Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

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Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #125 – November 23, 2019, 04:11:02 pm

Ready for the flak but I would change it to synthetic just to get the low temp viscosity benefit, the front to the back is a long way
and the less overpressure with cold oil the better, just my opinion.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #126 – November 23, 2019, 04:17:05 pm

Yes, that is another discussion! I will be doing research on this subject. I would love nothing better than to run Rotella T6 in all of the systems that can use it. Rotella T6 isn't on the shepherd approved fluids list, And of course we have to take into consideration the fan motors for the cooling system. I will be digging deeper into the specifications and researching the topic for the next major service.
Don

Quote from: John44 – November 23, 2019, 04:11:02 pm

Ready for the flak but I would change it to synthetic just to get the low temp viscosity benefit, the front to the back is a long way
and the less overpressure with cold oil the better, just my opinion.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #127 – November 23, 2019, 04:55:42 pm

After figuring out Foretravel had over done the temp controller on our coach I changed the controller from 180 degrees full speed to the rest of the rv industries 199 degree Dynamatic fan controller. ,

This seems to have lowered the systems temperature running and took off up to 50 plus hp loss.

Identical temps after the change. Noticeably more power. Better fuel mileage.

Seemed like and turned out to be a good step to reducing the cooling systems wear as the Cummins dealer service manager mentioned the higher heat would wear the systems parts quicker plus the hp and mileage lost

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #128 – November 24, 2019, 12:48:02 am

When I did my steering box several years ago I changed the filters and replaced the hydro oil with Rotella T-6 Synthetic, same oil I use in the engine. No problems, I like the low temp flow with the synthetic in both applications.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #129 – November 25, 2019, 09:16:30 am

Flashbob,could you post where you bought that controller again, thanks.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #130 – November 25, 2019, 11:05:14 am

After changing my steering gear I didn't have a jack to lift the coach so bought 4 HDPE Poly cutting boards. Greased & paired them up in front of each front wheel and drove on top of them then did the stop to stop thing setting the stop clearance. (got idea from here on the forum)

Didn't change the oil. My system has separate pumps & reservoirs for fan & steering. Had lots of trouble with fan system overheating but steering system barely gets warm. I assume not a lot of friction in the system. Synthetic sounds like a good idea though. Keep us informed of any research you do in that area.

see ya
ken

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #131 – November 25, 2019, 12:07:07 pm

Ken that's called a grease plate.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #132 – December 02, 2019, 10:16:51 pm

My Sheppard model/part number is TAS65M100, according to the book anyway.
Yesterday when I back our coach out I notice a dinner plate sized spot under the steering box.
My local guy has time to get it in AND has the tools.

Question.
If I call this Redhead place and order a rebuilt sent out, are the cores they have the same as mine?

Doing it myself is not an option as the weather and my work schedule won't allow.
All suggestions are welcome.
Many Thanks

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #133 – December 03, 2019, 12:34:10 am

Quote from: Phranko – December 02, 2019, 10:16:51 pm

My Sheppard model/part number is TAS65M100, according to the book anyway.
Yesterday when I back our coach out I notice a dinner plate sized spot under the steering box.
My local guy has time to get in in AND has the tools.

Question.
If I call this Redhead place and order a rebuilt sent out, are the cores they have the same as mine?

Doing it myself is not an option as the weather and my work schedule won't allow.
All suggestions are welcome.
Many Thanks

It will cost you $300 more to have them send out one of their rebuilt units. If you can't wait to have yours shipped to them and returned then that would be your option. Their cores for our coaches are the same as ours.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #134 – December 03, 2019, 09:21:56 am

Thanks Craneman.
I guess it will depend on whether or not my repair guy wants the coach at his place that long.
Either way it's gotta be fixed and my window of opportunity is closing fast with the approaching holidays.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #135 – December 04, 2019, 01:36:05 pm

UPDATE: I first need to give Lon Framke a shout out for getting the Sheppard puller to me so quickly. I don't know how I would have managed to get it done without it. Thanks Lon! The box is in and after about 400 miles, all is good! 👍

Some observations about the process. The bundle of cables, airlines, etc. that runs up into the dash, plus the brake light solenoid assemblies make it difficult to get the sector shaft through the hole in the mounting plate. For the cable bundle, I removed the clamp and used an endless loop ratchet strap to nudge it away from the box. The brake light switches are mounted on bulkhead fittings with air lines on one side and the wires on the other side of the sheet metal bulkhead fittings. Rotating the brake switch solenoid assemblies counter clockwise a few degrees gave me about a quarter inch of extra clearance.

It's definitely advisible to disconnect the chassis battery ground, as there are exposed 12v hot terminals exposed on the brake light solenoid switches right next to the Sheppard box. Some bullet points that come to mind.

When you send the unit in, make sure you note how the ninety degree fitting for the return line is clocked. Unfortunately I hadn't thought to take a picture of the box before I sent it in.

