Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Topic: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue (Read 1803 times) previous topic - next topic

Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

July 30, 2020, 12:26:14 pm

This issue has good pictures of old and new bracket, with welded supports on new bracket.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/922563977854351/permalink/2971236492987079/?sfnsn=mo

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #1 – July 30, 2020, 01:55:39 pm

These were my photo's, another forum member had theirs fall off is the way I became aware of the issue. Researching the ol' mighty forum I found this very old post regarding the "known" issue. After checking mine and finding the shelf weld was unsupported I ordered the new bracket from Foretravel.

Broken Retarder Accumulator Bracket

https://www.foreforums.com/index.php?action=media;sa=media;in=3403

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #2 – July 30, 2020, 04:08:41 pm

Great info. Thanks. I wasn't aware of this problem. Just finished another project this AM (door latch kits), and then put the coach up on ramps/safety blocks to repair leaking fan motors, install a wax capsule controller, and a new floating bundle trans cooler, etc, etc. I'll take a look at that bracket right after lunch. If it doesn't have gussets, I'll pull it and paste some on.

Greg

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #3 – July 30, 2020, 04:19:37 pm

Quote from: MisterEd – July 30, 2020, 04:08:41 pm

repair leaking fan motors, install a wax capsule controller, and a new floating bundle trans cooler

Greg

When you get around to it would like to hear more about these projects

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #4 – July 30, 2020, 04:49:52 pm

We've a '98 320 and will have this bracket inspected come fall. What is the recommended fix? A reweld? new bracket from FT?, or can existing bracket be bolted to the frame?

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #5 – July 30, 2020, 06:13:41 pm

Add the gussets and it will be just like the new style.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #6 – July 30, 2020, 06:32:53 pm

I'll instruct the service guys to do just that. I'd be chagrined and forlorn without that transmission retarder.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #7 – July 30, 2020, 10:18:17 pm

Took a looksee at our accumulator bracket this PM. It has gussets. Not sure if it's a factory replacement, or private "fix", but the horizontal welds on both gussets have stress cracks running the entire length. Dunno if I would have noticed this without the information provided. Thanks! I'll pull it, cut the gussets off, and weld-on some larger ones. Might as well trim the fat while it's off; plenty of extra steel/sharp corners on there that's not doing anything....except waiting to open-up my knuckles at an inopportune time.

Conclusion: Even if your accumulator bracket has gussets, IMO, it would be wise to inspect it anyways.

Greg

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #8 – July 30, 2020, 10:38:44 pm

Jack, Bill. I saw your post this morning and checked the coach during the day and although there are no cracks in mine it will be coming off this week for rework. The bracket was only welded on one side and unsupported. Will have more than enough room to add nice brackets to prevent it from being liberated from the coach.
Thanks for saving me a bunch of money or even more.
Scott

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #9 – July 30, 2020, 11:04:28 pm

Thanks for this post I will check mine.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #10 – July 31, 2020, 12:03:53 am

Mister Ed "Might as well trim the fat while it's off; plenty of extra steel/sharp corners on there that's not doing anything"
Everything I own Gets fat, fat, fat. I go to great lengths to loose a couple ounces here and there but it always gets fatter with bigger and more. I could never design a plane, too fat to fly! Yes I was going to cut it down before I made it fatter. Really glade you got ahead of yours. Would like some pictures of the failing part. How many miles on your coach?
Scott

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #11 – July 31, 2020, 02:01:33 am

Quote from: Bill and Marsha – July 30, 2020, 04:19:37 pm

When you get around to it would like to hear more about these projects

Will do. Here's the link to the trans cooler project: Rocore Floating Bundle Trans Cooler On the Cheap
I was going to post an update there tonight.... but I left the danged camera in the shop...again. Tomorrow

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #12 – July 31, 2020, 02:05:21 am

Quote from: dsd – July 31, 2020, 12:03:53 am

Would like some pictures of the failing part. How many miles on your coach?
Scott

I'll post some before and after pics, once I get to repairing it. Just over 100k miles.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #13 – July 31, 2020, 08:02:16 am

1998 thru 2007 Cummins 450 or 500 HP M11 or ISM.
From Bill's orig pdf of Foretravel bulletin.

