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Topic: Start battery would not start engine.  (Read 654 times) previous topic - next topic

Start battery would not start engine.

Hi
First time using MH since Branson Grandvention. Plugged in all thru winter, started it about once a month and it fired up instantly each time.
Had been having start issues and discovered during Grandvention that the Trik-L-Charge to keep the engine battery charged from the coach batteries was the issue and not working. There was a beefier one in the Granvention parts trailer and we had it fitted: life was good.
Problem:
Left home on Friday, motorhome started up instantly, stayed in park for two nights, plugged into 50 amp and when we went to leave the engine would not crank, turned over slowly, clicking and no go.
Boost: did nothing
Started the generator and a few minutes and the engine started immediately,
Now at a new campground, parked waited 30 minutes and coach fired up.
Question:
What drained or could have drained  or might still be draining our engine batteries so quickly?
Any ideas appreciated
David
David & Emma Roche
Dino (Golden Doodle)
1999 U270 WTFE 36' Build # 5534
Xtreme "Lights, Stripes & Roof"
Motorcade# 18321
Dayton, Ohio
Towd: Jeep Grand Cherokee
Two Townie Electra Bikes

Life is made to enjoy, the Foretravel helps!

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #1 –
How old is the start battery? Which type?
1993 U225 Build #: 4285
500 Watts Solar
Honda CRV AWD
Former 1981 Foretravel Travco
Retired, Full Time Off Grid Snowbird

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #2 –
Two batteries
Lead acid
One year old installed by MOT
David & Emma Roche
Dino (Golden Doodle)
1999 U270 WTFE 36' Build # 5534
Xtreme "Lights, Stripes & Roof"
Motorcade# 18321
Dayton, Ohio
Towd: Jeep Grand Cherokee
Two Townie Electra Bikes

Life is made to enjoy, the Foretravel helps!

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #3 –
Need to check all connections at the batteries. Especially the ground wire.
previous 1984 35 ft ORED 250 HP 3208 Cat       
previous 1998 40 ft U295 CAI 325 hp Cummins
previous 2003 40 Ft u320 build #6140 450 Cummins M11.                                                         
1999 Mazda Miata
Ron, Nancy, Tipper the cat, Max The dog
1997 U 270 36 ft build number 5174 8.3 Cummins

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #4 –
Quote from: "Irish" –
Had been having start issues...discovered...the Trik-L-Charge...was...not working. There was a beefier one in the Granvention parts trailer and we had it fitted...
...motorhome started up instantly, stayed in park for two nights, plugged into 50 amp and when we went to leave the engine would not crank, turned over slowly, clicking and no go.
Boost: did nothing
Started the generator and a few minutes and the engine started immediately,
Question:
What drained or could have drained  or might still be draining our engine batteries so quickly?
I'm not seeing an obvious indication that your start batteries were drained, because you report seemingly inconsistent symptoms.

The "beefier" charger you had fitted seemed to be working well, because the "motorhome started up instantly".

But then, after 2 nights plugged in to 50A, engine would not crank - exhibiting signs of low cranking voltage.

Your coach batteries should have been fully charged after 2 nights plugged in (unless your inverter/battery charger was turned off).
So, if your coach batteries were fully charged, why didn't activating your BOOST switch supply more than enough power to crank the engine?

But then, you started the generator and a few minutes later the big engine cranked immediately.
All starting the generator does is power the inverter/charger to charge the batteries, but a "few minutes" of charging wouldn't cure deeply discharged starting batteries.

I would look at both ends of the positive cable going to the starter for possible loose connections.  Might explain the somewhat random start/no start events.

I would also recommend the installation of two small digital volt meters somewhere on the dash.  One connects to start battery bank, and the other to coach battery bank.
It is extremely helpful to be able to glance at the meters and instantly see the relative SOC in each battery bank.
I know Pierce is a big fan of these small volt meters, and so am I.

Amazon.com : mini voltmeter

Batteries @ Q?

