Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Topic: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights (Read 5263 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #150 – June 13, 2023, 06:05:16 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 04:57:21 pm

And, from the T shirt Trent is wearing, how about "HOUSTON, WE HAVE A PROBLEM!" But, the good news is that you aren't on the moon!

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #151 – June 13, 2023, 06:53:21 pm

Good to hear!!! I'm confident you have a fault code that will tell you the problem. Just got to be able to read it. I never leave home without a low coolant sensor and a cam position sensor. If you by China cheap ones swap them in to make sure they work 👍👍
Scott
Whoops forgot OBD2 reader for the coach too

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #152 – June 13, 2023, 07:12:04 pm

Back when I had a real job as a fleet Mx manager all of my shops had a laptop with the full Cummins Insite software loaded in them. We could do anything a certified Cummins dealer could do including diagnostics, setting parameters, imaging an ecm and updating firmware. Very nice to have but pretty expensive. We had to update our subscriptions every year for $$$. Sure wish I still had access to that tool!
We also had a dedicated Cummins engineer to support our mx operations. Life was good.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #153 – June 13, 2023, 07:53:09 pm

Quote from: SteveB – June 13, 2023, 07:12:04 pm

Back when I had a real job as a fleet Mx manager all of my shops had a laptop with the full Cummins Insite software loaded in them. We could do anything a certified Cummins dealer could do including diagnostics, setting parameters, imaging an ecm and updating firmware. Very nice to have but pretty expensive. We had to update our subscriptions every year for $$$. Sure wish I still had access to that tool!
We also had a dedicated Cummins engineer to support our mx operations. Life was good.

Me too

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #154 – June 13, 2023, 08:08:47 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – June 12, 2023, 05:16:54 pm

IMO, getting good steady 12+ VDC to the starter AND to the front of the coach is job one. When turning the key to the first position takes voltage at the ignition solenoid from 12 to 0, do not expect anything to work properly.

Trying to diagnose computer or sensor issues with incorrect voltage supplied to them can lead to a lot of false "rabbit holes".

After the basic electrical issues are resolved, absolutely the next step is to clear and recheck for diagnostic codes-- engine and transmission.

Many have mentioned the engine codes.

The transmission codes are even easier to access:
Turn ignition key on (so transmission shift pad illuminates)
Press the up and down arrows on the shift pad at the same time. That will either bring up d-1 OR on newer ECU's it will bring up OL. If OL, merely press the up and down arrows again at the same time.

Now, d-1 will come up and will display the first diagnostic code, Just write it down-- refer to your Allison owners manual or online. If there is no diagnostic code you will get d-1 followed by - -.

If there is a code for d-1, press the mode button to bring up d-2. Continue until you get d- "something" - -.

Turn off the key. You are done.

Checked for error codes on the transmission, Brett. Only got one code 6600 and found this online:

Main code 66 indicates the ECU is expecting to get its throttle position sensor (TPS) signal across a serial
communication interface from a computer-controlled engine. Either the engine computer is not sending the TPS
information or the wiring between the engine and transmission computers has failed.

Code 66 00 can occur when the transmission ECU remains powered when the engine ECM is powered down.
The transmission sees this as a communication link failure.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #155 – June 13, 2023, 08:10:02 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – June 13, 2023, 06:05:16 pm

And, from the T shirt Trent is wearing, how about "HOUSTON, WE HAVE A PROBLEM!" But, the good news is that you aren't on the moon!

LOL!

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #156 – June 13, 2023, 08:12:50 pm

Quote from: dsd – June 13, 2023, 06:53:21 pm

Good to hear!!! I'm confident you have a fault code that will tell you the problem. Just got to be able to read it. I never leave home without a low coolant sensor and a cam position sensor. If you by China cheap ones swap them in to make sure they work 👍👍
Scott
Whoops forgot OBD2 reader for the coach too

I can't figure out what low coolant sensor to buy as the one that's in there I can't find. I don't think it's made any more. Can I just get any low coolant sensor that is made for Cummins M11 or do I need to figure out a specific part number?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #157 – June 13, 2023, 08:33:31 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 08:12:50 pm

I can't figure out what low coolant sensor to buy as the one that's in there I can't find. I don't think it's made any more. Can I just get any low coolant sensor that is made for Cummins M11 or do I need to figure out a specific part number?

cummins site with your engine serial number will give you the part number to search. Get the cam position sensor number too
Cummins QuickServe Online

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #158 – June 13, 2023, 08:42:11 pm

Brett, after I cleared that code on the transmission and restarted the coach, it started right up. No lights. No alarms. HOWEVER, without the generator and boost on, the voltage on the dash looks like this:

But voltage at the battery is 12.6 and voltage at the starter solenoid in the dash stays at 12.6 also. Coach is running just fine it seems but that voltage is too low, right?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #159 – June 13, 2023, 08:43:28 pm

Quote from: dsd – June 13, 2023, 08:33:31 pm

cummins site with your engine serial number will give you the part number to search. Get the cam position sensor number too
Cummins QuickServe Online

Thank you!

