It never ends....

Topic: It never ends.... (Read 2392 times) previous topic - next topic

It never ends....

April 01, 2024, 05:59:59 pm

On this trip:
New Generator
New fuel shut off solonoid
New water heater control board
New water pump
New front AC

We RV why?

Re: It never ends....

Reply #1 – April 01, 2024, 06:32:38 pm

Because owning a boat is too expensive.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #2 – April 01, 2024, 06:33:10 pm

What else would keep you busy?

Re: It never ends....

Reply #3 – April 01, 2024, 08:12:42 pm

Its completely unfair is what it is. Spend all your money buying new parts for a motorhome, why can't we do the same for ourselves? But no, every time I try to order an upgrade on my 1951 liver on find it parts shows not in stock.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #4 – April 01, 2024, 08:40:49 pm

The best bumper sticker that 80+ year old Captain Rice had on his new Prevost coach was "If any is left, I miscalculated."

Another one I saw on a new Newmar coach "This Coach was bought with my kids inheritance."

Re: It never ends....

Reply #5 – April 01, 2024, 11:00:43 pm

Knock on wood. In 9 years I've had to replace the Onan's starter. the water pump and the microwave.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #6 – April 01, 2024, 11:19:19 pm

Quote from: Dakota Slim – April 01, 2024, 11:00:43 pm

Knock on wood. In 9 years I've had to replace the Onan's starter. the water pump and the microwave.

I am going to make sure my wife does not see this post. She keeps reminding me that the 1997 U295 I owned for 19 years never had a problem the whole time we owned it. I was way younger then and did almost all of the repairs myself.

Not sure if was a good thing, but the other day she said maybe we need to start looking for a newer coach where we won't have so many problems.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #7 – April 02, 2024, 09:14:19 am

Newer is not any promise of more reliable. Don't care who the builder is (except the Prevost converters and maybe Newell), they are all junk if you look at the details (i know I will draw heat but how close have you looked at new FTs?).

The last 3 years at Tampa I have looked very closely at every FT on the floor. Sexy, yes, exceptional quality, no. Just look at the side walls, 1.7m and wavy walls, I think not. Heck, my 2002 sidewalls are like glass compared to what I saw. The new FT Super C prototype had a total "junk" slide mechanism. It was built on the cheaper (by only a few k) Freightliner chassis, not the MV2. This is not the way to do "high quality" for a perceived premium coach.

Another interesting point to notice is the very quick depreciation of all non-Prevost units. How about 2 y/o FT Presidentials for less than $800k, 1 y/o King Aires for well under $1m....and all appear to be dropping...quick. Lots of Covid toys for sale, but also for sale due to chronic issues and very little ability to get quality support. Yes, I will admit, too many covid campers bought in over there heads and/or by emotions, but 50%+ depreciation in less than 2 years for a premium coach, it's not all the economy.

Poorly built, too much tech, systems dependent on limited support resources ( can you say HWH), inability to promptly obtain parts... and a whole lot more.

RVing at any level is a challenge. I tell potential newbies "any trip without an incident is like winning the lottery". RVs are a complete act of trying to defy the natural order..."a house on wheels?". To quote a well know motorhome retailer, "You have got to own the motorhome, not let the motorhome own you".

Quality is an issue, service and parts access is an issue, the industry is completely unregulated and lemon laws for RVs are very weak in all but a few states. And as a final comment....cheap cars have monumentally better warranties than $1.5m coaches.... All food for thought. But we all do this for the joy and experiences RVing affords us.

Flame suit on, fire hose charged!

Her ends the rant...

Bob

Re: It never ends....

Reply #8 – April 02, 2024, 10:11:17 am

I calculated 16% loss every year since it was new. My coach is still loosing probably 16% but being so little value left after all these years it doesnt matter much now. Certainly didn't purchase as an investment. Ours does return a good recreational value though for investment for us.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #9 – April 02, 2024, 11:30:50 am

Quote from: Moby – April 01, 2024, 05:59:59 pm

On this trip:
New Generator
New fuel shut off solonoid
New water heater control board
New water pump
New front AC

We RV why?

