Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Topic: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights (Read 5263 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #175 – June 19, 2023, 01:44:56 pm

No worries, all that other stuff probably needed to be done anyway! Glad your back on the road! Sorry you had such a stressful time for a small easy fix.

Now a question for the group. How would/could this problem have been found/diagnosed easier?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #176 – June 19, 2023, 01:55:33 pm

Not even half a coach buck to get going again? Sounds like a deal to me. Glad you got it figured out

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #177 – June 19, 2023, 02:36:53 pm

I do my best Tommy like the rest of the Forum but first we need to figure out what the persons
problem is and I don't know about the rest of the members, when I'm there I see things that jump at me that I can't imagine sitting in front of the labtop.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #178 – June 19, 2023, 02:43:07 pm

Wow, great job finding the problem, glad it was easy. Too bad it cost you your trip. That was probably worth way more that the money spent. You learned a lot though!

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #179 – June 19, 2023, 04:26:54 pm

Quote from: Tommy D – June 19, 2023, 01:44:56 pm

Now a question for the group. How would/could this problem have been found/diagnosed easier?

If a volt meter was put on the terminal at the alternator and ground on housing on alternator with the engine off it would have read the battery voltage, with it being broken it would have read zero.

We need to add this test when someone is having a problem.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #180 – June 19, 2023, 05:53:46 pm

Quote from: Tommy D – June 19, 2023, 01:44:56 pm

No worries, all that other stuff probably needed to be done anyway! Glad your back on the road! Sorry you had such a stressful time for a small easy fix.

Now a question for the group. How would/could this problem have been found/diagnosed easier?

Yes, I am not mad at my needed education on all of this at all. More stressful on Siobhán than me. I feel like the engine and I are one now haha!

I would just say that maybe if we would have seen the low voltage diagnostic earlier on then go right to the alternator and check what the output is off the terminals there. But again, I did do that but I only began to clean up and pull out things that looked rusty and corroded and this wasn't one of them. Shrug. All I know is we have always been very appreciative of this community to help us out. You all know so much! Thank you!

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #181 – June 20, 2023, 08:22:35 am

Quote from: Tommy D – June 19, 2023, 01:44:56 pm

No worries, all that other stuff probably needed to be done anyway! Glad your back on the road! Sorry you had such a stressful time for a small easy fix.

Now a question for the group. How would/could this problem have been found/diagnosed easier?

Knowing what the dashboard voltmeter numbers are and what they mean, and looking once in a while to keep track of "How things are going."

Adopting a logical approach to the problem. You may not go directly to the failure, but in the long run it's faster chasing probabilities than using a scatter gun.

The U225 doesn't dare act up. My 1962 Studebaker project? Well I just keep asking for trouble. Sometimes a five year old battery just fails.

Redirecting...

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #182 – June 20, 2023, 12:52:38 pm

Why would the gen set running with boost, not allow the engine to run?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #183 – June 20, 2023, 01:14:03 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – June 20, 2023, 12:52:38 pm

Why would the gen set running with boost, not allow the engine to run?

If all is working as designed, IT WOULD.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #184 – June 20, 2023, 04:44:54 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – June 20, 2023, 12:52:38 pm

Why would the gen set running with boost, not allow the engine to run?

I installed a second 60A power converter with just this scenario in mind. That it makes my chassis battery maintenance just that much easier makes it a twofer.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #185 – June 20, 2023, 08:23:19 pm

Trent, I know the trip disruption was a bummer, but just look at the positives.
You gained a ton of knowledge about your coach and made several upgrades for $450.
If you had called a mobile RV mechanic, chances are they may or may not have found your issue and would still have charged you a hefty fee for their work, probably more than the $450.
Every time I work on the coach, I learn something. I sometimes have to spend some money on tools, but I figure I'll have the tools and knowledge learned forever, and the money didn't go to someone else.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #186 – June 20, 2023, 08:25:56 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – June 20, 2023, 12:52:38 pm

Why would the gen set running with boost, not allow the engine to run?

Quote from: wolfe10 – June 20, 2023, 01:14:03 pm

If all is working as designed, IT WOULD.

So what component should be looked at in this case - the isolator?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #187 – June 20, 2023, 09:12:07 pm

Quote from: MarkC – June 20, 2023, 08:23:19 pm

If you had called a mobile RV mechanic, chances are they may or may not have found your issue and would still have charged you a hefty fee for their work, probably more than the $450.

