Replacing Coach Batteries

Topic: Replacing Coach Batteries (Read 1948 times) previous topic - next topic

Replacing Coach Batteries

September 10, 2014, 10:19:45 am

I have three lifeline 8D AGM batteries on my "new" coach. I was led to believe they were only three years old. Unfortunately, they are at least six years old. Regardless of age, they are toast, falling below 10 volts shortly after charging to float stage with the generator on.

I am planning to replace them with three new lifelines, but am investigating alternatives. That great RV resource, Batteries Plus in Tulsa, will replace them for $2,200 out the door. Their location is not real RV friendly, and I do not have the warmest, fuzziest feeling about their expertise with RVs.

Owasso has an Interstate battery dealership. They would order the Lifelines, but can only get them with the flag posts; mine now have auto tops. Has anyone used Interstate 8D AGM batteries for their coach batteries? Do they work satisfactorily?

Interstate has also agreed to install them for $75 total if I have them drop-shipped to their store. I have found several places to buy them on the internet, but most will only deliver (some for free) to a commercial address. If anyone has bought the big Lifelines on the internet, I would appreciate if you would share your experience.

I have researched the foreforums history and saw some mention of replacing the 8D's with a couple of yellow tops (each). Interstate sells the MT7 AGM, which has a four-year full replacement guaranty. I discussed this option, but I would be giving up too much amp-hour reserve.

Bottom line is I need to pull the trigger pretty soon and would welcome any advice from *anyone* on this forum.

Thank you,

Trent

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #1 – September 10, 2014, 10:42:22 am

I ordered 3 8D gels to replace my batteries, which have the same symptoms, from the Trojan distributor in Houston and mine are costing me around $550 each.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #2 – September 10, 2014, 10:54:46 am

Check our oreillys and ask about free install

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #3 – September 10, 2014, 11:03:32 am

Go to Craigslist and use the search box for "solar batteries" or similar search words. They will have several different sources and types. After getting acquainted with all the possibilities, go to RV, solar or battery forums to see what others have done using the batteries you have found and how it's worked out. Takes a little time but a good way to get up to speed. This is what I did and have been very pleased with our system. Our battery bank cost less than 10% of what businesses wanted for the same exact battery(s). Some luck involved but aside from saving money, it is a good education.

Pierce

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #4 – September 10, 2014, 11:09:44 am

I got my Lifelines from AMSOLAR in Oregon a few 3 yrs ago and have no problems with them so something in your charging circuit is obviuosly wrong (IMHO) I would have the alternator checked out as that may be putting out too much and make sure the inverter is set for AGMs. Maybe the dip switches were set up prior to these Lifelines for another type and if the inverter is Equalizing them consistantly that is a bad thing. These things should be checked out and reset if needed regardless of the type you finish up with.
JohnH

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #5 – September 10, 2014, 11:16:13 am

Best long term results are deka AGM's according to my 30 year Rv electrical guru.

Nine years in a 24 volt Angola bus prevost conversion was about normal according to him when he replaced all four. Two were still useable sort of.

Installed them in our coach. 20% discharge they are good for 5,000 cycles.

See MK batteries deka cycle chart.

50% discharge was 1000 cycles or was it 2,000?

Used the flag style terminal as with new ends anyway was easy to convert.

They are perfectly sized to go with the 130 amp hour charge rate heart charger and the 160 amp alternator.

Expect ten years use at least as I have a 130 watt solar panel to charge them in storage.

Cut no corners on batteries IMO. THE most important part in the coach.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #6 – September 10, 2014, 11:32:38 am

I just replased my two 8d gels with dekka 8d gells, cost was $1275.00 installed. Your price seems high.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #7 – September 10, 2014, 11:38:49 am

2 gels for $1200 = $600 each incl labour, so 3x 600= $1800 and AGM cost more so I would think Trent's cost pretty close to correct. I paid for 3 in 2011 $1500 and Batteries (good ones) have gone up.
JohnH

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #8 – September 10, 2014, 11:42:28 am

I found batteries plus to be the cheapest. They will also pay you for your core. I bought three 8D gells there for 1500 and got back 300 for my old ones.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #9 – September 10, 2014, 12:33:06 pm

Trent, Your 3 house batteries are wired in parallel, which means one bad battery can draw down the other two. I would disconnect the batteries and try to charge one at a time finding the bad one(s). Your coach will easily run on 1 or 2 batteries. And if you don't dry camp, you can just buy 2 batteries to save $ and create less heating in battery area, prolonging all batteries.