I hear what you are saying, but I am running on the OEM:
Generator(propane onan)
fuel shut off solonoid
both ACs,
all the other I have replaced also plus a lot of other stuff. Mine is a '95 U240 with 228k miles and I love it. I paid 44k for it in 07 with 80k miles, I have spent 20k+ on it since 07, a lot of stuff was my fault(10k burnt up Cat 3116). Everything you use/or not will break/wear out) at some point. Keep it maintained, when it breaks, fix it, don't wait and at the end of the road you will have more than if you just drove it. Have FUN on the road.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #10 – April 02, 2024, 02:02:38 pm

The only way to get your money out of these coaches is to use the heck out of them. Keep enjoying it until you can't/don't.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #11 – April 02, 2024, 03:04:34 pm

I paid 8000$ for mine and drove it home. After spending $20-30k on improvements , I fully expect to get at least $8000 when I sell it.

The bus has towed race cars all over the east coast and lots of Canada . 40K trouble free miles. I have no complaints. With the bus or life in general .

Re: It never ends....

Reply #12 – April 02, 2024, 06:02:41 pm

Quote from: craneman – April 01, 2024, 06:32:38 pm

Because owning a boat is too expensive.

Speaking of boats, I have a friend with a 36' sport fishing boat powered by two 3208 Cats. I think his diesel tank is 500 gallons.
I stopped by one day and he had a mechanic on site overhauling both his 3208's.
There's coach bucks and then there's boat bucks.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #13 – April 02, 2024, 06:10:20 pm

You can bank on the fact that your coach will always suck money out of your bank account.
I always watch Andrew Steele's YouTube channel and his reviews of the "top of the heap" Motorhomes.
He has been featuring a number of newer Foretravels (Nimbus and the different Realm models).
I caught a dealer who he features (Brad at The Motorhome Store) make a passing comment about the newer Foretravels made on the Spartan chassis, He stated that the Foretravels with the original, made by Foretravel chassis were much better than the newer models. The prices on the newer models on the Spartan chassis suffer more on resale.
I have thought after viewing the newer models, is that they do not seem to reflect the same value that they once did.
I have also read on this forum that the older U320 or Phoenix was a better coach than the newer Nimbus and Realm models).
If I were in the market for a newer coach I would not automatically go with a Foretravel. The King Aire and the Cornerstone would probably get my immediate attention.
A GOOD Country Coach, with the C15 CAT, and a 10 spd ZF, that is pre-Def would probably be the winner. A Newel would probably be out of my reach.
I'm also tired of the all laminate interiors (looks to me like Corporate break rooms, I can't imagine how these will look when the laminate chips and pulls loose or breaks off) and the paint schemes that make the coach look like it belongs in a Circus Parade, or are painted black or very dark colors, all seem to have checking paint problems (on the fiberglass body's).
Keep feeding your bank account, "BABY" will always need something, just grin and bare it.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #14 – April 02, 2024, 06:18:10 pm

Quote from: Dakota Slim – April 02, 2024, 06:02:41 pm

Speaking of boats, I have a friend with a 36' sport fishing boat powered by two 3208 Cats. I think his diesel tank is 500 gallons.
I stopped by one day and he had a mechanic on site overhauling both his 3208's.
There's coach bucks and then there's boat bucks.

......It's all a matter of magnitude and pain tolerance!.....Coach bucks, boat bucks, "aviation monetary units"....all the same...

Damn the "costs", full speed ahead!

Re: It never ends....

Reply #15 – April 02, 2024, 06:30:01 pm

FTs are now built on Spartan K4 chassis..... They would be better off on the Freightliner... Better service accessibility, more reliable and more. Just ask all the poor big coach on Spartan owner about having their $500k purchases parked for months, even as much as a year while Spartan worked through 7 iterations of "DEF Heads" that kept failing and causing the cursed "start countdown"...