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #160 – June 13, 2023, 08:54:09 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 08:42:11 pm

Brett, after I cleared that code on the transmission and restarted the coach, it started right up. No lights. No alarms. HOWEVER, without the generator and boost on, the voltage on the dash looks like this:

But voltage at the battery is 12.6 and voltage at the starter solenoid in the dash stays at 12.6 also. Coach is running just fine it seems but that voltage is too low, right?

Check gauge grounds. You can also use your digital voltmeter to check voltage at the back of the voltmeter in the dash to see if this is a wiring or gauge issue.

You are home-- take a break! Come back with a fresh mind (and body).

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #161 – June 13, 2023, 09:01:10 pm

Yes 12.6 volts running is to low. 14 volts at the dash and 13.8 at the batteries running. Your home. Go back thru the posts. Clean all your connections. Take a day off

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #162 – June 13, 2023, 09:06:04 pm

Quote from: dsd – June 13, 2023, 08:33:31 pm

cummins site with your engine serial number will give you the part number to search. Get the cam position sensor number too
Cummins QuickServe Online

hmmm...I can't seem to find either of these parts on the parts list when I put in my ESN...

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #163 – June 13, 2023, 09:22:03 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 09:06:04 pm

hmmm...I can't seem to find either of these parts on the parts list when I put in my ESN...

Yep they are a pain to sort out ,but they are there. May be in the wiring diagram?
Ive been trying to build a help list for just your situation
Coach wont start trouble shooting (Battery)
I do want to go back and add some more information and Ideas. It's just crazy stress being stuck. All to often we see what we want and miss what we need to see
Low voltage
Engine quit
Tons of accurate faults do to low voltage and they are all just a nuisance distraction. Clear the faults and work the symptoms till they are gone.
You dont have to catch every ball every time . Will be time fore the other balls later.
You still have issues. Keep breaking into smaller sections. Fix, go to the next. You have supply or ground issues. You have two power generation sources. Every thing should power everything.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #164 – June 13, 2023, 09:42:29 pm

With the engine running and a good alternator you should have 13.5 to 14 volts at the chassis batteries, depending on the state of charge of the batteries. At least ours does.......

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #165 – June 13, 2023, 09:44:03 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 09:06:04 pm

hmmm...I can't seem to find either of these parts on the parts list when I put in my ESN...

Why don't you post the part numbers? Maybe someone can find info on them.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #166 – June 13, 2023, 11:25:58 pm

Congratulations. Is it possible that your belt is loose on the alternator?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #167 – June 14, 2023, 12:35:28 am

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 13, 2023, 08:12:50 pm

I can't figure out what low coolant sensor to buy as the one that's in there I can't find. I don't think it's made any more. Can I just get any low coolant sensor that is made for Cummins M11 or do I need to figure out a specific part number?

Probable correct parts, on a 2003 U320:
Speed sensor for Allison transmission for on board spares part Allison 29544139
Relays: Song Chuan 871-1C-C-R1U01 12VDC (Pack of 3) Micro 280 SPDT 20/35A Relay,...
Cam position sensor: Amazon.com: JEENDA Position Sensor 4984223 4326596 2872362 3408503 050660...
Coolant sensor: Amazon.com: 4903489 3612521 1673785C91 1673785C92 Coolant Fluid Level Sensor...

May or may not work for you.

As an Amazon Associate Foretravel Owners' Forum earns from qualifying purchases.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #168 – June 14, 2023, 06:56:58 am

On this age coach with the M-11 they most likely used a Robert Shaw/ Mini Tek sensor #086714A0001 for the low coolant sensor.

Mike

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #169 – June 14, 2023, 06:00:01 pm

Are these engine start sequences from one 1997 model any help? After turning ignition key, everything must work for engine starter to crank. Lots of places to fail and to manually crank engine.

No computer on this engine's diagram.