By far the majority of Foretravels have used 8D8G GEL batteries manufactured from East Penn / Deka. They make the same GEL & AGM batteries in identical cases with different labels, with MK being the most well-known. These batteries weigh about 150 lbs each.

Our coach was made with space for two batteries and we have only used East Penn / Deka GELL 8D8G batteries. We have bought our East Penn batteries from CarQuest & NAPA, who will order them from their warehouse and have them in a couple of days. Our costs have been $400 - $500 each. O'Reilly may also carry East Penn, and all the auto stores stock them in their warehouse with their own label. One CarQuest store's warehouse was out of 8D8G and had East Penn's warehouse deliver East Pen labeled batteries to the CarQuest store for our purchase. They are all the same inside with different labels outside.

Different sellers have different 100% & pro-rate warranty periods, which may also account for the different price at different labels.

Our 2012 batteries from NAPA were $507 each, which they said was their lowest price for their larger customers. Auto stores are noted for having a wide range of selling prices for different customers, something that makes one want to say they are from one of the big customers.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #10 – September 10, 2014, 12:43:44 pm

Definitely replace your AGM batteries with AGM batteries. While some still seem to prefer Gel batteries, I've read as much information as I can from a variety of sources, and it appears as if AGM is the superior technology at this time.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #11 – September 10, 2014, 12:50:53 pm

I replaced my old 8D batteries at O'Reilly's. They ordered the batteries, I took the coach in, and a couple of strong young guys quickly changed the batteries. Yes, I was right there watching and answering their questions. As I recall the cost was about $450 per battery.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #12 – September 10, 2014, 12:52:32 pm

Cycle life of gels vs Agm is 50% less.

See the MK batteries website and look at the duty cycles.

I would think most Foretravels replace the oem AGM's with duplicate AGM's not gels.

But money is money. Wrong place to economize IMO.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #13 – September 10, 2014, 01:34:51 pm

When I replaced my house batteries last year, it was suggested I contact the battery seller who advertises on the Prevost forums. I did, and he gave me a very good price. He called back to give me an even better price since he was at a Prevost rally and had a rally price to offer. He could have had them shipped to me for a very reasonable price, but since I am close to their factory, I had my mechanic pick them up and do the installation.

These are LifeLine AGMs with the automotive posts, but they are available either way.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #14 – September 11, 2014, 12:15:09 am

Last month I re-batteried our 270 with two AGM 8D's for the house when also adding 400W of solar on the roof. You also might consider the start batteries. I purchased 3 (although 270's only come with two, but the battery rack has room for three) because I live in a cold climate and want no problems starting when cold outside. Having all the batteries AGM makes the charging and control of the whole system easier. Internet 8D AGM's for $600 delivered to house. Ad showed they were made in China, paperwork said Vietnam. They are heavy! Asked for performance and specs, got three pages of info. I am happy and ready.

Caution: I had to replace the post connectors with flat bolt-on types. This was a good thing as several of the "clamp" type had been overtightened and did not actually do the job.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #15 – September 11, 2014, 12:31:49 am

Quote from: Caflashbob – September 10, 2014, 12:52:32 pm

Cycle life of gels vs Agm is 50% less.
See the MK batteries website and look at the duty cycles.

I visited the MK website. They seemed to be pushing gels versus agms. I think I recall reading on this forum that agms are better for our application. The agms seem to get at least twice as many cycles as gels and gels are more sensitive to charging voltage.

Or am I misunderstanding (again)?

BTW, if a cycle is a charge and discharge event how many cycles occur if, during a travel day, I stop two different places and then proceed on my trip?

Thanks,

Trent

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #16 – September 11, 2014, 01:13:02 am

Quote from: TulsaTrent – September 11, 2014, 12:31:49 am

I visited the MK website. They seemed to be pushing gels versus agms. I think I recall reading on this forum that agms are better for our application. The agms seem to get at least twice as many cycles as gels and gels are more sensitive to charging voltage.

