2003 U320 Chassis batteries

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2003 U320 Chassis batteries

November 10, 2019, 01:34:15 am

Hey there fellow FT RVers!
Anyone ever changed out chassis batteries on an 38' FT 2003 U320? I located 3 Group 31 Deka batteries underneath the coach at the vent/grate behind the wheels on the driver's side (near the engine compartment). Unfortunately, they are crowded and awkwardly placed behind a cylindrical tank. Any tips or suggestions on replacing these suckers before I go under there and get medieval on them?
Michael

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #1 – November 10, 2019, 09:39:08 am

Might that cylindrical tank be the muffler?

If so, and you want to go down the "one thing leads to another" rabbit hole, search the forum for "resonator". More work and $, but it does make servicing the batteries MUCH easier on an '03 U320

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #2 – November 10, 2019, 10:48:22 am

Michael,
Yes, I had mine replaced. Took one look at the situation and promptly went to local battery store and said, " please replace my chassis batteries". No extra charge to replace the batteries.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #3 – November 10, 2019, 11:40:50 am

I agree with Michelle said. So much easier with the old muffler gone.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #4 – November 10, 2019, 04:12:41 pm

Are you sure that is muffler and not transmission cooler? I don't know if they (Foretravel) changed the location on the 03 model But on 99 model the muffler is on left(driver side) and trans cooler is on right (Passenger side) right behind the battery mount rack
Chris

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #5 – November 10, 2019, 04:33:47 pm

Quote from: Chris m lang – November 10, 2019, 04:12:41 pm

Are you sure that is muffler and not transmission cooler? I don't know if they (Foretravel) changed the location on the 03 model But on 99 model the muffler is on left(driver side) and trans cooler is on right (Passenger side) right behind the battery mount rack
Chris

03's have start batteries inboard and slightly fwd of the muffler on drivers side. I replaced my muffler with a resonator and this makes start battery change out much easier, and gives you some extra space to store hoses etc.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #6 – November 10, 2019, 07:02:35 pm

Ok, so I want to change the batteries. 2002 u320, I can see them, how do I get them out with the muffler in place.

Rod

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #7 – November 10, 2019, 09:51:45 pm

Quote from: mlawre – November 10, 2019, 01:34:15 am

Hey there fellow FT RVers!
Anyone ever changed out chassis batteries on an 38' FT 2003 U320? I located 3 Group 31 Deka batteries underneath the coach at the vent/grate behind the wheels on the driver's side (near the engine compartment). Unfortunately, they are crowded and awkwardly placed behind a cylindrical tank. Any tips or suggestions on replacing these suckers before I go under there and get medieval on them?
Michael

Quote from: Rodaboss on Sun Nov 10 2019 19:02:35 GMT-0500 (Eastern Standard Time)
Ok, so I want to change the batteries. 2002 u320, I can see them, how do I get them out with the muffler in place.

Rod

Michael/Rod,

Beyond one's physical condition, I guess that much of the challenge depends upon one's perspective and being able to use what is at hand or accumulate a facsimile.

I've only had one exercise with my start batteries (2002 U320 w/tag) and I think that my configuration is exactly the same as yours. I still have the stock OEM muffler and it is not a problem.

Removing and reinstalling the individual batteries really isn't a problem if you can bench press at least 65 to 70 lbs. You just block the chassis up as high as possible, use safety googles to keep dirt out of your eyes, lay on your back, disconnect the negative end of the battery bank first, then disconnect all of the batteries, jury rig a way to slide out and support one battery, slide it out, lower and fish the batteries out from in under the coach. By the third time around, it was happening for my complete set of three start batteries in less than (20) minutes.

We were at FOT, over a long weekend, waiting for FOT management's response to front end cap warranty issues, when, without any prior indications, the coach wouldn't start. The sudden failure to start was accompanied by indications of a failed battery, or a failed battery set connection-to-the-starter. The perfectly normal battery bank "rest" voltage would dip uncharacteristically low (to 6 or 7 Vdc) when called upon to start the coach and the starter wouldn't begin to turn the engine over.

I blocked the coach up and had the DW try starting while I took voltage readings directly at the battery terminals. The same uncharacteristic voltage dip was present there so I took all of the terminals off the three start batteries, cleaned them bright, re-dielectric greased and reassembled them. I had her try again. Same indications.

Laying on your back on a creeper under the coach, the individual batteries are not a problem to manipulate back and then out of the tray, but lowering one to the ground is not possible without some exceptional strength (at least for this 76 year old) or some ingenuity. For me, I was able to use my Pitbull motorcycle hydraulic lift jack, which we always have with us in the trailer, and the job was soon over with minimal effort.

