1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

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1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

February 19, 2021, 12:37:30 am

I went to the storage facility to check my coach. I keep the water tank drain valve open to keep water drippings. It seems working. To my surprise, no pipe is broken. I got two pipe broken at my house.

But when I about to leave, I tried to open the door from inside, and the door handle just decide to quit. I am locked from inside!

Luckily I have tools inside the coach. Took the cover off, use a screw drive to open the door.

The door handle is broken form the plate

How to secure both together?

Also on the first picture, as you can see, the plate to keep the screen door shut is missing.
What is a good way to fix that?
I plan to use JB Weld a small aluminum there, but want to see if there is better solution.

Thanks!

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #1 – February 19, 2021, 12:58:42 am

Tap it and use a large area washer and screw with loctite.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #2 – February 19, 2021, 07:47:58 am

We had the same experience with our 86 Grand Villa.. same assembly. Handle broke off completely... just as your did.. we took off the plate as you show in your photo and used a screw driver to move the lever to open the latch... no replacements except from FT factory.... you can buy JUST the inside plate that includes the handle assembly....it was about $ 125 from factory

The handle assembly to the mechanism inside is the weakest point... but you got 30 years of service... ours broke after 35 years

I will send you a PM if you need to call us to discuss

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #3 – February 19, 2021, 08:05:25 am

That whole door handle assembly was a poor design. Yes, it works. Yes, it has held up for many years. It could have been much better, IMO.

You can see in the first photo that the sliding lock in the lower left on the panel has been disabled with a piece of split rubber hose. We have the same rubber hose "modification" in place on our door.

The sliding bolt at the top of the panel should also be disabled in some manner (or completely removed). That bolt has caused several Forum members to be locked out of their coach. If you slam the door closed when exiting the coach, that bolt can jump over to the "locked" position.
At that point, your only recourse is to climb in through a window.

We use ONLY the dead bolt to lock our coach. Both of our locks on the door handle assembly are disabled.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #4 – February 19, 2021, 08:26:06 am

OK, here goes.
Why not try what is called a "Dutchman' pin"?
Here is what you do:
1.) Clamp the handle, square facing up.
2.) Fasten the steel plate down tight onto the handle. Make sure you have the plate oriented correctly for assembly.
3.) Buy (if you don't own) a #10-32 tap and a tap drill for it that will yield 55% finished thread form.* Nominal size is .161" dia. Go next size bigger.
4.) Use the tap drill to drill a hole on the parting (midpoint between the corners) line between the two pieces--about 1/2" deep.
5.) Tap the hole about 3/8" deep.
6.) now assemble the parts with the door cover. The two halves of the tapped hole must be facing each other.
7.) Screw a #10-32 set screw into the hole after coating it with--WHAT ELSE? SHOE GOO, or whatever caulk or adhesive you have on hand. {I forgot} Run the set screw in until flush with the end of the square. If there is nothing a flat head cap screw will hit after assembly, you can use one of those, but countersink for the head a bit (.015")
7.) DONE. Put back on door.

* Standard tap drill charts will point you at 65-78% thread form and this can cause a lot of broken taps lodged in the hole when 55% thread form will break a fastener (bolt) before stripping the threads out of a hole when depth engagement of the fastener is 2-3 times thread diameter in depth.
This "Dutchman's Pin" method has been used for many years in drill press gearing where a square key would slide out and precise location of the mating parts was mandatory.
Simplest method ever.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #5 – February 19, 2021, 08:45:39 am

Quote from: nitehawk – February 19, 2021, 08:26:06 am

Why not try what is called a "Dutchman' pin"?

If you are, like me, intrigued by hearing new terminology, and always want to learn more...try the link below. It is informative & also humorous.

Dutch Pins: How To?

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #6 – February 19, 2021, 09:30:15 pm

Quote from: Running Odometer – February 19, 2021, 12:37:30 am

Also on the first picture, as you can see, the plate to keep the screen door shut is missing.
What is a good way to fix that?
I plan to use JB Weld...but want to see if there is better solution.

