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Topic: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger (Read 1256 times) previous topic - next topic

Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

I have no manual and can't find one online for this era of charger.. Does a Freedom/20 that likely came factory installed in my 1996 270 have Bulk, absorption, float charge capabilities?
Dub McBride 1996 270

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #1 –
YES.  But still has to be programmed (for battery type, size of battery bank and ambient temperature-- unless remote temperature sensor)


Earliest ones had dip switches on the inverter/charger itself.

Mid range on the back of the remote display (had to remove from the wall to access).

Newer ones programmable from the front of the remote panel.
Brett Wolfe
EX: 1993 U240
Moderator, ForeForum 2001-
Moderator Diesel RV Club 2002-
Moderator, FMCA Forum 2009-2020
Chairman FMCA Technical Advisory Committee 2011-2020

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #2 –
Thanks Brett.
Dub McBride 1996 270

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #3 –
Key part of a long term more reliable battery system is a battery temperature monitoring system.

My oem 97's heart freedom did not have that feature in it so I would think your 96 2000 watt does not either.

Hot weather requires lower voltages.  Cold weather higher.  Old machine cannot automatically adjust like the later ones.

Newer inverter with a BTMS will give a much longer battery life.  I also turned down my alternator to output 13.6 volts at the batteries to lower the amount of incorrect charging from it. 

Harder to temp control engine batteries charging as they are in the hot engine compartment area.  Not fixable.

Probably why Foretravel used optima red tops as their spiral wound design can maybe handle the heat and overcharging better than normal flat sided batteries in that area in that use.
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #4 –
Longer battery life is certainly an issue with the prices of 8D AGM's and keeping a battery properly charged is key to it's lasting. I will likely be looking closer at a newer model Inverter/Charger.
Dub McBride 1996 270

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #5 –
Be aware that you CAN program in ambient temperature-- I would sure not buy a newer inverter/charger just for automatic temperature control.

And, I do not know if your model can be fit with the external battery temperature sensor.  Look at the inverter/charger unit itself-- it may have a "telephone jack style" receptacle for the remote temperature sensor which could be added if you don't want to  reprogram as temperatures change dramatically (summer/winter).
Brett Wolfe
EX: 1993 U240
Moderator, ForeForum 2001-
Moderator Diesel RV Club 2002-
Moderator, FMCA Forum 2009-2020
Chairman FMCA Technical Advisory Committee 2011-2020

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #6 –
Quote from: Caflashbob –
Probably why Foretravel used optima red tops as their spiral wound design can maybe handle the heat and overcharging better than normal flat sided batteries in that area in that use.
I'm a big fan of Optimas, our M-34/78  Red Top AGMs are going on eight years. A lot of the success. is, Brett installed the Xantrex 'True-Charge 40+' with three stage charger with a dual battery bank output and remote wall-mount indicator. We use the Lifeline GPL- 8DL AGMs for the house. I don't know if it was OEM or Brett, but the front curbside battery has a 200 amp fuse.
1993 U-240 "La Villa Grande"..CAT 3116 w/ Pacbrake PRXB...Allison 3060 6-speed..
Previous: 1983 Airstream 310 turbo diesel, 1979 Airstream 280 turbo diesel
                                      Build # 4297
                                      PNW natives
                      Home base:  'Cactus Hug' (Ajo, Arizona)
                        DW Judy & Chet the wonder dog
                        Full-Timers 'Sailing the asphalt sea'

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #7 –
Quote from: mike leary –
We use the Lifeline GPL- 8DL AGMs for the house. I don't know if it was OEM or Brett, but the front curbside battery has a 200 amp fuse.

NOT OEM.  But with two largest 12 VDC loads on the house batteries being the generator and the jacks (both up front), this made sense.

Also good from a weight distribution stand point.
Brett Wolfe
EX: 1993 U240
Moderator, ForeForum 2001-
Moderator Diesel RV Club 2002-
Moderator, FMCA Forum 2009-2020
Chairman FMCA Technical Advisory Committee 2011-2020

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #8 –
Pictures eliminate guessing.  Freedom 20 came with several remote panels.

Attached may be your missing manuals:

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #9 –
Freedom inverters before serial 100,000 in the case of out Feb 97 built 97 is below the serial number to have the BTMS input.

In hot weather use the long overcharging can bulge the cases permanently from the internal gas build up.

So as Brett  posted you could alter the charging voltage to reflect the batteries actual temperature in a real time basis.

Undercharging in cold weather. Overcharging over 75 degrees lowers the battery life and the available amp hours.

If you go from power pedestal to pedestal the battery capacity retention is not as important versus you run on batteries a lot.

Coach came with gel batteries that can take over and undercharging better than the other types as they do not need  and can not be equalized. 

Undercharging AGM's cause lost capacity and only lifeline's can be equalized. 

So in cold weather a AGM battery charged without a BTMS may slowly lose capacity as the charging voltage should have been increased.

BTMS have been available for 20 years now.

Most issues I had long ago with owners satisfaction with their coaches were battery related.

The coach IS the 12 volt system.  Like I said unless you hardly use the 12 volt side?

