Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

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Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

October 27, 2012, 11:26:08 am

The fiberglass fan on my 1991 U300 with 6V92TA engine and less than 80,000 miles on it lost a blade while cruising on interstate 40 at a steady 1500 rpm. The blade hit the front core of the radiator and a small hose that I haven't yet identified. The engine was vibrating badly and I pulled over thinking I had a flat tire. Road service sent out Tennessee Towing and they took me to J&K Truck Repair in Crossville TN who refused to do the repair even if I showed him the cash beforehand. He had at least one garage bay empty all day and as many as three mechanics mopping the floor at once. He wouldn't even allow me to stay in his parking lot where the tow truck left me. He called Reed Truck repair and they sent a mechanic to look at it, but they also refused to fix it. They called everyone in town but didn't find anyone. I walked across the street to the BP truck stop and asked if I could park in their truck parking area but they wouldn't allow it. I then walked over to Cumberland Worship Center and asked if I could park in the church parking lot and they said I could. I found the broken blade and removed all of it, putting all the pieces together to be sure none of it was still in there. I removed the water sensor from the top of the radiator and put it in a bucket of water on the back bumper so the computer would allow the engine to run. I started the generator and let the air compressor pump up the air brakes and suspension. I then started the engine and immediately limped away slowly to the church parking lot without letting the engine warm up. Now I'm in the process of removing the radiator myself in the church parking lot 30 feet away from J&K Truck Repair. I worked on it until it got dark last night and then walked over to a pizza joint cuz I was starving. The lady who owns the place asked me what's wrong so I told her the story. Her son in law owns a trucking company in town and she said she'd call him. I'm telling everyone about J&K Truck Repair, Reed Truck Repair, and the BP truck stop refusing to help me at all. Tennessee Towing was very helpful however, as was the church. Without them I don't know what I'd do. I've never felt so alone before. What a cold hearted little town to be stranded in. I called Foretravel and got some valuable advice. They told me to remove the radiator from the bottom of the coach because there are brackets that won't fit through the rear door. I see the brackets that they're talking about but I really think it will fit through the rear door. Have any of you removed the radiator through the rear door successfully?... Those of you with a fiberglass fan should get rid of it before it explodes. According to Foretravel it has been replaced by Flex-O-Lite part number 8681 and it's now a plastic 28" diameter fan blade which hopefully is stronger? The radiator is unavailable and VERY expensive. I'm told I'll have to get a local radiator shop to order a new core and solder it in which will take a week or more and cost a thousand dollars... (sigh)... thought you guys would wanna know this stuff.

Scott

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #1 – October 27, 2012, 12:07:42 pm

Sorry to hear about your problems.

Town sounds about as friendly as Van Horn Texas.

After my experience with my bulkhead failure in Louisiana I know what it feels like to be stranded. I had lots of help from the local truck stop however and that made things a lot easier. Hope you can "get out of town" soon.

Roland

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #2 – October 27, 2012, 12:12:35 pm

Wow! Sounds like Crossville has developed some RV animosity!.

We have a member or two that live in Crossville. They may know who in the area can help out. There is a significant RV presence in the Crossville area. You may consider Road Service to approve a tow back to Knoxville where the old Foretravel of TN people still are. Or go the other way to Nashville where there's plenty of truck service with all the entertainer coach companies.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #3 – October 27, 2012, 01:23:19 pm

Scott,

We had a '92 with a 3208 Cat engine and took the radiator out the rear. We had to take off the louvered door and that gave us almost enough room to get the radiator out. The mounting ears along with the hose neck still wouldn't fit, so we had to remove a small piece of the fiberglass lip that is hidden behind the louvered door to get it out. With you having a 6V92 your radiator will most likely be some bigger than what we had so this may not help.
Hope you can get it out and re-cored and on your way.
Pamela & Mike

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #4 – October 27, 2012, 01:44:18 pm

