Skip to main content ↑ ↓
Topic: Lots of White Smoke (Read 7819 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #160 –
Did'nt research this but is it possible the injection pump could be timed 180 degrees out?

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #161 –
Got back from Seattle and had a chance to check my leakdown tester.  No adapters for injectors, unfortunately.  I'm still happy to send you the tester if you wish to obtain an adapter.  Bear in mind that it is necessary to prevent the engine from rotating when you pressurize a cylinder.  Dangerous if it catches you unaware. 

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #162 –
Quote from: Chuck Pearson –
  Bear in mind that it is necessary to prevent the engine from rotating when you pressurize a cylinder.  Dangerous if it catches you unaware. 
The Soft Boulders have already used the barring tool, so they've got better leverage than trying to hang onto a propeller while in goes the air.  Art Joly Previous owner of N8772D, S/N 22-5959.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #163 –
Aircraft pressurize to 80 psi and test with two people. After we bring the prop up to TDC firing, we pressurize the cylinder and then rock the prop a few degrees on each side of TDC and look for the highest reading. Naturally, 80/80 would be perfect but until it gets toward 80/70, it's usually in good shape. There is a calibrated orifice between the two gauges. You do have to keep a firm grip on the prop as it could kill or badly hurt someone if it hit them. A borescope is nice to hook to a laptop to take a look inside. Easy to see cylinder wall scoring or a valve problem. With a Detroit 2-cycle, you can pull the air box covers off the block and look at the rings as the are visible in the ports.

In the photo below, the exhaust manifold has been remove along with the front air box cover.

Pierce

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #164 –
Tyler,
      Check out a you tube video titled, Cummins Spill Timing Method B+C Model. Sorry couldn't get the link to work.
                    Mark C.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #165 –
Quote from: Hammer2100 –
Tyler,
      Check out a you tube video titled, Cummins Spill Timing Method B+C Model. Sorry couldn't get the link to work.
                    Mark C.

Cummins Spill Timing Method B+C Model - YouTube

My word!  This video is transcribed from tape!

The secret to my success?  Coffee.

Public comment on YouTube?

"Holy shit, i worked at a heavy truck Ford dealership back in the day when these B and C engines were used in the F7000.... When these engines came in for white smoke or breaking up at high RPM, all we did was find TDC ( the Ford engine had the timing marks ) broke free the gear on the injection pump, turned the engine back about the thickness of a paint stick, retightened the injection pump gear and assembled any other removed parts and started the engine.... Advancing the timing a couple degrees always took care of the white smoke and engine breaking up at high RPM's... I'm sure that was an EPA no-no at the time but, that's what we did to get those boat anchor engines to run properly....... God, i miss the good ole days....,"

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #166 –
I think the problem could be, during rebuild they may have missed torque on the pump. It would slip retarded. From the video cummins ignored the damper mark because poorly marking or slipped outer rings. I was shown this way of finding TDC from a man from England, been using it for 35 years. Extreme caution must be used when using the valves to stop the piston. 

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #167 –
Quote from: Hammer2100 –
I think the problem could be, during rebuild they may have missed torque on the pump. It would slip retarded. From the video cummins ignored the damper mark because poorly marking or slipped outer rings. I was shown this way of finding TDC from a man from England, been using it for 35 years. Extreme caution must be used when using the valves to stop the piston.
reply #54 he already found TDC

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #168 –
Craneman,
          I had read that, but how was it done. Cummins is saying to ignore the timing pin and the marks back when the engines were first built.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #169 –
Quote from: Hammer2100 –
Craneman,
          I had read that, but how was it done. Cummins is saying to ignore the timing pin and the marks back when the engines were first built.
He states he used the valve to piston method. I have always used that method degreeing cams on race engines.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #170 –
Yes, me to. But the post is about preforming the test, including finding TDC. He's in a pickle and just trying to help.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #171 –
We got everything assembled and the fuel lines bled.  Put two cans of Schaefer's soy shield in tank and let the engine idle for 20 mins or so.  The smoke was much less than before so we took the coach for a test drive up the mountain.  White smoke has turned to black smoke and has all but disappeared.  The engine does blow out some black smoke while under load but there is none at idle.  Operating temp stayed at 185ish and the engine has lots of power.  I think we're going to just leave out in the morning and try to make it to Williamsport. 

I don't have a clue what's going on with the engine but hopefully it is going to be ok.  A wire on the tachometer sensor broke off and the stud broke off when I tried to remove the nut so we don't have a tachometer at the moment.  We called mot to try and get a new one but they didn't call back.  That seems to be a trend lately ha. 



Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #172 –
Just asking but since he has the injectors out is there any way of sticking a small dowel in the injector port and using that instead of a valve,thinking back on my Yamaha 250 timing with the dial indicator in the spark plug hole.I cringe when they use the valve method.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #173 –
Quote from: The Soft Boulders –

I don't have a clue what's going on with the engine but hopefully it is going to be ok.  A wire on the tachometer sensor broke off and the stud broke off when I tried to remove the nut so we don't have a tachometer at the moment. 


And that's the way it goes sometimes.  You do all the right things, find nothing glaringly, obviously wrong, yet when you put it all back together the problem is gone.  Just chalk it up to your inherent mechanical genius and go for a ride.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #174 –
Maybe the valve lash check and like the other poster said the injectors just being taken out cured something,would still get the
fuel pressure gauge down the line to see what the pressure would be at higher rpm and get the aftermarket overflo valve.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #175 –
Most likely had a small contaminant in one injector .    Luck is on your side.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #176 –
Hannah and I really appreciate all of the input from everyone.  We're not convinced that the problem has resolved itself but we don't know what else to try.  It's definitely scary hitting the road without knowing for sure.  I'd much rather be broke down at a nice campground than on the side of the road somewhere.  It would be nice to be able to say that I fixed the problem but I'd settle for just knowing what the problem was and or why it is no more. HA!

Adding a fuel pressure gauge is on the list of things to do.  A pyrometer and boost gauge would be nice additions as well. 

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #177 –
Quote from: The Soft Boulders –
  A pyrometer and boost gauge would be nice additions as well. 
Both our Airstreams had them and I was surprised our's did not. The word I got from the Factory & CAT was, unless the engine had been 'hot rodded', there was no need.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #178 –
Many older trucks and some rv's came from the factory with boost gauges and pyrometers.
Driving up a hill, with foot to the floor, may not cause coach to downshift, but you would be surprised how high the exhaust temps can get. If I cannot accelerate or am slowing down, with full throttle, I always manually downshift.

Re: Lots of White Smoke

Reply #179 –
My dad a lifetime trucker long before automatics told me "if climbing a hill lift the throttle and step back down if it doesn't accelerate go to a lower gear" I used that info on all my trucks and never melted a piston.