We enjoy rving and dry camping
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #10 –
Dub, I took a chance and had my inverter rebuilt. Cost was $300.00. Its been working fine ever since. I check voltage alot more often. I had to buy new batteries because they were fried. Look for a shop in you area, and check to see if they are capable. Not everyone that sells them can fix them.
1995 U320 40', 2013 chevy sonic toad, my real love are corvettes have owned 30

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #11 –
Dub,

Do you have any reason to suspect that your inverter/charger is not working as it should?

Let us know when you locate the dip switches and are able to program it (see my post above).
Brett Wolfe
EX: 1993 U240
Moderator, ForeForum 2001-
Moderator Diesel RV Club 2002-
Moderator, FMCA Forum 2009-2020
Chairman FMCA Technical Advisory Committee 2011-2020

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #12 –
The non full wave output and the lack of a BTMS had me finally replace my still working heart freedom 25 a few years ago.

My local inverter rebuilder showed me in other inverters that the contactors inside all the units have their surfaces pit from use and the current transfer abilities are lessened.  Not as much output current. 

Plus the internal connections in the heart loosen in long use and need retightening and the dust inside needs cleaning out.

He then seals the boards themselves that were not sealed when new.

New magnum sw2812 and the old outback inverters have coated boards to my knowledge.

So not full wave power, no BTMS, lower output and future reliability issues finally convinced me to replace the 20 year old unit.

Especially as I had just replaced the three house gels with new mk 8g8d's and the projected life of the expensive batteries would be greatly extended for sure with the  BTMS available in the newer products.

My original magnum control panel Me-Rc is configured to allow the batteries to drop to 80% before starting the recharge cycle whick I think was the same in the link 2000 panel.

I have sourced a Me-Arc magnum panel which allows the user to program the amount of voltage drop the panel sees before starting the charge cycle from the non adjustable 80% to up to 99%. 

Have not installed it yet as my solar and combiner keep the batteries at full charge in dry storage.

Plugged in the newer inverters have additional cycles to ensure even longer battery life and reduce unnecessary cycling

Stops needless cycling of the battery.  100% to 80% then back for years if plugged in wears the batteries

Sorry about the extended post about these issues and differences but especially if renewing the batteries themselves the much extended life of the system can help defray the cost of the system upgrades.

Knowing what I know now I would have upgraded my coach much earlier. 

Microwave works much better and is quieter in full wave power.

"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #13 –
I don't have any issues that I'm aware of with the charger. My 8D AGMS are 2 months old and I have had no battery issues.. I looked on the unit's face  for a jack and there is nothing.. There is a phone jack type plug that I have showed a picture of on the remote display that I have been curious of since I bought the coach. It doesn't look OEM..I haven't had an opportunity to take the remote display down to look for dip switches but may today. While looking at the remote panel maybe some one can tell me what the intermatic timer switch is on the top right.. My objective is to take as good of care of the new batteries as I can, hopefully with the inverter charger I have.. Barry, I will look thru those manuals and see if one is for my unit..I would pay good money for the manuals for this coach and for the life of me I will never know why anyone would remove them from a coach but they do.

Dub McBride 1996 270

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #14 –
Dub,

I am guessing, but the "setup" on the front of the inverter remote panel suggests that programming is from the FRONT of the remote panel. Suggesting that it is not the age of the coach.

Plenty of on-line manuals for the remote panel.

http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/default/freedom-458-basic-remote.aspx
Brett Wolfe
EX: 1993 U240
Moderator, ForeForum 2001-
Moderator Diesel RV Club 2002-
Moderator, FMCA Forum 2009-2020
Chairman FMCA Technical Advisory Committee 2011-2020

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #15 –
The remote is the 458 remote which was a direct and improved replacement for the original remote panel There are no dip switches on the back to program. You do all the programming from the front of the panel. You should be able to download the manual for the 458 remote maybe from the Heart website. I will check if I still have a manual for the remote as I have several of the panels.
previous 1984 35 ft ORED 250 HP 3208 Cat       
previous 1998 40 ft U295 CAI 325 hp Cummins
previous 2003 40 Ft u320 build #6140 450 Cummins M11.                                                         
1999 Mazda Miata
Ron, Nancy, Tipper the cat, Max The dog
1997 U 270 36 ft build number 5174 8.3 Cummins

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #16 –
You are right on no dip switches on the back of the remote. I looked before reading your post. Good to know the model number of the one I have. Next I will take the panel off the unit. Thanks Ron
Dub McBride 1996 270

Re: Freedom/20 Inverter Charger

Reply #17 –
You need the manual to program what type of batteries you have. It has been to many years since I did it and I can't remember which buttons to push to change types of batteries and charging temps. Maybe on u tube someone can help.
previous 1984 35 ft ORED 250 HP 3208 Cat       
previous 1998 40 ft U295 CAI 325 hp Cummins
previous 2003 40 Ft u320 build #6140 450 Cummins M11.                                                         
1999 Mazda Miata
Ron, Nancy, Tipper the cat, Max The dog
1997 U 270 36 ft build number 5174 8.3 Cummins