Adding a Jake brake

Topic: Adding a Jake brake (Read 4430 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #25 – June 22, 2020, 07:05:15 am

Nope. My '99 is a Celect Plus.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #26 – June 22, 2020, 10:43:36 am

I am going to call Cummins today, I need to make sure of the wiring and talk about getting the computer set up.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #27 – June 22, 2020, 11:08:22 am

Post the model of your engine after you speak to them. If you have an old stock '97 engine it would be a select plus. I don't know how far in advance Foretravel was stocking engines.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #28 – June 22, 2020, 09:39:18 pm

I talked to Cummins this afternoon. My engine is a Plus Celect M11. It looks like I just have to wire it up and it should be good to go.
If I want the Jake to work automatically on cruise I might have to go in. While I was checking the engine out yesterday I noticed the
Tac wasn't working but it was on the Silver Leaf. I also today welded a crack on the engine oil fill tube. It has been welded before
so when I put it back tomorrow I will see it I can install a brace.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #29 – June 23, 2020, 03:10:12 pm

Looking for wires going to the back. I have 4 right at the rear of the coach that aren't being used but EX4 2088 wire must be broken
as there is no continuity. Wires EX1, EX2, EX3 and EX4 38492 they are with 2088 wires under the dash does anyone know where they go.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #30 – June 23, 2020, 06:47:56 pm

Thanks to Craneman he sent me a message to check my book and the 38492 go up to the TV. The book also states that 3 wires
go up to the middle dash from the EUC. Now it I could only find them. The EUC has written on it Celect Plus. Working around
the EUC and figgering out wires from that, is going to be harder than installing the Jake.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #31 – June 24, 2020, 05:36:18 pm

Well I have been working on figgering out how to wire the ECU for the Jake Brake. The 2 wires going the the Jake is real easy. Just had to plug it in and the wires going to the switches I think I know how. As I'm going out to Cummins to pick up some female clips
to attach the wires to the ECU the service tech said he will make sure I get it wright. We have a really good service tech here. He knows
his stuff. I also ordered a foot peddle from Amazon so I will be able to run manually or have it come on when the throttle is released
which will work that way on cruise.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #32 – June 27, 2020, 10:47:43 pm

Got the wiring done at the ECU today. Picked up wire clips for the ECU and hooked up two of the extra wires from the rear of the
coach. The third wire I need goes from the ECU to the IPX Master wiper controller which is a common ground. So the rear of the
coach is done and all wires are run. The foot peddle has come and I will wire it parallel to the on/off Jake switch. So when the
switch is on it will work automatically and when the switch is off it will work manually from the floor switch. I just have install all the
switches and hook up the wires and its done.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #33 – June 28, 2020, 08:03:39 pm

Finished the wiring today. The switches are really handy. The selector switch is a 3 position switch but only 2 work. A a M11 is
has only 3 cylinders or 6 cylinders. That was the switch that was in the truck the the Jake came from. The foot switch isn't screwed
down yet. I will drive it before so I know were it works the best. I will tile it some day to match the floor. I will post after I drive
how it works. That will be a few weeks away. Tomorrow start another project.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #34 – June 29, 2020, 11:58:19 am

Old Guy (that could apply to most of us),

Our Jake switch also has three positions, OFF, 3 cylinders or all 6 cylinders. I just keep it on the 6 cyl position. Your engine is 2 liters larger than ours so you may get a bigger benefit from the 3 cylinder position.

Pierce

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #35 – June 29, 2020, 02:22:48 pm

Major difference in engine braking I would think between a 552 inch v6 2 stroke and a 659 inch inline 6 four stroke engine.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #36 – June 29, 2020, 03:01:02 pm

But we don't live down in "Shaky Town" where it's so flat a tsunami would flood all the way to Vegas. We don't have a flat spot for 60 miles until we get to Sacramento. Our little 9 liter with toad does great with the Jake. Could not ask for more.

But, an 11 liter 4 cycle engine would allow a heavier coach and toad to go on the same roads so I have to grudgingly agree.

Just a case of North vs South.

Pierce

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #37 – June 29, 2020, 03:24:08 pm

Seems on the jake the bigger the torque the more the retardation?

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #38 – June 29, 2020, 03:47:23 pm

The Detroit 2 cycles unlike a 2 stroke motorcycle are torque kings at low RPM. It's mostly cubic inches that determine the amount of Jake breaking the engine has.

In a gasoline car, it's vacuum that slows the vehicle. With a diesel it's the compression that does the trick. As the piston comes up to the top of the compression stroke, an actuator opens the exhaust valve(s) just before TDC and the high pressure in the cylinder is released so all the work done by compressing the air goes into a braking effect. The bigger the displacement and the higher the RPM, the more braking you get from a Jake. With a 2 stroke diesel, the Jake gets to take advantage of the engine compression on each stroke. With a 4 stroke, every other stroke. I would be interesting to put two engines of the same displacement with one a two stroke and the other a four stroke and see which one developed the more braking effect.

