Retarder signaling brake controller

Topic: Retarder signaling brake controller (Read 1470 times) previous topic - next topic

Retarder signaling brake controller

April 10, 2020, 04:05:47 pm

Went on a test run with my cargo trailer with electric brakes and sure enough the brake controller is activated and causing the trailer brakes to come on. This does not have the relay in the side compartment as some. Anyone know what the relay I can unplug looks like and says on it? How many prongs will it have?
Thanks

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #1 – April 10, 2020, 07:49:14 pm

Quote from: dans96u295ft – April 10, 2020, 04:05:47 pm

Went on a test run with my cargo trailer with electric brakes and sure enough the brake controller is activated and causing the trailer brakes to come on. This does not have the relay in the side compartment as some. Anyone know what the relay I can unplug looks like and says on it? How many prongs will it have?
Thanks

Some have found relay, under the carpeted panel at the drivers seat feet area, remove it, and you may find it. Screws are buried in the carpet.

Sometimes we mounted it there. You can trace the wires down to the brake light switches in the lower compartment. You may be able to disconnect them.

If Aubrey is still at MOT give him a call.

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #2 – April 10, 2020, 08:19:10 pm

Will my trailer brake lights still come on with it disconnected

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #3 – April 10, 2020, 08:50:06 pm

Quote from: dans96u295ft – April 10, 2020, 08:19:10 pm

Will my trailer brake lights still come on with it disconnected

Yes

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #4 – April 10, 2020, 09:19:41 pm

Mine was where gracerace said, behind the panel left of the steering column by my feet

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #5 – April 10, 2020, 10:00:21 pm

Are saying you can get at the switches from inside. My floor is tiled.

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #6 – April 10, 2020, 10:44:28 pm

Quote from: hdff – April 10, 2020, 09:19:41 pm

Mine was where gracerace said, behind the panel left of the steering column by my feet

Yup, see those crimp ends? Those are the 3 added on wires.

We installed them above and below, depended what day it was!

That is not one of my installs, would have had heat shrink!

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #7 – April 10, 2020, 10:45:16 pm

Quote from: oldguy – April 10, 2020, 10:00:21 pm

Are saying you can get at the switches from inside. My floor is tiled.

No, it's the piece that is vertical in front of brake and gas pedal.

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #8 – April 11, 2020, 12:13:54 am

Ok. So I'm confused. I thought it was a plug in relay? Do I just remove those 3 crimped wires and store them? 2 whites and a red?

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #9 – April 11, 2020, 12:25:34 am

Just take either 2 wires off one of the lugs and tape them up, that will break the circuit.

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #10 – April 11, 2020, 09:25:15 am

Either two wires as in both white wires? or just one white wire?

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #11 – April 11, 2020, 09:32:48 am

Quote from: dans96u295ft – April 11, 2020, 09:25:15 am

Either two wires as in both white wires? or just one white wire?

The relay, is what sends a brake signal to the brake light switch's from the retarder joy stick. Removing the relay, or disconnecting the white wires will do the trick, if you can't find the relay.

You can see Keith's relay unplugged in his picture

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #12 – April 11, 2020, 09:41:23 am

If the relay is disconnected will the retarder still take the trans out of cruise.

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #13 – April 11, 2020, 10:10:32 am

Great. Thanks. I'll look today

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #14 – April 11, 2020, 02:33:21 pm

Quote from: oldguy – April 11, 2020, 09:41:23 am

If the relay is disconnected will the retarder still take the trans out of cruise.

No, that is the beauty of it.

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #15 – April 11, 2020, 03:41:21 pm

I think I will add another pressure switch for the trailer brake controller

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #16 – April 11, 2020, 08:12:13 pm

And the 2 white wires that I'm storing should be coming from the joy stick area next to he driver?

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #17 – April 11, 2020, 10:54:49 pm

A friend of mine thinks my Prodigy P2 brake controller has a setting called hydraulic that will fix the problem. I'll try it and report back

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #18 – April 12, 2020, 09:00:52 pm

Quote from: dans96u295ft – April 11, 2020, 08:12:13 pm

And the 2 white wires that I'm storing should be coming from the joy stick area next to he driver?

White wires come from the relay to the brake light switch.

Prodigy P2 controller, is not going to solve the problem.

If you don't/can't remove the brake light signal form the retarder, then I suggest you do what " Old guy" said. Add another pressure switch for the brake control.

Chris

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #19 – April 12, 2020, 10:19:59 pm

Well, that sucks. Mine must be behind the drivers left kick panel below the retarder joystick panel. How does this come out. It appears to be a solid piece of wood without screws? Don't find anything above the foot pedals that resembles a brake switch with white wires

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #20 – April 12, 2020, 11:11:07 pm

Quote from: dans96u295ft – April 12, 2020, 10:19:59 pm

Well, that sucks. Mine must be behind the drivers left kick panel below the retarder joystick panel. How does this come out. It appears to be a solid piece of wood without screws? Don't find anything above the foot pedals that resembles a brake switch with white wires

There are maybe 4 to 6 screws in the carpet. Use a magnet to find them. They are square head drive. It's the vertical panel in front of the brake and gas pedal, not below retarder joy stick
Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #21 – April 13, 2020, 12:16:48 am

Ok. I'll look again

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #22 – April 13, 2020, 09:51:29 am

One thing not mentioned. With the retarder separated from the brake lights, the retarder will make the coach act like it has an active cruise control.

I find that when the cruise is set, and the joy stick is in the middle position, the coach maintains a steady speed, even going down hill.

I normally run at the legal speed limit, or 5 miles per mile over. This way as the coach speeds up on a down hill run, it slows the coach nicely maintaining the legal speed limit, where cops usually set up speed traps.

Just sayin'

Chris

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #23 – April 13, 2020, 11:22:42 am

This issue was a problem with the old US Brake System. Their solution was to place a Diode at the brake pedal between the brake light and the brake system. This caused the restriction of back flow from retarder to brake lights and permitted the flow when brake pedal pressed. I have one on my coach since new and works like a charm. I don't need it any more because I use SMI system.

Re: Retarder signaling brake controller

Reply #24 – April 13, 2020, 12:10:33 pm

Quote from: esaulten – April 13, 2020, 11:22:42 am

This issue was a problem with the old US Brake System. Their solution was to place a Diode at the brake pedal between the brake light and the brake system. This caused the restriction of back flow from retarder to brake lights and permitted the flow when brake pedal pressed. I have one on my coach since new and works like a charm. I don't need it any more because I use SMI system.

Good info, but that is not what the issue is here.

The retarder, is sending a signal directly to the brake light switch, which causes the brake lights to activate.

The brake control needs a signal from brake activation to work.

Most early coaches, like my 97, and his 96 had, had the joy stick added as an option, either at the factory, but most likely at the dealer. Later as the coaches started coming from the factory with the joy stick standard, they were wired differently.

Chris

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