Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

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Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

October 07, 2017, 01:40:16 pm

Has anyone on here converted their original propane furnace equipped Foretravel to a hydronic heating system such as Aquahot?

I'm very much considering doing this and trying to get input from anyone who might have done it themselves. I'm also seeking pictures on the original Foretravel Aquahot installations regarding the Aquahot exhaust installation and routing, placement of air handlers in the wet bays, and how you supply fresh air to the Aquahot.

Thanks.

Edit: I'm looking at one of the ITR Oasis units like the Combi or the CH50.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #1 – October 07, 2017, 01:52:37 pm

On a 34 ft coach, you only have one bay free, You might consider the fact that you will use a good portion of it for the unit itself.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #2 – October 07, 2017, 01:56:44 pm

Quote from: jcus – October 07, 2017, 01:52:37 pm

On a 34 ft coach, you only have one bay free, You might consider the fact that you will use a good portion of it for the unit itself.

Currently looking at putting it in the spot that would have held the propane tank since I won't need it anymore so as to not lose any existing space.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #3 – October 07, 2017, 02:01:39 pm

WOW
I have worked on ton's of them. Have pulled and replaced lots of them, because the exhaust hit our low drive at the Liberty Lake FT store, and broke the heat exchanger. I tell you this, so you understand I am that familiar.
I understand some of the benefits with them,but as nice as they are, it would be a huge undertaking.There is far more to the system, then the unit itself.Not saying it can't be done.
Realize they are also very high maintenance. For boon docking, they draw a lot of dc voltage. After all my experiences with them, and realizing I will be stepping on a lot of toes here, I choose our U295, because it didn't have one.
Just my 2 cents as a tech
Chris

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #4 – October 07, 2017, 02:02:24 pm

Quote from: rsihnhold – October 07, 2017, 01:56:44 pm

Currently looking at putting it in the spot that would have held the propane tank since I won't need it anymore so as to not lose any existing space.

It would be super difficult to service it, in that position (side ways)

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #5 – October 07, 2017, 02:11:19 pm

Quite an ambitious project, You will have an all electric coach now, so you might have to add more batteries unless to wish to run generator or stay plugged in all the time. In colder temps, the aquahot blowers and pumps draw a pretty good 12 volt current.
Exhaust is just a pipe through the bottom of the coach, and propane tank area already has fresh air inlet. Running hose and wire to all your heat exchangers is going to be your biggest challenge.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #6 – October 07, 2017, 02:14:09 pm

@gracerace

I appreciate the advice. I've had problems with both my Atwood water heater and furnace (both less than 3 years old) in the last year and tired of having to hunt down places to refill propane in the winter. Now that I've done away with the propane refrigerator, I'm trying to convert the RV to all electric.

I could also move the proposed hydronic heater over to the area that currently holds the batteries and swap them into the old propane bay. The batteries will eventually be replaced with lithium ion batteries and placed under the kitchen cabinets in the space where the furnace is located so that they are not subjected to temperature extremes.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #7 – October 07, 2017, 02:25:28 pm

Robert, Something to think about: Hydronic heating has some advantages, but there are many who make a living servicing Aquahot, but there is no one making a living servicing propane furnaces.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #8 – October 07, 2017, 02:39:07 pm

Wouldnt space heaters be cheaper and easier?

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #9 – October 07, 2017, 02:39:47 pm

I questioned this same project 10 years ago,after all the parts and pieces the price was at 10k plus my time, I can buy alot of propane for for that price.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #10 – October 07, 2017, 04:33:43 pm

Something I'd never consider, unless my floor safe was full of CBs. Those furnances should give a lot more years than three. We've had Atwoods that have lasted 10 years and that being full-timers. The ignitor boards are always suspect, as is the propane regulator.
The factory boards bite, we switched to Dinosaur Electronics Home. High quality circuit boards for RV appliances.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #11 – October 07, 2017, 05:06:31 pm

Quote

I questioned this same project 10 years ago,after all the parts and pieces the price was at 10k plus my time,

I was at the Aqua Hot facility four or five years ago and asked them that question. They told me they could do it for about 30 grand. I think it would be a great project and you will have a big audience here.
jor

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #12 – October 07, 2017, 05:30:39 pm

Quote from: rsihnhold – October 07, 2017, 02:14:09 pm

@gracerace

I appreciate the advice. I've had problems with both my Atwood water heater and furnace (both less than 3 years old) in the last year and tired of having to hunt down places to refill propane in the winter. Now that I've done away with the propane refrigerator, I'm trying to convert the RV to all electric.

I could also move the proposed hydronic heater over to the area that currently holds the batteries and swap them into the old propane bay. The batteries will eventually be replaced with lithium ion batteries and placed under the kitchen cabinets in the space where the furnace is located so that they are not subjected to temperature extremes.

Why not install an all electric water heater, and couple of base boards. Have one in our 36', keeps the whole coach warm.
Not sure why you are having issues with your heater and W/H. they are super reliable, use the same control board, and cheap to fix.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #13 – October 07, 2017, 05:31:02 pm

These look like possible solutions.

Eberspacher

Webasto: Heating solutions for motorhomes and caravans

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #14 – October 07, 2017, 06:44:26 pm

Quote from: prfleming – October 07, 2017, 05:31:02 pm

These look like possible solutions.

