gels (failing now).
jor

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #13 – September 01, 2017, 01:37:05 pm

Jor, Just for info were you using a battery temp system?

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #14 – September 01, 2017, 07:19:33 pm

Quote

Jor, Just for info were you using a battery temp system?

When I got this coach about a year and a half ago it had the original Freedom charger with no temperature feature so I don't think it ever had one. I replaced the Freedom with a Magnum 2812 and added the temp gizmo. I need to replace these two 8Ds. In the past I have bought Lifeline and East Penn AGMs but this time I'm thinking about going with gels or at least going with a less expensive solution like O'Reilly's. I know some Chinese stuff if pretty good but in my limited experience most of it has been junk.
jor

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #15 – September 01, 2017, 08:51:55 pm

I just bought 3 of these 8D AGM batteries from a local battery store. These are from the Full River line of batteries, a little less than the full river. I paid $443/ea when buying 3. Of course Arkansas sales tax was an additional 10%.

The Full River have good reviews, but very little data on the Full Force. Both made in China, but supposedly designed in USA.

Full Force 8D AGM batteries

We will see how they hold up in a few years.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #16 – September 02, 2017, 12:55:27 pm

I studied, I researched, I Compared, and Nobody, and I do mean Nobody can tell me that the Best Bang for the Buck, isn't an 8D from NAPA. The Specs just do Not justify any other Battery I have found, anywhere! If someone can show me the Benefit of purchasing another brand, I am willing to listen. I will have New 8D's by next Wednesday, I pick them up, turn in my old Batts, and get them for $194.00 + Tax of 6%, out the door! NO SHIPPING CHARGE! Clean, Easy, simple and Sensible, if you ask me? I have a Network of NAPA Stores across the Nation if I need to use the 2 Year Warranty, also! Which simply means I have NO Return Shipping charge, and New Battery replacement Shipping Cost, as well! That evolution alone can cost as much as I am paying for a Battery!!!

I may, or may not add an Automatic Watering System. I will give it a Years use, and determine if that is even necessary?

I am Cleaning up the rack, and putting a Rubber Liquid Coating on the whole shebang, so corrosion is never a concern ever again, either! Plasti-Dip looks like an appropriate candidate for that job!

I cannot understand all this hoopla on AGM's or any other SLA Battery on a Cost Analysis over the usable lifetime of a Battery. If there is a Comparo Chart, Video, or, Article someone can provide to stop me from considering NAPA Batteries, please post that. Your opinion may count, but Show Me why you have that POV please?

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #17 – September 02, 2017, 01:53:06 pm

Quote from: RetiredGuns – September 02, 2017, 12:55:27 pm

I studied, I researched, I Compared, and Nobody, and I do mean Nobody can tell me that the Best Bang for the Buck, isn't an 8D from NAPA. The Specs just do Not justify any other Battery I have found, anywhere! If someone can show me the Benefit of purchasing another brand, I am willing to listen.

What is the PN? Starting batteries or deep cycle?

Do you do much dry camping, or mostly on shore power?

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #18 – September 02, 2017, 02:24:04 pm

"If someone can show me the Benefit of purchasing another brand, I am willing to listen."
It may be difficult to justify the expense, but for me, the mess of flooded lead acid batteries is enough to ban them from our coach forever. We have a golfcart with T105 Trojans. Aside from the need for watering, the constant mess is enough to make me cough up the extra for sealed batteries of whichever persuasion. Then there is a potential hazard of outgassing... not to mention corrosive fumes. I love my clean battery compartment! Just my two cents, do what makes you 😊
Don

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #19 – September 02, 2017, 02:37:34 pm

IF you are unlucky enough to totally discharge flooded cell batteries their cycle life is reduced by 50% each time.

500 50% discharges on AGM's. 1000 on gels.

No idea on std 8d's as they were made to be start batteries only. Never intended to be less than 12.75 fully charged volts.

The outgassing requires every six month battery cable servicing at best.

Pole to pole use they will work ok.

Half my time as a Foretravel manager was spent on battery maintenance on my in stock coaches.

A smart charger available now and a desulphurator setup would help greatly I think.

Discharged flooded cells can freeze in severe winter weather.

Used to have battery heater plates to bring up their temps for better power if the temps dropped.

I removed good flooded cell 8d's and good VRLA engine start batteries when we got our new to us coach.

Hardly look in either compartment. Which is much better.

But to each his own

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #20 – September 02, 2017, 02:39:20 pm

Agree with Don, when normal vented wet cell 8d"s were $100, and 8d agms were $500, I went with wet cells and fought the constant corrosion and adding water [sometimes too much which made a mess of its own] problems. Now AGM's are just over twice the price of wet cells and you can also buy them from a national chain [Oreilly's] with the same warranty and no shipping.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #21 – September 02, 2017, 03:39:20 pm

This photo is one reason why AGMs are our choice over flooded batteries. Batteries are in middle of coach, hard to access. Little ventilation, pain to pull everything out, hard to see water levels.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #22 – September 02, 2017, 05:18:33 pm

+2 on what AC7880 says!

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #23 – September 02, 2017, 07:02:47 pm

Quote from: Caflashbob – September 02, 2017, 02:37:34 pm

Hardly look in either compartment. Which is much better.

When we bought this coach three years ago, I checked them a lot, even though we have a Xantrex 40+ 3 stage charger. Found the files that showed we had fresh Lifeline GPL-8DL house batteries installed in late 2014. They were not cheap ($625.00), but I don't even look in that compartment anymore, either!

Starter batteries are Optima 800 spirals, installed in 2012, no idea what they cost.

Re: Cheaper 8D AGM...

Reply #24 – September 02, 2017, 07:45:57 pm

You can get by with wet cell batteries because they are on a rack that is outside the coach body open to the air. If you have a coach that the batteries are in and enclosed compartment then you need the sealed batteries to eliminate the corrosion. Good luck with your batteries, but I know that they will be a pain to check and fill with water. Do what makes you happy.

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