Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

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Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

September 30, 2010, 06:14:04 pm

At our next campground we will be boon docking for 5 days. So we wanted to arrive with a full 110 gallons of fresh water.

We have suspected for some time that when we are filling and the gauge jumps to Full that there is room for more water.

Today we kept track of the amount of time that elapsed from when the needle hit Full and water stated to spill over the top. It was exactly 10 minutes. (Please note: this was a one-time experiment. We will not knowingly allow water to run down the bulkhead. Foretravel usually gets it right, but this overflow situation and placing 100 pound batteries in a near inaccessible location is hard to figure out.)

Now, to some that might be the impetus to get new gauges. For us it is just knowing how to live with the present gauges. We have other places where funds can be put to better use.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #1 – September 30, 2010, 06:22:49 pm

George,
I have the same problem, and I've decided to live with the inaccuracy. But, try not to overflow the water tank unless you have an overflow pipe directly out of the utility bay. Remember that this practice can lead to bulkhead rusting bolts as the stagnant water in the bay eventually goes out the bulkhead joint.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #2 – September 30, 2010, 06:26:43 pm

Right. We know all about that. We have had our bulkheads beefed up with more bolts and then undercoated.

We will most likely be happy with just five more minutes of fill time going forward. This was a one-time experiment.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #3 – September 30, 2010, 06:47:30 pm

I installed a digital flow meter in the shore water source line. jc

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #4 – September 30, 2010, 06:56:02 pm

Quote from: hotonthetrail – September 30, 2010, 06:47:30 pm

I installed a digital flow meter in the shore water source line. jc

Now why didn't I think of that? That's a great method to gage the tank fill.

Thanks! You get an at-a-boy applause

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #5 – September 30, 2010, 07:11:35 pm

Well. . .our tank has an overflow tube that rises about 2" above the exit hole, and runs down to the bottom of the bay. We usually watch the water level through the translucent tank wall; and, turn off the water fill just when the water reaches the tube. We also have a black mark indicating the full level on the back side of the freshwater tank seen in the power cord bay. Love "The Burrow".

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #6 – September 30, 2010, 09:16:30 pm

how can running a little clean fresh water out of the overflow and down onto the bulkhead area
even come close to competing with the damage done by the amount of dirty, oily, salty, road grime infested water that the bulkhead area would experience when driving a few miles in the rain?

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #7 – September 30, 2010, 09:19:38 pm

Wayne,

The answer is metallurgy & chemistry. Metals and water are not friends.

Although all sorts of coatings have been developed to combat the chemical interaction (ions, and so forth), time has a way of degrading even the best of coatings w/o maintenance.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #8 – September 30, 2010, 09:24:13 pm

Quote from: hotonthetrail – September 30, 2010, 06:47:30 pm

I installed a digital flow meter in the shore water source line. jc

Tell us more. Where did you get the meter? How was it installed? How about one or two photos.
Finally, for the meter to be effective, don't you have to know how much water you have used since the last fill up?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #9 – September 30, 2010, 09:40:02 pm

I removed the panel above the electric and water reels and can watch the water level and shut off water when tank is full without overflowing.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #10 – September 30, 2010, 09:42:21 pm

Felix,

I will take a look at mine and see if I can do the same. There are so many good suggestions here. Thank you for your tip.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #11 – September 30, 2010, 09:43:10 pm

George,
I forgot to mention that driving with a full tank of water is something I never do. Although the storage, utility, fuel compartment design is meant to handle these additional 900 pounds of water, it's just that much more weight which increases fuel consumption and adds needless stress on the bukhead area.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #12 – September 30, 2010, 10:25:42 pm

We installed a reverse osmosis filter system for all water going into the fresh water tank. Part of the system is a float switch that I installed at the water line for a full tank. The float switch is simple to install. Pictures are here: The selected media item is not currently available.

One could connect such a float switch to an electrically controlled valve or to a lamp to indicate a full tank. On our system, the float switch controls the RO pressure pump and a valve in the supply line.

