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Topic: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries... (Read 628 times) previous topic - next topic

For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Have any of you had any issues fitting a non-8D LiFEPO4s into the stock battery tray?  Specifically, I am inquiring about ones made abroad, ie, LiTime, Lipuls, Chins, etc.

To give more detail, a lot of these 200ah-400ah lithiums seem to be close to an 8D size without coming out and saying they are an 8D battery (although I see there are now some 8D ones). These measure somewhere in the 20.75" to 20.94" range.  By comparison, Oreilly's 8D AGM is 20.75" per spec. The tray is 19 3/8". I assume the measurements by the lithium manufacturers take into the handle width so getting a measurement of what the base is, is difficult.

Are the base of the lithiums 19 3/8" or less? I don't want to mess with lengthening the tray, and since a lot of these manufacturers have a no return policies on Amazon due to hazmat, I want to get it right the first time.
Jason
2000 U295 36' Non-slide  ISC350

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #1 –
Both my 200ah batteries fit well within the old 8D footprint. Not as long, but same width. no modification needed. Both are LiTime/Chins
AKA Chuck
1993 U280 40' WTB, Build 4345, CUM 8.3 "Falcor", 2010 Honda CRV TOAD (Spock), 970W solar on roof
Full-Time traveler between Quartzsite AZ, Longview WA, Ellendale ND, and Lake City SD
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Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #2 –
Having group 8 batteries often a lot of options for installing lithium's. In that size 300 A/H are becoming common and are often better priced per A/H than other sizes. Also most have of the 300 A/H batteries have 200 A/H BMS capacity so having a set of 2 really supports larger inverters and can easily start larger generators and boost the main engine.

My 2008 Nimbus was only fitted with group 4 D which being only 8-5/8 inches wide made for some limitations. There is room where I could cut-weld modify the frame for larger batteries to fit but I found many options in smaller sizes. I went with two of these.

LIPULS 12V 300Ah LiFePO4 Lithium Battery - High-Capacity Power for Demanding...
Unfortunately, this was a new model already discontinued. They tell me an updated model is being introduced soon.
In the meantime, consider this one.

LiPULS 12V 280Ah LiFePO4 Lithium Battery, Built-in 200A BMS, 3584Wh En

The BMS in these batteries work very well with alternator charging and any charger with AGM profile. I added brackets to take up the smaller footprint and I also added hold downs. I am surprised that Foretravel does not secure the batteries. While extremely rare having the batteries move and short out in the event of a rollover is not a good thought.

Here is a picture of one of batteries secured. There are 3/4 spacers on the ends to take up that gap.

Microsoft services


Dennis Haynes
Bohemia NY
2008 Nimbus 342 SE Carlyle
Build #6475
Motorcade #19148

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #3 –
I put two 300 amp LifeBlue in my coach. Went with heated ones and they fit fine.
Gary and Darlene
2008 Nimbus SE 4030 Tahoe
Build #6463

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #4 –

This has turned into a bigger ordeal than what I expected. I found a battery that is size friendly, but like most, they do not have SAE studs. Most of battery terminal screw types are M8 but this one is M10.  If it was a M10, I would get something like this. It may work since it is a 3/8" but IDK.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BXSYNJP9/

What are people doing to connect their stud terminals to their batteries? I am starting to think that I may need to resize the tray if needed.

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Jason
2000 U295 36' Non-slide  ISC350

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...Cable connections.