Freightliner (I.E. Daimler/MB) did not have the issues. Funny thing about the chassis builders and emissions compliance is the engine manufacturer is not fully responsible for a compliant aftertreatment system, it's the chassis builder. Thus one of the reasons many of the coach builders were "helped" out of the business (Bluebird, Country Coach and others who built their own box). Even Thor is working at killing the Tiffin Power Glide (in house) chassis and turning to Freightliner....emission compliance can eat you alive....

Quote from: Lon and Cheryl – April 02, 2024, 06:10:20 pm

You can bank on the fact that your coach will always suck money out of your bank account.
I always watch Andrew Steele's YouTube channel and his reviews of the "top of the heap" Motorhomes.
He has been featuring a number of newer Foretravels (Nimbus and the different Realm models).
I caught a dealer who he features (Brad at The Motorhome Store) make a passing comment about the newer Foretravels made on the Freightliner chassis, He stated that the Foretravels with the original, made by Foretravel chassis were much better than the newer models. The prices on the newer models on the Freightliner chassis suffer more on resale.
I have thought after viewing the newer models, is that they do not seem to reflect the same value that they once did.
I have also read on this forum that the older U320 or Phoenix was a better coach than the newer Nimbus and Realm models).
If I were in the market for a newer coach I would not automatically go with a Foretravel. The King Aire and the Cornerstone would probably get my immediate attention.
A GOOD Country Coach, with the C15 CAT, and a 10 spd ZF, that is pre-Def would probably be the winner. A Newel would probably be out of my reach.
I'm also tired of the all laminate interiors (looks to me like Corporate break rooms, I can't imagine how these will look when the laminate chips and pulls loose or breaks off) and the paint schemes that make the coach look like it belongs in a Circus Parade, or are painted black or very dark colors, all seem to have checking paint problems (on the fiberglass body's).
Keep feeding your bank account, "BABY" will always need something, just grin and bare it.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #16 – April 02, 2024, 07:30:22 pm

Quote from: rusczyk56 – April 02, 2024, 06:18:10 pm

......It's all a matter of magnitude and pain tolerance!.....Coach bucks, boat bucks, "aviation monetary units"....all the same...

Damn the "costs", full speed ahead!

Oh.
I agree. Went coast to coast this year, kicked off some bucket list things abs generally had a good time.
Ain't planning on stopping.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #17 – April 03, 2024, 09:10:11 am

Well-on our trip to kerrville- car had some mechanical issues, had to be towed and left at dealer
Samsung- 3 year old refer quit
2 new Toyo tires on the front.
Thank God for friends.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #18 – April 03, 2024, 09:58:43 am

Quote from: rusczyk56 – April 02, 2024, 09:14:19 am

I tell potential newbies "any trip without an incident is like winning the lottery".
Bob

I am going to have to add this to my list. The only other one is a friend that use to buy a new Fortravel every few years said. "That his coaches stay up at night trying to figure out what it is going to be broken in the morning."

As to the comment about them not being built as good as they use to, is 100% correct. If you look at the build of my 2014 IH is nothing like the Realm Presidential. They have more bells and whistles then mine but the builds are not as good. Such as no outside air bags, no real wood, and the list goes on.

At the last Grandvention when Lyle was taking questions I had asked if they would build a new IH45. His answer was NO. He just saved me a lot of money saying that.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #19 – April 03, 2024, 12:05:47 pm

Turbojack, I'm curious about the chassis of the IH-45. Is it substantially like the U-series coaches with heavy subframes at the front and rear connected to a light tube steel basement structure comprised of bulkhead partitions and a narrow trussed raceway down the "spine" with all the mechanicals run within that raceway? I've never seen an IH-45 in person. If it is like the U-series, is it still susceptible to the "bulkhead problem" which is really just a fancy way of saying; rusted out steel tubing in the floor framing. I've never heard or seen mention of an IH-45 with a bulkhead problem.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #20 – April 03, 2024, 12:23:45 pm