Thinking that the elbow was pipe thread and therefore put in with sealant and tightened to its final resting place, I had hoped that the the rebuilder would have noted the clocking of the fitting upon disassembly to put it back the same way. Unfortunately, it was180º off and so pointed up towards the framing above. I didn't notice how close the fitting would end up to the framing above until I had the box bolted in. Fortunately, I was wrong about the fitting used on the Sheppard M100 being pipe thread. Thankfully, it is one that uses a locknut (ORB?), so it I was able to rotate the 90º without removing the whole box by loosening the locknut, but just barely because of clearance. A 7/8" Crowfoot wrench and a long extension helps!
I made the mistake at connecting the easy fitting first (supply side). While I had the unit on a table in front of me, I had taken the caps off to see if any oil would come out. None did. So after I got it in and took the caps off of the JIC male fittings on the box, I connected the supply side first because it is easily accessed from inside the compartment. Apparently, there is enough residual pressure in the hydraulic system even after spitting for several days that will push oil out of the return line. Since it was necessary to attach the return line from underneath, this resulted in trying to turn the JIC flare nut with hands that were coated with 15W-40 while trying to align it with the fitting on the box. This proved to be an exercise in frustration. Several rounds of cleaning my hands and trying to get the flare nut started while laying on my back... Well, that wasn't fun all. Finally, after clocking the 90º to several different positions and rerouting the return hose, I found an angle that would let me get one hand on the return hose to wiggle it while rotating the flare nut with the other. This involved some yoga I didn't know I had in me to get my whole upper body inside the compartment, but it was better than doing it from underneath with oil running down my arm.
The Sheppard box is heavy with a high center of gravity when oriented as installed. Just when I had the unit situated and the sector shaft almost able to slip into the hole in the mounting plate, it would topple back and catch on the edge of the sheet metal compartment walls. I am afraid I chipped the paint

I tried every which way to lift it in from underneath while supporting the weight with a short step stool, but I ended up needing at least one more hand to balance it. Finally, I routed a ratchet strap (endless loop type) over the steering column support bracket in the dash from above and through the hole around the steering column. I made a sling out fo some flat strapping that attached to the fittings at the top of the unit with a couple of cable clamps. Since I had the JIC caps on the fittings at this point, there was no danger of damaging the threads on the fittings. This arrangement kept the top heavy unit from twisting away by pulling on it from above. I would advance the ratchet several clicks from inside, go below and use wedges to hold it, then went back inside to release the ratchet to take up the slack and then tighten it up a few more notches. Finally, the sector shaft went in the hole on the mounting bracket. Supported from underneath with wedges, and then had to reposition the loop around my home made support sling to change the center of gravity so I could get the bolt holes to line up.

The first leg of our trip happened to be on a very windy day and I could barely feel it. The bleeding turned out to be a non issue. After hooking up the lines, I filled the reservoir and turned the steering wheel lock to lock numerous times without the pitman arm being hooked up. After running the engine and checking for leaks, I turned it almost lock to lock. I have yet to set the stops, but I am being very conservative in apply cut angle until I do. When I bring it back to home base, I will do it in the shop. So far, I am very happy with the result. Chris was in line for the puller tool, but he has already managed to get it done without Lon Framke's tool. Lon suggested I keep it until I am sure I don't need it anymore. I want to use it one more time before I send it back or on depending on what Lon says, so that I can get a new pitman arm retainer locking tab washer. The old one has shed several tabs reducing the number of choices for clocking the tabs to fit the grooves.
I intend to do a write up as time permits as there are a lot of things I wish I could go back in time and tell myself about this process, and but for now here are some pictures of the process.
Don

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #136 – December 04, 2019, 02:05:14 pm

Good Job Don, I will use some of your advice on mine. Also you don't need to pull the pitman arm to replace the lock tab.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #137 – December 04, 2019, 02:16:22 pm

Quote from: craneman – December 04, 2019, 02:05:14 pm

Good Job Don, I will use some of your advice on mine. Also you don't need to pull the pitman arm to replace the lock tab.

I know Chuck, but I want to properly torque the thing. I use my Milwaukee cordless ½" impact to put it on. It is rated at 700 ft. lbs. of fastening torque, but I didn't let it go until it couldn't go anymore. I tested it by trying to break it loose with a ½" breaker bar and a cheater. I feel sure that it is over 350 ft. lbs., but I want to know it's right. I have the stuff to do it properly at home base. I will be taking the coach there when next we move in a couple of weeks and will do the plunger settings and torque the pitman arm retainer then. I want the puller there when I do it just in case...