Reply #5 –
For a number of reasons, I would upgrade the cables and connections and get away from the SAE terminals for the house loads. The tin-plated heavy-duty ring terminals such as from SEL-Term work really well. You will need some good crimp tools and use good shrink tube to seal the ends and provide strain relief. My next step will be adding bus bars so I can connect/disconnect each battery individually for servicing. For me at least annual capacity testing is part of battery maintenance.
Dennis Haynes
Bohemia NY
2008 Nimbus 342 SE Carlyle
Build #6475
Motorcade #19148

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #6 –
The batteries I got were labeled as M10, but were really M8.  You can get the adapters on Amazon like in your link that are in M8 or M10
2014 ih45  (4th Foretravel owned)
 1997 36' U295 Sold in 2020, owned for 19 years
  U240 36' Sold to insurance company after melting in garage fire
    33' Foretravel on Dodge Chassis  Sold very long time ago

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #7 –
Any li-ion installation should have UL 1427 marine cabling. Rubber burns. UL1427 is pvc coated and does not support flame and will not drip off unlike the rubber welding cables. Rubber cables are fine for AGM or gel. They do not burn if shorted or a cell fails
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...Battery Cable

Reply #8 –
Lawson Flex Battery Cable. This is good flexile stuff. Check out the Amp/Hour ratings for a given size. Pricey but worth it.

https://catalogs.lawsonproducts.com/lawsoncatalog/Lawson-Products-Volume-38-Catalog-2023/18-3/

And some really good crimp lugs.

https://catalogs.lawsonproducts.com/lawsoncatalog/Lawson-Products-Volume-38-Catalog-2023/18-11/

Dennis Haynes
Bohemia NY
2008 Nimbus 342 SE Carlyle
Build #6475
Motorcade #19148

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #9 –
Quote from: Dennis H –
Lawson Flex Battery Cable. This is good flexile stuff. Check out the Amp/Hour ratings for a given size. Pricey but worth it.

https://catalogs.lawsonproducts.com/lawsoncatalog/Lawson-Products-Volume-38-Catalog-2023/18-3/

Rubber. Not UL 1427 marine cabling. It's not expensive as you only use small lengths. Li-ion cells are UL listed. The cases are not. Mk gel batteries are UL for the entire battery. A shorted li-ion battery cable can cause a hard to put out fire. If the rubber drips off then touching cables can add to the fire. I noticed new multi million dollar yachts run lifeline 8d AGM batteries as salt water will not dangerously short them out
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #10 –
Quote from: Caflashbob –
A shorted li-ion battery cable can cause a hard to put out fire.

LiFePO4 batteries (which is what most install in RVs) are very different from li-ion used in things like laptops.

LiFePO4 Vs Lithium Ion & Other Batteries - Why They're #1.

LiFePO4 is incombustible. It can withstand high temperatures without decomposing. It's not prone to thermal runaway and will keep cool at room temperature.

If you subject a LiFePO4 battery to harsh temperatures or hazardous events (like short-circuiting or a crash) it won't start a fire or explode.
Learn every day, but especially from the experiences of others. It's cheaper!  - John C. Bogle

2000 U320 36' non-slide / WildEBeest Rescue
2003 U320

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #11 –
Quote from: Caflashbob –
Rubber. Not UL 1427 marine cabling. It's not expensive as you only use small lengths. Li-ion cells are UL listed. The cases are not. Mk gel batteries are UL for the entire battery. A shorted li-ion battery cable can cause a hard to put out fire. If the rubber drips off then touching cables can add to the fire. I noticed new multi million dollar yachts run lifeline 8d AGM batteries as salt water will not dangerously short them out

Been around industrial batteries for a long time. Forklifts, large UPS systems, 600 kw solar farm, emergency generators, etc. Shorted/failed lead acid, AGM, and even Gell can make a real mess and once things get ignited there is usually no stopping until the battery or bank is discharged. A 48-volt 1,200 A/H battery has an amazing amount of energy. Seen a number of bad days.

Dennis Haynes
Bohemia NY
2008 Nimbus 342 SE Carlyle
Build #6475
Motorcade #19148

Re: For those that have switched to lithium house batteries...

Reply #12 –
Thanks for the update
"Riding and rejoicing"
Bob
1997 U320 40' Mid entry, build 5132,  wtbi ce27, 4th owner
2007 Solara convertible
2 prodeco tech outlaw ss electric bikes

1095 watts solar
08 Ls 460 and a sc430
2000 Ford F-250 superduty 4x4