Trent could have called a mobil mechanic and paid him to "read the codes" and zero them out. Unfortunately too many technicians can only change the parts listed, but the low voltage condition should have led to a battery voltage check and one way or another, with good battery voltage established, check the output voltage of the alternator. With those two things good, the battery isolator is next in line. If there was an ECU or sensor problem, the basics have to be there before you can move forward with the more expensive problems. If you have a limited amount of time, or are stuck on the side of the road, the mobil mechanic will be less expensive than the tow truck. And you can spend money, but you can't buy back the time already passed.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #188 – June 20, 2023, 09:13:21 pm

$450.00 wouldn't touch a mobile "mechanic" and then he would have given up on the job, left and still would have charged his full rate. I've rode that horse before with the problem being electrical with a class 8 diesel truck.They don't guarantee they will fix anything, they merely agree to work on it. I promise you this played out in your favor. I will gladly give someone $450.00 to come to my shop and clean up and replace the same things on my coach and I will buy the parts.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #189 – June 21, 2023, 06:46:21 am

Quote from: Michelle – June 20, 2023, 08:25:56 pm

So what component should be looked at in this case - the isolator?

Boost switch and boost solenoid. Generator powers the converter or inverter/charger which charges the house battery bank. With boost circuit working, that charging is "shared with" the chassis battery. In essence, with the boost solenoid ON, it makes one large battery bank from the two separate ones.

And, if the boost switch/boost solenoid are not working, a very easy work around. Locate the boost solenoid (under bed or behind rear wheel). Remove the large-gauge cable from one of the large lugs and ADD IT TO the other large lug. Electrically the same as the solenoid working.

That makes for one large battery bank for both charging and for discharging, so if drycamping you will want to return the cable to its original position so you don't discharge both banks.

BTW, this same procedure is a perfect work around for a failed ignition solenoid as well. You are just manually doing what the solenoid does electrically.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #190 – June 22, 2023, 09:10:45 pm

Okay friends - false alarm - we are still scratching our heads.

So, in my last message I was so excited to say we got it all running. And it was. But... I shoulda left it running longer before I sent that message. I had a new isolator showing up next day so we were still planning on waiting here anyways. I decided to take the rig for a test drive the next day and then it happened again. Check engine light. Shutdown engine. And low voltage power supply showed up on my diagnostics. I was even looking at the voltage meter on the dash when it happened. 14v. Trimetric was reading 13.8.

Now, I'm thoroughly confused.

I decided to take a break from it and hearing ya'll in my head set to clean up even more of the isolator area since that arrived shortly after. I figured that maybe I'll clean all of that up before I come back to you all and post again.

So now, I've got an all new shiny isolator on a steel plate that I shined up and dremeled off any rust, new connections on the ends of all the cables. I double-tripled checked the wiring schematics for the coach to make sure that I had them all in the right places.

I read all through someone else's post on here about the neg battery to the side of the engine ground wire and I cleaned that all up too. Now, I'm starting to read about the ECM posts. Tomorrow, I'm gonna check around the starter and clean up all those cables.

Still learning a lot, but would also love to get this rig on the road. I'd love your thoughts and questions as I feel like I'm trying to find a needle in a haystack.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #191 – June 22, 2023, 09:20:16 pm

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 22, 2023, 09:10:45 pm

I decided to take the rig for a test drive the next day and then it happened again. Check engine light. Shutdown engine. And low voltage power supply showed up on my diagnostics. I was even looking at the voltage meter on the dash when it happened. 14v. Trimetric was reading 13.8.

Now, I'm thoroughly confused.

A bad ground will also show up as a low voltage condition. With current flowing through a circuit, voltmeter probes placed on either side of a good connection should read zero volts.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #192 – June 22, 2023, 09:21:50 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – June 20, 2023, 12:52:38 pm

Why would the gen set running with boost, not allow the engine to run?

Did you try this to see if it is a work around for the issue?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #193 – June 22, 2023, 10:27:32 pm

Coach wont start trouble shooting (Battery)

There is still a bunch I want to add to this post but although not complete with diagrams it should be helpful. I know you have been threw this a bunch, wish you were around the corner to help. Do one section at a time starting at the batteries to the termination of the cables. Once you have proven that section is good go to the next section. Dont be jumping back and forth. You may find it but you need to search and eliminate to resolve.
Scott

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #194 – June 22, 2023, 10:57:06 pm

You need a wiring diagram or schematic that shows where the 12v originates that is the power source to the ECM. Unless you can trace the wire to its source or supply. You also need to know where the ground or negative connection is for the ECM. Unless the ECM is failing.... it seems to me that it is detecting the low voltage and everything else may be at 12v.