I found the water level for a full tank by filling the tank to the point of overflow, and making a mark on the tank a bit below the water line that I could see through the translucent tank. I drilled a hole at the appropriate level and installed the float switch at the appropriate level. I have been pleased with the performance of the float switch in controlling the filling of our fresh water tank.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #13 – September 30, 2010, 10:45:05 pm

Agreed, overflowing 10,000 gallons of drinking water (potable) would have a slight effect compared to 50 miles in a rain soaked road after a dry spell (dropped oils and chemicals on the road) or driving in the first spring rain after winter salt use.

Greg
1995'280 se

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #14 – October 02, 2010, 09:48:18 am

Quote from: Peter & Beth – September 30, 2010, 09:43:10 pm

George,
I forgot to mention that driving with a full tank of water is something I never do. Although the storage, utility, fuel compartment design is meant to handle these additional 900 pounds of water, it's just that much more weight which increases fuel consumption and adds needless stress on the bulkhead area.

Well, I for one always drive with a full tank of water. I was glad I had it if you were to break down or get stranded. I had a full take of water and was going to St Louis and Branson five years ago around Thanksgiving. I was forced to stop in a flying J with the out side water turned off for three days. It was ok as I had my water tank filled and we rode out the storm and the snow melted and was plowed and we left 3 days later. We were not the only ones surprised by it either. It was hot the day before and the thunderstorms caused me to stop early and I was glad I did.

I also was in Texas and got a call my mother in law was sick and not doing well. We went to AZ and she passed. I filled with water because in March there is no open water faucets in Iowa and they had a big blizzard and it delayed me a week.

It is not a huge difference in fuel mileage and weight. I would fill up a full tank and drive and that way you have your house ready to live in if you need it.
Just my opinion and I do not travel from campground to campground but rather use walmarts, truck stops and rest areas to spend the night on the way to a location.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #15 – October 02, 2010, 10:01:22 am

Quote from: Greg Jones – September 30, 2010, 10:45:05 pm

Agreed, overflowing 10,000 gallons of drinking water (potable) would have a slight effect compared to 50 miles in a rain soaked road after a dry spell (dropped oils and chemicals on the road) or driving in the first spring rain after winter salt use.

Greg
1995'280 se

While you are correct that fresh water is not as detrimental to metal as that containing road salts, etc, there is NO means designed to drain water that accesses the bulkhead beam from above. Said another way, it is sealed to the outside by the FG floor panel.

So any water that does get in there STAYS in there on the bare metal box beam.

If I had an overflow that exited into the wet bay (ours doesn't-- it vents externally) I would drill a hole in the basement (use a magnet to locate and avoid any of the beams) and extend the vent to below the coach floor where overflow would be harmless.

Brett Wolfe

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #16 – October 02, 2010, 10:13:51 am

Quote

I for one always drive with a full tank of water. I was glad I had it if you were to break down or get stranded.
I would fill up a full tank and drive and that way you have your house ready to live in if you need it.
Just my opinion and I do not travel from campground to campground but rather use walmarts, truck stops and rest areas to spend the night on the way to a location.

That has been my philosophy also. You never know what the next day will bring. It is good to be prepared.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #17 – October 02, 2010, 12:35:22 pm

Quote from: Peter & Beth – September 30, 2010, 09:43:10 pm

George,
I forgot to mention that driving with a full tank of water is something I never do. Although the storage, utility, fuel compartment design is meant to handle these additional 900 pounds of water, it's just that much more weight which increases fuel consumption and adds needless stress on the bukhead area.

Our most recent trip involved going to a location where we would be without water for five days and so we filled out water tank to the very top. Most of the time we travel with at least a half a tank of water or more. We have arrived at campgrounds only to find out that there was no shore water. So we do travel with a decent amount of water in our tanks.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #18 – October 02, 2010, 12:51:52 pm

I must have either a complete different setup, or am missing something. Fresh potable drinking water has little effect on metal, infact if you submerge (and keep it so) metal in fresh water it will last as long as the same metal exposed to the air and elements. As you drive, the tires pick up water and it gets slung into the bulkhead by the centrifugal force of the tires. The water then evaporates leaving any salts and chemicals behind. Then corrosion starts and rust jacking occurs and the seam widens and the process feeds itself. Having operated many vessels in salt water, the key to longevity is flushing every nook and cranny with fresh water when arriving from a trip. The fresh water does not cause the corrosion, the salts left from an improper washdown do. On our rig, the overflow is o. The right side, top of the tank and the water spills down the bulkhead just forward of the tires, the overflow is not what causes the corrosion. However since the road salts are left when the rain water evaporates. The introduction of new water may restart the electrolysis process of the old salts. Since the fresh water overflow is completly exposed to air, the water only touches a small area of the bulkhead, the suspension and a section of the angle iron below. It is not trapped or contained inside any area. The prior owner of our coach let it overflow many times, I let it pour out till I turn it off. I regularly fresh water wash the whole underside including all the brake and suspension components, whithout fail the next day after driving in rain.