The first trip out, the batteries came to a final rest voltage state with good voltages. They accepted a charge with normal indications from the small charger that I carry and they tested fine (95% capacity) at a local auto parts store. The test was completely electronic and highly suspect, but they went back into the coach anyway. Same indications upon trying to start. So then I reworked all of the ground, starter and associated connections. Same indications after doing that (which was much less accessible than the battery terminal work).

I handed the problem over to the FOT Maintenance/Service Foreman on Tuesday AM. After looking at everything carefully and walking through my failed attempts, he had an ih-45 pulled along side and tried to jump start our coach with jumper cables. That didn't work. Then they tried a long term fast idle with the ih-45 and another jump start attempt That showed absolutely no improvement. All of the indications remained the same. The only reasonable option left was to try different batteries.

My Group 31 Exide AGM batteries had been negotiated and installed by FOT, prior to our Nov. 2015 purchase of the consigned coach, following my own PDI. The problematic failure to start was on Memorial Day weekend of 2018, so the battery bank was quite a bit less than two and one half years old. The foreman said that they would try new batteries and "give me a break" if the confusing situation was resolved by installing new batteries. New Optima Group 31 Red Tops went in. Magically, the coach started perfectly normally.

A short while later, the Optima Red Top batteries had to come back out, because they represented an "upgrade" and FOT couldn't give me a break on an upgrade. So new Group 31 Exide AGM's went back in, and the coach has started correctly and normally, right though the present day. At the time, the only thing that we could surmise was that one (or, less likely, more than one) of the start battery bank was breaking down internally under heavy (start) current loading.

So that's the good news. The bad news was that the end cap warranty work negotiations ended up a bust, the "treating me right" on the batteries was a bust (full FOT price - $900), the flooring and tile quote that we looked forward to from Flanagan's Shop was an "over-the-top" bust due to better materials and price from both MOT and Integrity.

By the way, that cylindrical tank IS your OEM muffler and, as noted, it doesn't interfere with the battery handling method outlined above. I do suspect, though, that the OEM muffler IS the cause of the early failure of one or more of my engine start battery bank batteries. On our last trip out west, during summer months, I temperature checked the muffler numerous times, using a Fluke IR gun, and found temperatures exceeding 500 degrees F. The muffler is only inches away from the battery set and I believe that is the root cause of the early failures. My batteries have never been abused otherwise, and yet they have failed prematurely.

HTH,
Neal

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #8 – November 10, 2019, 10:12:47 pm

Neil,

A fantastic write up. I'm encouraged to try. I may well look at a resonator upgrade as well.

Thanks so much. Love this Forum!

Rod

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #9 – November 11, 2019, 09:34:43 am

Quote from: Rodaboss – November 10, 2019, 10:12:47 pm

Neil,

A fantastic write up. I'm encouraged to try. I may well look at a resonator upgrade as well.

Here's ours (note that we did swap the original Aero 5050XL for a Magnaflow not too many months later - more "civilized" sound and no difference in performance/outcome:

Resonator and muffler replacement

Resonator Installation

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #10 – November 11, 2019, 10:14:50 am

You make it easy Michelle.

Rod

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #11 – November 11, 2019, 10:20:28 am

What Magnaflow did you buy?

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #12 – November 11, 2019, 12:16:55 pm

Thanks to all for your comments!

Michelle, it might be the muffler but not sure! After searching 30 min for the batteries with limited time I did not inspect. I will confirm next time I'm up there.

Horace, thanks for the suggestion. Your local shop sounds like they go above and beyond any of ours. None of them around me will do this on a motor coach. Our O'Reily's guy laughed and said only if it was "super accessible". But a confounding factor is that ours is dead at the storage facility. So, I'd still have to tow it there in hopes that they might entertain me!

Neal, thanks so much for you thoughtful and informative description! I too have a similar situation of trying to get the RV to MOT for maintenance but upon going to get it ship ready, it wouldn't start up at the storage facility. I think our issue is that the battery disconnect was left on with the coach sitting for 9 mo (I've ruined many batteries this way). I had a local mobile RV service try to jump but the batteries he had on hand were not enough with the voltage dropping <10 upon start. After being charged $122 for the "service" they said they would have to do a replacement another day but still have not heard back from them.