We are back on our boat kick again. Really want something for cruising the Caribbean. Going to start work on boating certifications this winter I think. Lord help me.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #21 – April 03, 2024, 01:13:06 pm

Quote from: Geodmann – April 03, 2024, 12:05:47 pm

Turbojack, I'm curious about the chassis of the IH-45. Is it substantially like the U-series coaches with heavy subframes at the front and rear connected to a light tube steel basement structure comprised of bulkhead partitions and a narrow trussed raceway down the "spine" with all the mechanicals run within that raceway? I've never seen an IH-45 in person. If it is like the U-series, is it still susceptible to the "bulkhead problem" which is really just a fancy way of saying; rusted out steel tubing in the floor framing. I've never heard or seen mention of an IH-45 with a bulkhead problem.

The IH45 has what is called Travelride III. Up until 2018 it was build by Foretravel and in 2018 They gave their drawing to Spartan and Spartan started building the Travelride III. You can tell the difference by looking in the front fender well at the frame. If you see the frame bolted together it is a Spartan, if welded, it was made in house by FOT.

The frame is not like the U-series coaches. It has a square box beam, like the Spartan K4 but has 4 air bags on the drive axle located outboard where the K4 has only 2 inboard.

Here is a link of what the K4 looks like which is almost what the IH has. I was given pictures of Foretravel making their very last chassis in 2018. I have no idea where I have them and will look and see if I can find them.

2024 FORETRAVEL REALM PRESIDENTIAL & REALM FS605 - Spartan RV Chassis

Re: It never ends....

Reply #22 – April 03, 2024, 02:04:23 pm

Quote from: rusczyk56 – April 02, 2024, 06:30:01 pm

FTs are now built on Spartan K4 chassis..... They would be better off on the Freightliner... Better service accessibility, more reliable and more. Just ask all the poor big coach on Spartan owner about having their $500k purchases parked for months, even as much as a year while Spartan worked through 7 iterations of "DEF Heads" that kept failing and causing the cursed "start countdown"...

Freightliner (I.E. Daimler/MB) did not have the issues. Funny thing about the chassis builders and emissions compliance is the engine manufacturer is not fully responsible for a compliant aftertreatment system, it's the chassis builder. Thus one of the reasons many of the coach builders were "helped" out of the business (Bluebird, Country Coach and others who built their own box). Even Thor is working at killing the Tiffin Power Glide (in house) chassis and turning to Freightliner....emission compliance can eat you alive....

Of interesting to note along these lines - I noticed a couple of discussions on iRV2 mentioning that Spartan did not have a 50-state-compliant K2 motorhome chassis (not sure about the larger ones) for 2025. K2 has the Cummins ISL9. K3 and above have an X12 or X15. Realm FS450 is on the K2.

Last month Entegra announced they were making Freightliner an option for the Cornerstone. Entegra has always been Spartan-only for their DPs.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #23 – April 03, 2024, 02:30:58 pm

Quote from: Moby – April 01, 2024, 05:59:59 pm

On this trip:
New Generator
New fuel shut off solonoid
New water heater control board
New water pump
New front AC

We RV why?

(We RV why ?)

Moby. Realize that some if not most of those items will not need replaced again ( on your watch). I have no choice, my DW is very much in love with being able to monitor our clean bedding ( hotel bed bugs) purchase and use organic foods ( costly dining out) and the BIG one , abusing the opportunity to use the bathroom immediately while traveling or making a sandwich or drinks.

So... still cheaper and more convenient than a motel. Been there, done that. Hard pass.

Re: It never ends....

Reply #24 – April 03, 2024, 06:51:25 pm

Bob & Sue,
Oh we very much agree with you (and others) in your sentiments, and I acknowledge the "if you ain't polishing you're fixing" - said as my grandson is polishing the duels right now - and both conditions are in effect through this trip.
Sometimes you just need friends to tell you that you're doing the right things.
Thanks to all of you for listening to me cry about life a little.
No, we're not gonna sell Alice.

Affiliate Notice