From my experience a few notes;
Removal out the bottom, will not go thru the rear small door & is heavy for 1 person.
Be very careful, it is easy to damage the radiator upon installation.
Recore the radiator? See if FOT has a replacement, they did a few years ago for the 1989 U300 w/6V-92, maybe still have or can get a replacement.
Our experience with recoreing, always cheaper to buy new if available, My guess a recore from radiator shop will be closer to $2K.
I would tow to the Foretavel shop near Severeville, just east of Knoxville about 15 miles on I-40.
Unless you have all the tools & equipment for this, I feel your in for a Real learning experience.
Good Luck
Dave M

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #5 – October 27, 2012, 01:47:26 pm

It will cost another $500 to tow my coach to Knoxville according to Tennessee Towing, and he does long distance towing like that every day.

According to Tennessee Towing there is a lot of RV animosity here and other places around the country. He said rich guys with fancy RVs treat him terrible and try to blame stuff on him. He usually photographs the outside of the entire coach before he hooks up to it and makes note of every little scratch and dent so he won't get blamed for it later... Please be nice to tow truck drivers and truck mechanics so this won't happen to me again. What if this were a repair that I couldn't do myself?... As for the BP truck stop I have no explanation for why they won't let me park there.

I have everything disconnected from the radiator except two easy to reach bolts and I'm ready to lift it out. The radiator appears to be too heavy for one person to lift alone safely. The brackets are bolted to my radiator, not welded, so I disconnected the brackets and it looks like the whole radiator with the shroud still attached will fit through the back door. I don't know about the hose nipples. I have a hack saw here and I can notch the fiberglass if needed. I'm gonna see if Tennessee Towing will help me lift the radiator if he's got a few minutes. Tomorrow I'm going to the church here and I'll ask some of the guys in the church if they can help me lift it, or maybe the radiator shop could send someone over to pick up the radiator and they can help me lift it out? I don't have a car with me so I'll need someone to take it over to the radiator shop.

One thing that bothers me is that I can't find the transmission cooler lines. I was expecting two metal lines like an automobile automatic transmission has. I found one small braided line and disconnected that, but there doesn't appear to be a second line, so I don't know if that was a transmission line or not? I disconnected the big line on the bottom and the two smaller ones on the top, a smaller line that got partially cut by the broken fan blade that may be an overflow hose or something because it goes up to the top of the radiator shroud, and the tiny braided hose... and that's it... so how does the Allison transmission and the hydraulic retarder get its cooling from this radiator?

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #6 – October 27, 2012, 01:51:58 pm

According to Foretravel the radiator isn't available and even when it was available it was over $4000! (gasp)... I think I've almost got the radiator out. I have it hanging by two easily reachable bolts with all the hoses disconnected and the fan blade removed... Now I gotta find some help to lift it out.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #7 – October 27, 2012, 01:56:37 pm

We have a 91 GV 280 with a Cat 3208 T engine. A few years ago, the fiberglass fan exploded and wiped out the radiator. We were in Colorado 15 miles east of Gunnison. The tow truck knew where to take us. The garage removed the radiator, replaced the fan with a plastic one and delivered the radiator to a radiator shop. When the radiator was repaired, the garage installed it. The repairs took five days and cost about $2,400.00. The reason for the five day wait was in ordering parts.
We disconnected our Jeep and drove the 4 wheel drive roads in every direction from Gunnison for the five days the work was going on. The only loss was the cost of repairing the radiator.
I later learned from Brett Wolfe that the fiberglass fans are a problem.
Alan and Bobbie Dodson
1991 Foretravel GV 280
2000 Jeep TJ built for trail driving in Colorado.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #8 – October 27, 2012, 02:15:18 pm

I think of blade failures every time I go by one of those big wind generators! Thank goodness they don't have the rpm our engine fan blades have! And fiberglass is not the best material for a fan blade. New composite sound better, but the jury will be out on them for several more decades.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #9 – October 27, 2012, 02:19:13 pm

Quote from: RRadio – October 27, 2012, 01:47:26 pm

One thing that bothers me is that I can't find the transmission cooler lines. I was expecting two metal lines like an automobile automatic transmission has. I found one small braided line and disconnected that, but there doesn't appear to be a second line, so I don't know if that was a transmission line or not? I disconnected the big line on the bottom and the two smaller ones on the top, a smaller line that got partially cut by the broken fan blade that may be an overflow hose or something because it goes up to the top of the radiator shroud, and the tiny braided hose... and that's it... so how does the Allison transmission and the hydraulic retarder get its cooling from this radiator?