Eberspacher

Webasto: Heating solutions for motorhomes and caravans
Actually had the webasto system in a bus conversion. Used long passive radiators along floorboards, no fans necessary. Boiler and pump unit was fairly small and would probably fit in the space where present water heater is.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #15 – October 07, 2017, 07:57:32 pm

Quote from: prfleming – October 07, 2017, 05:31:02 pm

These look like possible solutions.

Eberspacher

Webasto: Heating solutions for motorhomes and caravans

Some of those Espar units are fascinating. Found a couple of sites that showed class B units mounting them underneath the body, exposed to the outside, so it wouldn't even take up any interior space. A very interesting possibility.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #16 – October 07, 2017, 08:16:26 pm

When I was peterbilt we installed a lot of Webasto units. Interior heater was an airtop 2000 I beleive. Very small serviced every couple years but good parts availability. One tech took a used unit and put it in his one car garage for the winter it ran almost constant even thought the doors weren't opened he kept a boat in there. Fuel consumption was 5 gallons in four day running basically wide open. Engine heaters were bolted to the frame external.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #17 – October 08, 2017, 12:34:33 am

The Primus system that was installed in a very few Foretravels and many more Bluebirds, is similar to the Webasto, but runs on propane.
+or- 1 degree from the top to bottom or front to back of the coach. Run through the dash so you have heated windshield defrost and dash heat before you even start the engine. Base board heat along each side wall front to back . Heats the hot water tank and engine. Very stingy on DC power.
Two propane fired boilers take up less than 2'x2' area in the engine compartment under the isolator.
Foretravel ultimately chose the Aqua hot system over the Primus.
Now that Primus is no longer in business some Primus owners are switching there systems over to the Webasto diesel fired system.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #18 – October 08, 2017, 01:11:11 am

How about running the diesel genset and divert the heat from the radiator to provide heat for coach and hot water, heck tie into the very heavy engine block. Might be able to shut off the genset at 8 and coast thru the night using the battery bank and electric heaters in the bedroom.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #19 – October 08, 2017, 02:55:14 am

We still procrastinate about getting our Primus working again. Cannibalizing the system might not be that bad--put a new heater/pump to the existing plumbing. FT did a nice job of plumbing the coach throughout in the day. I'm still studying. For now, I'm avoiding the cool weather by leaving Rockford, IL tomorrow. Some smart geese flew over tonight--southbound.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #20 – October 08, 2017, 09:54:56 am

Quote from: rsihnhold – October 07, 2017, 01:40:16 pm

Has anyone on here converted their original propane furnace equipped Foretravel to a hydronic heating system such as Aquahot?

I'm also seeking pictures on the original Foretravel Aquahot installations regarding the Aquahot exhaust installation and routing, placement of air handlers in the wet bays, and how you supply fresh air to the Aquahot.

Hydronic systems like the AquaHot use more than air handlers - heated fluid pushed by the circulating pump runs to each fan (Cozy heat exchanger) and there are multiple heat exchangers and zones to plumb/wire. Seems like you'd be tearing into cabinetry, under closet flooring, etc.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #21 – October 08, 2017, 10:00:40 am

Webasto diesel to air heaters could be installed directly in place of each furnace with their own thermostats like the current furnace system. Boiler system could work if you put the heat exchangers where the furnaces are you could use the existing ducting.

Quick playing on the calculator I noticed I couldn't get the sizing up to a 36 foot unit.

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #22 – October 08, 2017, 01:40:53 pm

After reading through this whole thread, I'm thinking I would try to trade coaches and get a similar one with Aquahot. KISS

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #23 – October 08, 2017, 02:31:53 pm

Robert, I think it would help you to find someone with an AquaHot installed to see for yourself how it is done. Most of the heated coolant lines run along the inside top of the bays. The newer heat exchanger fans are very low current. Pump current draw is not much and they only run when the zone calls for heat. The burner blower is probably the highest draw. In the 30's and 40s with the living room zone on the burner/blower runs about 20 min once an hour or so. We have three heat exchangers in the LR but turn off the one in the dash. These run for pretty short periods of time. At mid 30s the electric heater is adequate. It you are running all of the zones and using a lot of hot water maybe not for a short period.

The wet bay has a heat exchange one each end. They are on the bathroom zone but have their own thermostat. Ours is set to about 40° and even down in the high 20s it rarely comes on.

We just came across Montana with overnight temps in the 20s. 3 hrs of engine preheat from the AH and our ISM11 started at about 105°. Very nice!

If you run the diesel for a single ambient to full heated cycle once a month all year you can expect the "annual" maint to last 2-3 years. I just replaced my clean burning nozzle at three years because I had other maintenance to do. The fuel pump was replaced in this model under an AH program and we replaced the igniter. Other than that just regualr use and maintenance.

Ours is between the front batteries and the LP tank behind the fuel tank. Not the easiest place to work but I get in there and do it. Easier I would think than changing batteries or working on them in that spot. Easier if I was a smaller person.

It would be a big project but doable. You can get rebuilt AH units from John Carrillo in Denver for less than new ones.

After more than 30 years with RV LP furnaces and now 6 with an AH we would be hard pressed to go back.

With a residential refrig you are probably going to want to increase total battery capacity mostly for the refrig. With 3 8Ds and an LP refrig we were OK over night even at zero just on batteries. With an AH and a res refrig you will want more battery capacity.

Roger

Re: Anyone converted to hydronic/Aquahot heating from original furnace?

Reply #24 – October 08, 2017, 02:37:32 pm

Always buy the coach you eventually want.. Conversions of heating, engine power, toilets, slides, etc to mimic other models are never as good and can be future maintenance problems.

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