When I had the issue with the Allison touch pad with no power, it was the only thing that was out. It was a single ground wire (white) that was grounded behind the white fiberglass panel in the bay. The lug had broken from the terminal. Yours could be as simple, but you need to now where EXACTLY that the ECM gets it's power and ground.

If you could monitor the voltage to the ECM at the ECM when this happens, you would have a much better idea of the validity of the fault. Is it actually a low voltage condition or does the ECM just "think" it's a low voltage condition because of an internal problem.

Just my thoughts.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #195 – June 23, 2023, 07:56:41 am

Quote from: Walkerfam7 – June 22, 2023, 09:10:45 pm

Okay friends - false alarm - we are still scratching our heads.
I'm thoroughly confused.

Still learning a lot, but would also love to get this rig on the road. I'd love your thoughts and questions as I feel like I'm trying to find a needle in a haystack.

The haystack isn't organized in an organized, logical to someone, fashion. Plus you can always use a magnet to find a needle.

Do you have the 3-ring binders that came with your coach from the factory?

Which magic box returned an error code for low voltage" the engine? or the transmission?

Do Not! Pierce the wire insulation in order to take measurements. Early convenience leads to later problems.

And finally, you can trace the wire bundle back to the source, and by source I mean both voltage and return.

I lied. I agree with Four Travelers that one way or another it's the offending electronics control module that is the hub of the problem. Start with the simple things first: the innies and the outies.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #196 – June 23, 2023, 10:37:43 am

Maybe consider running stand alone power and ground wires to the ecu ?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #197 – June 23, 2023, 09:09:55 pm

Quote from: Protech Racing – June 23, 2023, 10:37:43 am

Maybe consider running stand alone power and ground wires to the ecu ?

Nothing wrong with that, at last count I still have 5 stand alone battery power feeds due to the previous owners mis-routing of a wire bundle, subsequent pinching, and an electrical fire.

Trent, with a little luck should be able to manually trace the factory wiring by hand and clean and plugs along the way. Unless of course this is a fault in the engine ECU. But do the simple stuff first.

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #198 – June 26, 2023, 09:22:03 am

Quote from: Chuck & Jeannie – June 12, 2023, 08:23:01 am

Fuse holders should look something like the example below:

So, I discovered in the cummins manual that I had only found 1 of the fuse holders near the ECM when we were on the side of the road. Yesterday I found the other one and the fuse was broken (see pic). I put a new one in.

I seem to remember someone earlier calling this fuse location a PITA. I agree. Engine is starting good. Running at 14.2v. I've had the engine running for about thirty minutes now with no problems today. However, yesterday, after I put the new fuse in, I ran it for a bit and would get these occasional "hiccups" where the engine shutdown light would come on - then throw on the alarm - then the stop engine light would come on - then the engine shutdown light would turn back off and everything would be running just fine with the exception of the now stop engine light on and the lovely alarm.

We had this happen when the key ignition was just at the first turn and the engine wasn't running too. Like, all these clicks would throw the same sequence even when the engine wasn't on. That made me think that something is going on with the ecm. There are now no codes on the transmission box.

I figured it's safe to drive to a shop where I can have a real diagnostic tool run the codes for me and for some reason even thought maybe the codes that were saying low voltage now just need to be cleared. I also noticed that my silverleaf stopped communicating this morning.

Silverleaf wouldn't be causing any of this would it?

Also, about four years ago I felt like I was having problems starting the coach and when I got new keys made that seemed to alleviate those problems. So I thought to ask - the key ignition wouldn't potentially be a cause would it?

Re: Stranded on an exit ramp - Stop Engine and ABS lights

Reply #199 – June 26, 2023, 09:29:31 am

Looking closely at the condition of the stabs on that fuse, they seem to be somewhat corroded, make sure the fuse holder contacts that it plugs into are clean and tight. It's a small amp fuse I'm sure but you don't want any resistance in that circuit, voltage drop across that fuse could cause issues for sure.

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