I don't know either, not being familiar with your layout.

But I'll gladly bump it back up to the top so someone else can see it.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #10 – October 27, 2012, 02:31:06 pm

Yours a rear radiator model?

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #11 – October 27, 2012, 02:48:57 pm

Yes, the 1991 U300 has a rear radiator and I'm gonna try to take it out through the rear door as soon as I get some help to lift it. I have it all disconnected and ready to lift out.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #12 – October 27, 2012, 03:50:49 pm

Transmission cooler is a separate unit that the coolant goes thru before going to the radiator. Follow the radiator hoses to locate.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #13 – October 27, 2012, 07:25:43 pm

RRadio,
Yes, as Tom & Linda stated the transmission cooler is a separate unit - it's cylindrical on the drivers side with two transmission hoses on the bottom and radiator hoses on the end.
I had my radiator replaced by a shop and they did remove it from the rear door. They had to notch the fiberglass and still made stress fractures in the gelcoat. It's a tight fit and with the radiator so heavy it's hard to lift it that high to get it out and be watching the fiberglass as well. I can't imagine trying to do this in a parking lot but I guess you're half way there.
I believe the small hose that was cut is a burp line so when you fill the coach with coolant there is no air pocket in the thermostat housing -it's a nice feature to have. I think it's hydraulic hose - overkill for the application but nice that it's so rugged and has those easy connections.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #14 – October 27, 2012, 08:03:35 pm

Scott,

How badly damaged was the radiator? I had a fan go into my MB bus radiator with all the same symptoms you described. I cleared away the fin damage and squashed each one of the damaged tubes with a vice grip. I then filled the damaged ends with epoxy (J.B. Weld), let it set a couple of hours and hit the road. Didn't leak and gave me time to get home and repair it. I think I had about 8 bad tubes so 16 ends to repair.

I don't know how badly yours is damaged and if such a repair is possible but know what a bummer it is to be stuck in a strange town surrounded by unfriendly people.

Pierce

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #15 – October 27, 2012, 08:52:18 pm

Thanks for the information on the transmission cooler. I had been misinformed before that there was a transmission coil in the radiator. I'll look for the transmission cooler when I'm down there next time. I intend to change all the hoses while the coolant is out of the system.

The radiator has a gash in the front coil that is about three inches long and cut probably three tubes at least, and a smaller gash about an inch long that probably cut two more tubes, and I can't see any more cuts but a lot of tube fins are bent and the small rubber hose was cut... I guess that's the "burp line"?... I still don't know what the tiny braided line is... or is that the one that's the burp line?

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #16 – October 27, 2012, 09:35:24 pm

My 93, U300 with 6V92 is a side radiator so I can't help much with the removal but I can tell you that my 93, U225 had a rear radiator and after much effort the rear radiator had to come out the bottom. I also found that if I had needed a new radiator, which I didn't, I could get a High Efficiency new core for $600 for the U225. Foretravel wanted $4000 for a new one. The High Efficiency core would have given me 30% more cooling in the same size package so if you need to recore the radiator, a High Efficiency radiator would probably be less than $500 more in cost and well worth the extra expense.