What did you do to your coach today VI
1993 U280 SE 40' WTBI, Build: 4359
C8.3 300hp, 6-Speed, Exhaust Brake
960 watts on the roof (6 x 160)
Sorento (or BOLT) on a Kar Kaddy SS
"Nature abhors a vacuum"

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #5 –
Ok thanks, good points, will look at that tomorrow, , in a tiny village tonight will see if they have a Napa and get two gauges.
pouring rain right now and grilled chicken and a cold beer are calling.
David & Emma Roche
Dino (Golden Doodle)
1999 U270 WTFE 36' Build # 5534
Xtreme "Lights, Stripes & Roof"
Motorcade# 18321
Dayton, Ohio
Towd: Jeep Grand Cherokee
Two Townie Electra Bikes

Life is made to enjoy, the Foretravel helps!

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #6 –
When other post suggest checking the battery terminals, they mean pulling and cleaning as this is frequently the cause of high resistance and hard starting. Separating the batteries and testing with a load meter can quickly tell if one has an internal fault. A car parts store may do this for free.

As I have posted several times, this is a good reason to have two digital voltmeters for house and engine batteries on the dash of the coach. You can instantly tell if there is a problem and resolve it before you get stranded.

Pierce
Pierce and Gaylie Stewart
'93 U300/36 WTBI
Detroit 6V-92TA Jake
1140 watts on the roof
SBFD (ret)

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #7 –
We had a lot of inconsistency in starting our coach (320 version so big M-11 engine). Cleaning the cables and or a fresh charge helped, but not always. I was using 3 of the latest greatest AGM start batteries that load tested good. In the end. It ended up being the starter motor. Instead of just quitting, It was slowly dying and eating up BIG amperage. And the engine was not turning properly to start easily.

After the new starter went in. The engine spins over like it's over dosed on caffeine.  I also got into the habit of pulling a cable (on the house side as well) when storing (no elec) and using a trickle charger (my coach didn't have an automatic one for the chassis batteries) Takes just a few minutes to do.

Jerry & Nona and Kimeru the cat that thinks she's a dog
1998 36' WTFE U320  #5314 Motorcade #17711
USAF 1975-1995
2019 Subaru Crosstrek 'toad'
2003 Subaru Legacy touring car
jerry Fincher | Flickr

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #8 –
Thanks for the info on the starter, I will check all the  connections and then it would only leave the starter.
David & Emma Roche
Dino (Golden Doodle)
1999 U270 WTFE 36' Build # 5534
Xtreme "Lights, Stripes & Roof"
Motorcade# 18321
Dayton, Ohio
Towd: Jeep Grand Cherokee
Two Townie Electra Bikes

Life is made to enjoy, the Foretravel helps!

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #9 –
When my started was starting to go I was using the boost switch so I thought my start batteries
were shot. Replaced the starter and same problem and the next time I tried the starter quit.
Peter and Frieda Morin
1999 36ft. U320 Foretravel
Build # 5436
1998 Suzuki Sidekick Sport

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #10 –
Peter, your comments re starter befuddled me!!!
Johnh
Coachless, now use aircraft. 2003 Ford Travelair TC280 class C. Super shape. Just for 1 yr .
1994 Ford E350 ClassC,total renovation inside and out. Now sold.
2000 U295  36' Cummins 350 c/w Banks Stinger, Resonator upgrade,Solar, LED lites.Residential fridge with slide out pantry. Build 5674. Sold
ex 92 GV 022C ored Cummins. Sold
ex 95 GV240 cat 3116. Sold
2017 Mini cooper s & 2016 land Rover LR2 HSE  LUX.
jhaygarth@aol.com    SKP #130098
treat everyone as you would like to be.