Last diagram has bypass of transmission neutral start relay, that has prevented engine crank when 12v line to transmission had too low voltage.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #170 – June 15, 2023, 07:29:22 pm

Ensure the alternator is working properly. Loose belt? Defective? In 2016 we purchased our rig from MOT. Drove it to Longview (camped); returned to MOT to repair a slide issue; drove it to DFW area (camped) and then to a covered storage lot. On the way to the lot the check engine light came on. Returned to our home in SoCal and about a month later returned to DWF to retrieve the coach from storage. We were driving it back to FOT for a PDI. We had only gone about 3 or 4 miles when the check engine light came on again. Dang!! Listened to the ding ding ding for 200 miles. Next day FOT diagnosed a failing alternator. That fixed the ding ding ding. Thankfully the engine/chassis batteries lasted long enough to get us to FOT. A few years later we were driving the coach from our campsite in El Paso to Cummins, about 20 miles to have a check engine code that BlueFire had informed us about. Cummins couldn't locate the code but told us that there were multiple codes for low voltage on our 20 mile drive. Turns out that one of the engine batteries had failed. Two coach bucks later and all day stay in the Cummins driver's lounge, we were good to go back to our campsite. BTW the check engine light didn't not go off on our way to Cummins. Hope you have your problem diagnosed and fixed by the time you read this.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #171 – June 18, 2023, 10:15:31 am

Quote from: Barry & Cindy – June 14, 2023, 06:00:01 pm

Are these engine start sequences from one 1997 model any help? After turning ignition key, everything must work for engine starter to crank. Lots of places to fail and to manually crank engine.

No computer on this engine's diagram.

Last diagram has bypass of transmission neutral start relay, that has prevented engine crank when 12v line to transmission had too low voltage.

The attachments are just text lists, are there supposed to be diagrams that go with them?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #172 – June 18, 2023, 01:51:34 pm

Hi Noah,

No photos to support the Start Sequence listing. What item do you need help with identifying?

12-volt source is on rear bay wall under a white cover. Ignition relay/solenoid, neutral start relay, Allison circuit breaker are on large 12-volt front panel in front of co-pilot seat. Aux start solenoid is on isolator panel.

This listing is correct for one Foretravel coach and probably mostly applies to other coaches. I think of it a reason to learn about physical item locations.

One of the nice things is most failures of an item can be bypassed to get engine start if one knows the sequence. And it is even better if we know locations before a problem occurs.

I was aware of our Allison computer input low voltage and when leaving a wash rack, coach did not crank with ignition key, so I quickly bypassed the neutral-start relay and was pleasantly surprised we could start okay. Relay is still bypassed to this day.

We only fuel up at truck stops and only at pump islands that do NOT have a gasoline dispenser pump. And NEVER turn engine off while filling, as I would not want to be stuck at a truck stop pump.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #173 – June 19, 2023, 01:15:55 pm

Hey all, just wanted to post an update:

I took the alternator to a local guy who has been working on alternators and starters for over 40 years. He knew Powerline well and gave me a good education on these. It's nice that they can be cleaned and repaired. The folks that know how to do this are not around as much as they used to be. He put new brushes and bearings in as well as replaced the bridge (was the Leece Neville but they don't make those anymore). The alternator works great now.

However, this was not the problem. I put the alternator back in and started up the engine only to still get the same low voltage alerts and engine shut down. I checked the voltage off the alternator while the engine was running and, just like before, 12.8

.

I was scratching my head and then noticed that the voltage sensor terminal cable (which looked fine to me because there was no corrosion and rust) had black tape on it so I pulled it off and lo and behold the wiring wasn't even attached to the connector!

I then reconnected a new ring to the wire, put it back on, started up the engine, and voila!!! 14v!

Through all of this, I've got a new isolator, new boost solenoid, cleaned up literally every cable on my coach, a just-like-new alternator, new positive chassis battery terminal cables and figured out my trimetric (I also had a cable in the wrong place with this).

Total cost is about $450 and all I really needed to do to get back on the road last week was just fix that one tiny sensor connection. Brett was right - before jumping down the rabbit hole of expensive - it's probably a bad connection somewhere.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #174 – June 19, 2023, 01:35:23 pm

Yep!
Mine was a simple fix too, a broken connection not unlike your problem. Had you found that first 😆, you would have been back on the road in an hour

It's the simple ones that get you sometimes!
Thanks for the update.

Safe travels
Justin.

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