Also you didn't mention if you had Coach Net or Good Sam's Road Service. It is my understanding that both will get your coach to a repair facility that can and will repair your coach at no cost to you. I wouldn't leave home without that security. It saved Jeff and Carol Savournin $1200 in tow fees several years ago when their harmonic balancer and fan let go near Ft. Stockton, TX.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #17 – October 27, 2012, 09:49:53 pm

I just happend to have the coach here at the house and looked at the lines. The burp line I was referring to before, is on the drivers side and goes from the thermostat housing (which is also where one of the main top coolant hoses comes from) and connects directly to the radiator top tank. It has an outer fabric braid and is about 5/8" in diameter - maybe that's the tiny you are referring to?
I did see a rubber hose that looks like 1 inch heater hose: goes from the water pump, through a hole in the fan shroud and I'm not sure where it goes from there. Maybe that's the hose that got cut?
You mentioned replacing all the hoses. I would evaluate their condition first. Most of the larger (2"+) hose are of very good quality (silicone) and on my coach are in very good condition with no cracks. The very bottom hose (about 3-4", with a spring inside to prevent suction collapse) is standard rubber but again was in very good condition and I'm pretty sure it was custom fabricated for Foretravel so they would be the only source for a new one. I still have my original.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #18 – October 27, 2012, 09:53:58 pm

Kent has an excellent point here. If you have extended AAA coverage, they will also give you 150 free miles. It covers anything you may be driving at the time of the problem.

Pierce

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #19 – October 27, 2012, 10:49:09 pm

I have Progressive Insurance and they tow to the nearest truck service center, which they did, but the service center refused to help me. I have no complaints with Progressive or Tennessee Towing, they did exactly what they promised. The crew of trained professional diesel mechanics should be ashamed of themselves. A first timer with a little bag of tools can do a job they didn't dare do in the parking lot next to their fully equipped shop... and everyone in this little town is gonna know about it by the time I get outta here. Bad news spreads quickly in a small town like this. I'm sure everyone knows everyone else here.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #20 – October 27, 2012, 11:18:50 pm

Scott, how can one tell if the fan is fiberglass? I currently have my fan out, as I am trying to replace the hydraulic fan motor (a big ordeal that I will share when it is all resolved). It is somewhat transluscent, pale yellowish, but I can not see any fibrous strands in it. It is a homogenous texture. Can you take a picture of your fan? I'd hate to re-assemble this whole thing, just to have the blades disintegrate in the near future. Since my coach is a '92, but manufactured in Nov. of '91, I suspect that we might have the same fan, though with entirely different engines, I hope not. Did FOT quote you the price of the replacement fan blade? I'm not sure a 28" fan would even fit in the existing shroud in front of the radiator for my Cummins 8.3.

A Foretravel owner and formerly active member of the old Yahoo Foretravel owner's website is John Lang; his lives in Crossville and is a fine gentleman. Private Mail me for his phone number. He may be able to direct you to some mechanical assistance.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #21 – October 27, 2012, 11:30:44 pm

Don,
I had my original fiberglass fan replaced in 2001 and I remember it being black and the glass strands very evident on the surface and especially on edges where the fibers would fray a little and turn a white color. Your fan sounds like it's plastic so I don't think you have to worry. I suppose you could call James Triana and verify.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #22 – October 27, 2012, 11:37:14 pm

Thank you SO much for the feedback! I am relieved to learn that my fan blade is probably plastic. No fibrous nature at all.

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #23 – October 28, 2012, 05:17:49 pm

My fiberglass fan blade is white, and you can easily see the strands of glass fibers in it. The replacement fan is probably made of black ABS plastic according to what Foretravel told me, and it's $243.75 at Foretravel, but probably cheaper if I order it locally through NAPA I predict.

I have a new problem now, it's gonna be 29 degrees here tonight and I don't know what I have to do to keep my motor home from freezing, especially the water tanks. Are they insulated? I don't have any electricity here unless I run the diesel generator all night. Is there electric heat tape in the tanks? I'm practically out of LP gas and the furnaces are full of wasp nests because they've never been used. The coach was in Florida for the past 14 years. Will my tanks freeze tonight? It's supposed to get down to 28 degrees again here on Tuesday night... Should I post this as a new question instead of adding it onto the bottom of this thread?

Re: Fiberglass radiator fan explosion!

Reply #24 – October 28, 2012, 05:33:16 pm

Tanks wont freeze with that temp over several hours (like 4-6)

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