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #11 –
John my engine wouldn't turn over sometimes without the boost. I thought it was the batteries but
the starter was using so many amps that that it needed the house batteries. After I put the new batteries
in the engine turned over too slow to start and the next time I tried to start it the starter had died. The new
starter turns the engine faster than the old one ever had.
Peter and Frieda Morin
1999 36ft. U320 Foretravel
Build # 5436
1998 Suzuki Sidekick Sport

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #12 –
You say" I thought my starter batteries were shot so I changed the starter"?? "Replaced the starter and next time it quit"?
Just does not make sense to me, but!! Maybe too much sun here in Keremeos as has been mid 30c for a few days while you guys had lots of rain.
Johnh
Coachless, now use aircraft. 2003 Ford Travelair TC280 class C. Super shape. Just for 1 yr .
1994 Ford E350 ClassC,total renovation inside and out. Now sold.
2000 U295  36' Cummins 350 c/w Banks Stinger, Resonator upgrade,Solar, LED lites.Residential fridge with slide out pantry. Build 5674. Sold
ex 92 GV 022C ored Cummins. Sold
ex 95 GV240 cat 3116. Sold
2017 Mini cooper s & 2016 land Rover LR2 HSE  LUX.
jhaygarth@aol.com    SKP #130098
treat everyone as you would like to be.

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #13 –
As my coach needed the boost to start I bought new batteries, that's when the starter failed. I should have
done more trouble shooting and then I wouldn't have bought new batteries.
Peter and Frieda Morin
1999 36ft. U320 Foretravel
Build # 5436
1998 Suzuki Sidekick Sport

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #14 –
Quote from: oldguy –
As my coach needed the boost to start I bought new batteries, that's when the starter failed. I should have
done more trouble shooting and then I wouldn't have bought new batteries.
Keep in mind that it might have been a dying start battery that killed your starter.
1992 Foretravel Grand Villa
U225 SBID Build No. 4134
1986 Rockwood Driftwood
1968 S.I.A.T.A. Spring
1962 Studebaker Lark
1986 Honda VF700C
1983 Honda VF750C
Charlie, the Dog was broken out of jail 24 Oct 2023
N1RPN
AA1OH (H)e who must be obeyed.

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #15 –
There was nothing wrong with the start batteries, one is in my wife's car and another is going
into my car.
Peter and Frieda Morin
1999 36ft. U320 Foretravel
Build # 5436
1998 Suzuki Sidekick Sport

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #16 –
Quote from: "Irish" –
Thanks for the info on the starter, I will check all the  connections and then it would only leave the starter.
For the M11. The starter was about $425 plus install. But that was 18(ish) months ago.
Jerry & Nona and Kimeru the cat that thinks she's a dog
1998 36' WTFE U320  #5314 Motorcade #17711
USAF 1975-1995
2019 Subaru Crosstrek 'toad'
2003 Subaru Legacy touring car
jerry Fincher | Flickr

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #17 –
In 2019 stopped by FOT for maintenance prior to a long trip to the Canadian Maritimes.  Had them replace the engine batteries (3).  FOT uses Interstate.  Two years later we were at Cummins in El Paso for service and the their code tester reported we had an electrical issue.  One of the 2-year old batteries was toast.  Two coach buck$ later we had three new AGM engine batteries.  Prior to installing the new batteries the Cummins tech load tested the new batteries.  He had experience with new batteries being bad.  I purchased this car charger.  Our rig has two 12-volt receptacles in the dash.  One is a cigarette lighter and one is an extra, but not a cigarette lighter.  The cigarette lighter receptacle is on the chassis battery circuit so I plug in the car charger into this outlet to get a voltage reading of my engine batteries.  It also has USB and USBc ports which come in handy.
David & Sherry Kendrick
"Gizmo" The Doggy Lama
USAF(Ret) 1971-75; 1979-95 (20 yrs)
2003 U320 F03 [6179] 38PBDS (3/2016)
2016 Chev Silverado Z71 LTZ
Motorcade 17738
--------------------------------------
New Horizons 5W 25' RKS (1/2004 - 3/2016)
2003 Chev Silverado 2500HD Duramax
Tent (5-person) White Stag (1972 - 2003)

Re: Start battery would not start engine.

Reply #18 –
Speaking of 12v cigarette chargers, does anyone know off the top of their head what batteries the 12v cigarette type plug by the passenger seat is connected too. (2001 U320)
I could do some troubleshooting but sitting on the couch feeling lazy on this rainy day.
I'm assuming chassis batteries but you know what that's worth 😁
Dylan and Aimee
2001 U320 4013
Unit# 5896
450 HP/IFS