Better than my explanation: http://www.svfd.net/SVFD%20Files/Articles/Engineer/An%20engine%20brake%20is%20a%20hydraulically-operated%20device%20on%20a%20diesel.pdf

Pierce

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #39 – June 29, 2020, 04:36:29 pm

Quote from: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart – June 29, 2020, 11:58:19 am

Old Guy (that could apply to most of us),

Our Jake switch also has three positions, OFF, 3 cylinders or all 6 cylinders. I just keep it on the 6 cyl position. Your engine is 2 liters larger than ours so you may get a bigger benefit from the 3 cylinder position.

Old guy, I got that nickname from mountain biking when in my fifties when I was doing black diamond runs and in my sixties I was
doing double back diamond runs.
I don't know where I will leave the switch. In the one position at first. And you later post what works the best with the Jake, 2 cycle
or 4 cycle. A good question.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #40 – June 29, 2020, 04:41:15 pm

Quote from: Pierce & Gaylie Stewart – June 29, 2020, 03:47:23 pm

With a 4 stroke, every other stroke. I would be interesting to put two engines of the same displacement with one a two stroke and the other a four stroke and see which one developed the more braking effect.

Pierce

My experience back in the 70's hauling lumber in PNW with 80,000lbs. 1st. trucks I could afford had 2 stroke Detroit's ~~ 8v71@318h.p. & 8v92@435 later years 4 stroke Cummins ntc400 & Cat 3406@425, hands down the 4 stroke inline 6's had more braking affect than 2 strokes. Granite the inline-6's were 14 liter vs 12 and smaller on the V's.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #41 – August 19, 2020, 11:26:17 pm

Well I've finally got to try out the Jake Brake. At around 1300 RPM it feels like an exhaust brake and when I shift down and the
RPM goes up it really pulls the coach down. It will be awhile before I get to try it on big long hills.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #42 – August 21, 2020, 05:53:13 pm

When you finally got to try it out was that using three or six cylinder position. Really looking forward to a review once you have operated it on some larger downhills. Total hours install estimate, and a ball park cost to perform installation. More is always better when it comes to stopping. What a great addition to your coach. IMO
Scott

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #43 – August 21, 2020, 06:39:18 pm

It took me around 5 hours to remove it from the old truck and I know putting it in the coach was way easier. I did it by myself but
if you had a partner for setting the valve, injectors and the Jake that part would take 1/4 of the time. 2 wires need to be added to
the ECU so I went to Cummins for the wire pigtails ( part # 3822919). The pigtails go into the EUC plug and the Jake wiring is right
where its needed. Then I had to find 3 wires to go up to the dash. I could have probably could have got away with 2 as it is a
common ground, but you can never have to much ground and the other 2 go to the on and off switch and the other when to
the switch that give 3 or 6 cylinders. The foot peddle goes on the incoming side of the on off switch. If I did it again it would be a
lot quicker. The actual time it took was probably 8 hours.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #44 – August 21, 2020, 06:41:22 pm

Also I never had to go to Cummins to have it set up which made me happy. The trip so far there hasn't been any hills.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #45 – August 21, 2020, 07:42:21 pm

Again a great addition to your coach. I think it will make the end of my long list, but I definitely like it. Was getting a doner truck Difficult to find? Any idea what a ballpark cost would be?
Scott

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #46 – August 22, 2020, 11:01:53 am

I know when I was looking Vander Haag's had them on for $1890.00. I bought mine for $2000.00 Canadian which I found through
Craigs List. I didn't mine removing it as I learned a lot from taking the old on out. I took the switches so the only thing I had
to buy was the 2 connectors for the EUC. I think they were $12 each. I had been looking for about 6 months. I wanted to find the
Jake in Canada to save on import charges.

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #47 – August 22, 2020, 01:14:48 pm

Been thinking about adding a jake for a long time. Thanks for your post.

On second thought I probably would just go faster down grades.

I like the part about really pulling the coach down at revs.

Do you have stock exhaust?

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #48 – August 22, 2020, 03:11:45 pm

A retarder and a Jake. Now that's what I call a sweet setup. On our last rig we had a one stage Jake which I changed to a two stage. I found the 3 cylinder setting going down those looong but not too steep hills was perfect. Now you just need to add hydraulic jacks to complement your air leveling system!
jor

Re: Adding a Jake brake

Reply #49 – August 22, 2020, 03:45:06 pm

I don't ever remember turning our Jake off. Noise with the stock muffler is fine anywhere.

Pierce

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