Or am I misunderstanding (again)?

BTW, if a cycle is a charge and discharge event how many cycles occur if, during a travel day, I stop two different places and then proceed on my trip?

Thanks,

Trent

Maybe they are inventory heavy on gels? Seriously you coach came with AGM's for a reason.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #17 – September 11, 2014, 01:18:29 am

Quote from: TulsaTrent – September 11, 2014, 12:31:49 am

I visited the MK website. They seemed to be pushing gels versus agms. I think I recall reading on this forum that agms are better for our application. The agms seem to get at least twice as many cycles as gels and gels are more sensitive to charging voltage.

Or am I misunderstanding (again)?

BTW, if a cycle is a charge and discharge event how many cycles occur if, during a travel day, I stop two different places and then proceed on my trip?

Thanks,

Trent

This is the same old Ford vs Chevy argument. I happily use Gels and have my coach/charger set up for them, with Yellow Top AGMs doing the starting. As my coach came from the factory. I haven't done anything except likely replaced my GELs earlier than needed. The AGMs are 12 yrs old (original batteries) and the GELs are 9 years old (I didn't know any better and listened to folks who told me I needed to replace the old GELs at 3 years.

Everybody has an opinion, and neither the AGM crowd nor the GEL crowd have the right answer for everyone. Take your pick, just like Ford or Chevy.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #18 – September 11, 2014, 06:46:15 am

Quote from: Brad & Christine Slaughter – September 11, 2014, 01:18:29 am

This is the same old Ford vs Chevy argument.

Everybody has an opinion, and neither the AGM crowd nor the GEL crowd have the right answer for everyone. Take your pick, just like Ford or Chevy.

It is true that (nearly) everybody has an opinion, but it's not quite the same as the "Ford vs. Chevy" argument. Ford and Chevy both use essentially the same technology, while Gel and AGM are different battery technologies. Therefore, it's important to read as much as possible on the subject, and then base one's choice on the best available information.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #19 – September 11, 2014, 08:19:49 am

Quote from: kb0zke – September 10, 2014, 12:50:53 pm

I replaced my old 8D batteries at O'Reilly's. They ordered the batteries, I took the coach in, and a couple of strong young guys quickly changed the batteries...As I recall the cost was about $450 per battery.

X2 for O'Reilly's. We did exactly the same as David. (2) Super Start AGM8D's at $450 each, installed for free by the store manager and his burly helper. I took care of removing and replacing the cables - all the big guys had to do was handle the heavy lifting.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #20 – September 11, 2014, 11:27:23 am

Brad, I am sure you know this but all battery makers suggest you keep both banks the same style for safe charging--unless there are seperate charging systems.
ie- agm-agm or gel-gel
JohnH

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #21 – September 11, 2014, 11:37:49 am

Quote from: John Haygarth – September 11, 2014, 11:27:23 am

Brad, I am sure you know this but all battery makers suggest you keep both banks the same style for safe charging--unless there are seperate charging systems.
ie- agm-agm or gel-gel
JohnH

According to the specifications sheet, our 2004 U270 36' came from the factory with gel batteries for the coach and AGM batteries for the chassis. It still has gel batteries for the coach and AGM batteries for the chassis. I have wondered why Foretravel did that knowing that battery manufactures and other parties have stated that which is in the above quote.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #22 – September 11, 2014, 11:43:54 am

You and me both, plus there are other instances were FT did something that makes me wonder about their thought process ie the Rolock issue at Bulkheads for one.
JohnH

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #23 – September 11, 2014, 11:44:00 am

Quote from: LTG – September 11, 2014, 11:37:49 am

According to the specifications sheet, our 2004 U270 36' came from the factory with gel batteries for the coach and AGM batteries for the chassis. It still has gel batteries for the coach and AGM batteries for the chassis. I have wondered why Foretravel did that knowing that battery manufactures and other parties have stated that which is in the above quote.

Possibly financial.

Re: Replacing Coach Batteries

Reply #24 – September 11, 2014, 12:16:45 pm

Bob, if it (was) a financial issue that would make me wonder even more about the quailty build of our coach's. Surely another couple hundred bucks on top of the original cost of them would NOT have been an issue. I think it was other thoughts, or lack of them!
JohnH

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