So this brings me to the conundrum deciding to tow or do it myself. I might even try to jump it with the new batteries first, but I'm not so optimistic given the failed earlier attempts. So, based on your description, I will likely be doing the replacement on my own.
Wish me luck. I will post some photos win or lose so that maybe it might help some other chap in the same position!

Many thanks!
Michael

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #13 – November 11, 2019, 12:57:09 pm

Quote from: Rodaboss – November 11, 2019, 10:20:28 am

What Magnaflow did you buy?

I will have to check our records - I do know it was basically the same dimensions as the Aero 5050XL

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #14 – November 11, 2019, 01:01:50 pm

Quote from: jcus – November 10, 2019, 04:33:47 pm

03's have start batteries inboard and slightly fwd of the muffler on drivers side. I replaced my muffler with a resonator and this makes start battery change out much easier, and gives you some extra space to store hoses etc.

Not all '03's are configured that way Jim. Mine are behind the compartment door that's curbside just ahead of the rear tires, along with the Haldex air dryer.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #15 – November 11, 2019, 01:02:34 pm

Our eBay records say 12774 - 30" long, 24"body, 5" inlet and outlet

Amazon.com: MagnaFlow 12774 Exhaust Muffler: Automotive

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #16 – November 11, 2019, 01:03:17 pm

Quote from: Travelin' Man – November 11, 2019, 01:01:50 pm

Not all '03's are configured that way Jim. Mine are behind the compartment door that's curbside just ahead of the rear tires, along with the Haldex air dryer.

Might be difference between ISL400 and the ISM450

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #17 – November 11, 2019, 01:49:21 pm

Quote from: Travelin' Man – November 11, 2019, 01:01:50 pm

Not all '03's are configured that way Jim. Mine are behind the compartment door that's curbside just ahead of the rear tires, along with the Haldex air dryer.

You are right, should had specified 320 like the OP has, but he did mention batteries were on drivers side at the vent/grate. Michelle is right, different engines, so different layout.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #18 – November 11, 2019, 02:03:31 pm

Yes, the design and lay-out on the 38 foot chassis with tag axle was quite unusual. The chassis batteries on this model were a real challenge to access.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #19 – November 11, 2019, 05:08:34 pm

Quote from: mlawre – November 11, 2019, 12:16:55 pm

So this brings me to the conundrum deciding to tow or do it myself.

Do what ever you can to keep from having the coach towed. Chances are if towed you will have more problems than just batteries. Get a local coach to recommend a couple of players that need to do community service or look for a local trade school for help if you need help.

Mike

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #20 – November 11, 2019, 09:39:34 pm

Try to get the generator running so it can charge the house batteries and then use the boost switch to get the engine started.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #21 – November 11, 2019, 10:52:08 pm

Yes, concentrate on getting the genset running. It can dump a large charge in the batteries. When it's running engage engine preheat.

Now might be a great time to try one of the ultracapacitor jump starters, even though it seems dubious they are used to start hd diesels. Diesel - LICAP Technologies | LICAP Technologies, Inc.. Way cheaper than a tow in so many ways.

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #22 – November 26, 2019, 11:11:45 am

Dear RV folks,
Thanks to all for suggestions to help with our battery problems. I did manage to start the coach up by running the generator for 6+ hours and boosting with house batteries.

This was after I attempted to remove the chassis batteries without success. The 3 are located on a trey behind the muffler bolted to the chassis. A conduit sleeve of wires rests on top so it is near impossible to lift and remove the batteries without lowering the trey, and the bolts are located in places that I'm sure were not meant for adult sized people or non mechanics to be reaching for especially if stranded on the side of the road with a red-hot muffler. I have photos but haven't figured out how to upload them to the post.

Now dealing with filling the air tanks to actually allow me to drive it into the shop but that is for another topic...

Thanks again for your help!

Michael

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #23 – November 26, 2019, 11:54:54 am

Jumper cables (#1 gauge) will start the diesel after connecting to a car and fast idling for a few minutes. I just noticed a 20 foot set of #1 cables for $30 at a local store yesterday.

P

Re: 2003 U320 Chassis batteries

Reply #24 – November 26, 2019, 07:11:43 pm

Quote from: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart – November 26, 2019, 11:54:54 am

Jumper cables (#1 gauge) will start the diesel after connecting to a car and fast idling for a few minutes. I just noticed a 20 foot set of #1 cables for $30 at a local store yesterday.

P

Thanks Pierce,
Only had 4G cables on hand but that hooked to my Optima 8037 Yellow top plus JNCAIR 1700 Jump box could not start it.

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