It is a similar situation as would be experienced if you drive your car in the snow and encounter salted roads and slush. The worse thing you can do is store that salt laden vehicle directly in your garage without a complete fresh water flushing as the road salts corrode metal faster in a warm garage environment than they would had you left the car outside.

Immediatly after a long trip, or after driving in rain or snow we always fresh water wash the undersides of our cars. At 5 years old or more, the undersides and suspension of my cars looks exactly as it did when new, rust and corrosion free.

The bottom line is that the fresh water is not the cause of corrosion in itself. The salts trapped from road splash, and left after the water evaporated are.

Greg
1995 280 se

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #19 – October 02, 2010, 04:14:23 pm

Brett,

This is not clear to me. When we filled our tank to overflowing, maybe a quart of water ran onto the ground before we got it shut off. Does this mean that some water is now sitting on the fiberglass sheet that covers a portion of the coach bottom?

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #20 – October 02, 2010, 04:21:45 pm

George,

If the water came out of a hose that exited under the FG floor, no worries.

If that water spilled into the wet bay and then flowed out, any water that sat in the wet bay can potentially leak down to the bulkhead area which is immediately behind and below the floor to the wet bay. The only thing keeping it out of the bulkhead area is chalking where the rear wall meets the floor of the wet bay. And, after all those years in there, I am not sure I would trust caulking to protect that area.

Again, if the potable water tank overflow doesn't currently exit to the outside/below the coach, I would sure spend the time and (little) money to extend it.

Brett

Quote from: George Stoltz – October 02, 2010, 04:14:23 pm

Brett,

This is not clear to me. When we filled our tank to overflowing, maybe a quart of water ran onto the ground before we got it shut off. Does this mean that some water is now sitting on the fiberglass sheet that covers a portion of the coach bottom?

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #21 – October 02, 2010, 04:53:16 pm

Not likely, the overflow (typically) exits to an open air space, not into a compartment or enclosed area. It just runs down the outside. Much like your ac condenser has a drain outside your house.

Greg

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #22 – October 02, 2010, 05:28:45 pm

It's not clear to me how the rear utility compartment is layed out as I've never had any of the panels removed either on the street side or the curb side. But, I was under the impression that the utility bay compartment has a water proof seal on the inside of the compartment at the rear most bulkhead.

I'm also not sure where the fresh tank overflow opening is located. I assumed at the top of the tank. Therefore, I assumed that the water overflow would just run off the top then along the sides of the tank and then out the sides of the compartment, or out a broken area of sealer caulk in the bulkhead area.

Does anyone know for sure?

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #23 – October 02, 2010, 05:41:34 pm

Excellent question, Peter.

Now that it is accepted fact that we (the ForeForum) does so much for Foretravel, it owuld be nice if they would chime in here once in a while and answer some of these questions that keeping being asked.

n fact, I think I will make a new topic about that.

Re: Making sure the fresh water tank is completely full

Reply #24 – October 02, 2010, 05:52:09 pm

I can tell you for a FACT that on the older Unihomes like ours, the potable water tank overflow is connected to a hose that exits the coach.

And as I posted above, I would not count on 10 year old caulking between rear vertical wall and basement floor to keep standing water out leaking down into the bulkhead area. I can tell you for a fact that it may not-- based on seeing the damage done to the rear bulkhead by water leaks into the wet bay on coaches I have inspected. I can not tell you the source of the water I saw in these coaches-- it certainly could have had other sources than the overflow.

So, let me suggest that before we go too much further with this discussion, let's have someone who has first hand knowledge of the routing of the overflow on Unicoaches from the potable water tank tell us if this is a non-problem (overflow routed through hose to outside coach), an easily solved problem (extend existing hose through basement floor), etc. Speculation won't do us much good.

Brett Wolfe

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