Don

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #138 – December 04, 2019, 02:38:34 pm

Makes sense,
I will remove the auxiliary radiator and clear the box. Pull the generator out to make a hole to torque the nut. The way mine is set up, would be impossible to get my 600# torque wrench and allen socket on to torque the nut.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #139 – December 04, 2019, 08:41:41 pm

Chuck, I managed to get the torque wrench in without cutting a hole but it wasn't easy. I took a 1/2" drive black impact socket and cut about 1/2" off the drive end . I put that in a 15/16 3/4 drive socket with a 1" piece of 5/8 Allen in the 5/8 socket then welded this all together. It was just the right length once I put it on the torque wrench. NOW torquing that puppy to 350 while under the coach
that did strain my wheaties. This getting older isn't for the faint of heart. Got it all in and operational and like Don the bleeding was a non issue since the fittings were on the top of the box there was no place for air lock. you will probably need some help getting the fan box out, I couldn't hold the bolts while putting wrench on other side so I got a buddy to help me get fan out even though gearbox was already back in. I wanted to clean and paint box area.
Chris

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #140 – December 04, 2019, 08:43:06 pm

Nice follow up Don.
Ordered ours today, delivery next Tuesday.
Had to go the expensive route due to holidays and upcoming trip
I did get $30 off by asking if they had a senior, military or 1st cousin discount.
Worth the extra money not to have to deal with this on the road.
Of course I would rather have put this cash towards installation.

Still can't believe that I looked at our steering box when Don started this thread.
It looked fine, 2 short 30 mile trips and here we are.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #141 – December 04, 2019, 09:58:53 pm

Has anyone replaced the steering box when doing the Xtreme headlight upgrade? Not sure it makes sense but it does seem access would be a breeze. Even though I have no issue with my 2001 steering box at this time I do have the headlight/ step upgrades scheduled for mid March. Better yet, maybe I should quit reading the forum just to find something else to worry over

Greg

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #142 – December 04, 2019, 10:11:35 pm

Quote from: Ghallid – December 04, 2019, 09:58:53 pm

Has anyone replaced the steering box when doing the Xtreme headlight upgrade? Not sure it makes sense but it does seem access would be a breeze. Even though I have no issue with my 2001 steering box at this time I do have the headlight/ step upgrades scheduled for mid March. Better yet, maybe I should quit reading the forum just to find something else to worry over
Greg

Xtreme moves the coach in and out of the bay each day you are there. Would not be a viable option

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #143 – December 05, 2019, 02:44:36 am

Quote from: Don & Tys – December 04, 2019, 02:16:22 pm

I know Chuck, but I want to properly torque the thing. I use my Milwaukee cordless ½" impact to put it on. It is rated at 700 ft. lbs. of fastening torque, but I didn't let it go until it couldn't go anymore. I tested it by trying to break it loose with a ½" breaker bar and a cheater. I feel sure that it is over 350 ft. lbs., but I want to know it's right. I have the stuff to do it properly at home base. I will be taking the coach there when next we move in a couple of weeks and will do the plunger settings and torque the pitman arm retainer then. I want the puller there when I do it just in case...

Don

When I did mine I was advised (can't remember who) to NOT use a impact when installing due to the hammering action on the steering box gears.
I torqued my bolt with a 1/2" dial torque wrench and a length of pipe added to the handle. I don't remember the formula for the pipe extension to multiply the torque readout. It was roughly 100# on the dial = 400# of torque at the socket.
I think Brett knows the calculation.
Much easier to use the shorter handle under the coach and can still muster the proper torque with a few good grunts.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #144 – December 05, 2019, 03:48:25 am

Unless I'm reading it wrong 100# on the torque wrench dial is 100# on the socket, unless you have a torque multiplier.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #145 – December 05, 2019, 04:03:20 am

Here is a sample of a calculation with extended crowsfoot or cut-off wrench.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #146 – December 05, 2019, 04:34:18 am

That's great but he said he just had a pipe over a torque wrench and socket.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #147 – December 05, 2019, 04:45:18 am

Then you would have to calculate the length of the pipe to center grip of torque wrench and adjust settings if adapter is used. Is this illustration what you are considering?

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #148 – December 05, 2019, 05:12:19 am

I think the process Brett has described is used for lug nut torque,a socket,a breaker bar and a cheater pipe can be set up for a desired torque.All I was saying is if you have a socket and a torque wrench with a dial and you move the torque wrench to 100 pounds you will have 100# on the nut no matter how long of a cheater pipe you use.

Re: Bit by the Sheppard M100 bug

Reply #149 – December 05, 2019, 07:07:53 am

Quote from: John44 – December 05, 2019, 05:12:19 am

I think the process Brett has described is used for lug nut torque,a socket,a breaker bar and a cheater pipe can be set up for a desired torque.All I was saying is if you have a socket and a torque wrench with a dial and you move the torque wrench to 100 pounds you will have 100# on the nut no matter how long of a cheater pipe you use.

X2
Also if you are using 4:1 torque multiplier you don't get 4:1 torque ie if your torque wrench is reading 100# you are NOT getting 400# out of the multiplier. Depending on who you listen to you will loose 10 to 20% so a 100# reading on torque wrench will give you between 320# and 360# of actual torque
Chris

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