Bill's orig picture of before and after bracket.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #14 – July 31, 2020, 04:49:50 pm

Took a couple of pics this AM. As can be seen, the cracks are obvious, the welds are poor (not my first choice of descriptive words), and gussets are puny, compared to what Bill posted.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #15 – July 31, 2020, 05:02:48 pm

All the welds visible look shaky at best, the long bead looks distinctly like downhand wirefeed, no bite, no strength.
IMEO

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #16 – July 31, 2020, 06:11:20 pm

Greg, mine does not have the webs. Also without removing it feels like the backside is unwelded. Lazy slackers. I think there is enough room to extend the web to the second set of attach bolts on the top side and easily weld the inside 20% on each end without clearance issues. 100% close the webs. Should never fail after that. Really wanted to work on that rather than floors and interior stuff but I'll be done soon. Hate flooring.
Great catch!
Scott

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #17 – July 31, 2020, 06:31:42 pm

Scott where do I look for this bracket?

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #18 – July 31, 2020, 07:58:58 pm

Quote from: Roger & Susan in Home2 – July 31, 2020, 06:31:42 pm

Scott where do I look for this bracket?

On a 1999 320 the hydraulic accumulator is curbside adjacent to the bell housing. the accumulator is mounted on what looks to be about 1/4 plate which includes a 90 degree "bracket" welded to it. It is only welded on one side and subject to failure, see the links I posted in reply #1. Hope this helps

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #19 – July 31, 2020, 09:02:17 pm

The coach won't leave the yard until that is addressed. Thanks for the warning on this problem.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #20 – July 31, 2020, 09:41:58 pm

Bill, looking at the third photo it's hardly welded on the front, I would guess that if you were to remove it it should come off very easily, frankly I can't believe it's still there! When I had my fabrication shop if anyone had laid a bead that bad and left it, they would be looking for a new job elsewhere. I'm sorry but there's no excuse for that kind of shoddy work and if that's the standard of gluing done on the U series then I'm relieved that we have an ORED.
Since 1968 when I started my apprenticeship I have been weld and fabrication certified by
Lloyd's of London
British War Department
US Department of Defense
That's the s#@te that people who think they can weld and fit give you !
Rant Over.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #21 – July 31, 2020, 10:03:07 pm

Quote from: Olde English – July 31, 2020, 09:41:58 pm

Bi

......looking at the third photo it's hardly welded on the front, I would guess..... I can't believe it's still there! When I had my fabrication shop if anyone had laid a bead that bad and left it, they would be looking for a new job elsewhere. I'm sorry but there's no excuse for that kind of shoddy work and if that's the standard of......

Some trivia from long ago. Country Coach, in Junction City, Oregon, wanted to have their CC Magna certified by the Univ. of California for full time living. After turning a unit over to them, they ended up following many of the University's recommendations. The one they could not do, (they said due to cost) was the recommendation to "only allow certified welders to weld." Since most welders at CC were paid at, or a little above minimum wage, that never happened, and they never received certification from the University.

Re: Older U320 Retarder Bracket Issue

Reply #22 – July 31, 2020, 10:40:49 pm

Quote from: Olde English – July 31, 2020, 09:41:58 pm

Bill, looking at the third photo it's hardly welded on the front, I would guess that if you were to remove it it should come off very easily, frankly I can't believe it's still there! When I had my fabrication shop if anyone had laid a bead that bad and left it, they would be looking for a new job elsewhere. I'm sorry but there's no excuse for that kind of shoddy work and if that's the standard of gluing done on the U series then I'm relieved that we have an ORED.
Since 1968 when I started my apprenticeship I have been weld and fabrication certified by
Lloyd's of London
British War Department
US Department of Defense
That's the s#@te that people who think they can weld and fit give you !
Rant Over.

Certainly doesn't seem like Foretravel quality, does it? Maybe it looked better new and somewhere along the line someone added their handy work to the weld. Either way poor design to begin with.

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