I don't think anyone answered your question about the screen door latching plate. I took a few photos of the plate on my door, which I believe is identical to yours. Your missing plate was 4" x .75" x .5" x .5" and would be easy to fabricate out of flat aluminum stock. You could bend it using hand tools and a vise. I don't think JB Weld would be strong enough to hold it. I would use 2 or 3 small sheet metal screws. Much more secure!

I added a few measurements to the photos to give you a better idea of the size and shape. Hope this helps.

PS: Looking at my photos, I notice that my screen door latch strikes the plate pretty near the top. I don't know why they made the plate so long. It could be 2" long and work just as well.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #7 – February 20, 2021, 09:28:26 am

Entry Door Inside Plate/Handle

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #8 – February 20, 2021, 09:46:36 am

Stump,

Good find, but I suspect the listing is out-of-date and they would not actually have one in stock if called. Wouldn't hurt to try!

I also did a unsuccessful Google search for:

Part# 039979-01-000

Tri-Mark 11022-05 Entrance Door Latch Plate Cover Assembly

For those of us who have this same latch plate cover...where the handle has NOT yet broken off, I wonder if it would be prudent to remove the plate and try to strengthen the critical joint? The plate looks like mild steel. The handle is some kind of cast metal. What would be the correct way to reinforce the connection without destroying the parts? Welding? Brazing? Some kind of epoxy?

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #9 – February 20, 2021, 09:59:16 am

The handle is most likely pewter, which means not possible to weld, solder, etc.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #10 – February 20, 2021, 10:10:02 am

In Reply #1 Chuck (craneman) suggested tapping the hole in the handle and using a large flat washer (fender washer) with a screw/bolt.

Can you tap threads in cast metal (like pewter or similar) or would it tend to crack the handle?

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #11 – February 20, 2021, 10:19:17 am

Look, if you don't feel comfortable doing a Dutchman's pin, here is another way.
1.) Get the smallest rattail file you can find. Usually located with the chainsaw tools. in a hardware store.
2.) Midpoint of the flat on the steel plate, file a round relief.
3.) Do the opposing flat the same way.
4.) Set the plate on the handle--in the proper location as used when assembled.
5.) Tap drill (for #6-40 thread) and then countersink the handle thru the two holes in the plate, into the handle. NOTE: The head on a #6-40 flat head socket cap screw is .307 dia (theo sharp) and ,097" max height of the head, with the head included angle of 82 degrees
6.) Tap the two holes with #6-40 tap.
7.) Coat the two flat head socket cap screws with Loctite.
8.) Assemble with cover plate, then assemble handle and steel plate. (you might want to grind the heads flush with the plate)

For what it is worth: Minimum tensile strength: 1,830# for a #6-40 thread
So with two cap screws you have double tensile strength of 3,660#. Good luck on shearing these with normal actuation on the handle.
For those not sure about this method, why not mix up some JB Weld and apply to the mating surfaces of the two parts and the square? This in addition to the cap screws.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #12 – February 20, 2021, 10:29:40 am

Quote from: nitehawk – February 20, 2021, 10:19:17 am

For those not sure about this method, why not mix up some JB Weld and apply to the mating surfaces of the two parts and the square? This in addition to the cap screws.

I wonder if this Loctite product would be superior to JB Weld in this application?

Loctite® Epoxy Weld™ Bonding Compound

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #13 – February 20, 2021, 10:34:39 am

Worth a try. But I am anal about holding something together with only an adhesive. I prefer a backup such as the cap screws.
When I replaced our engine compartment insulation I used the recommended adhesive and the old screws with the large plastic fender washers. Peace of mind is great!

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #14 – February 20, 2021, 10:51:17 am

I like to remind people that I am not your average idiot. I am an above average idiot.

Just had another thought of how to fix this fastener.
How about drilling and tapping the existing center hole in the handle for a Holo-Krome 1/16-27 pressure plug? Or the next size up?
Major diameter is .312/.307 and length is .312".
After drilling and tapping the hole use a hacksaw to cut the handle square across corner to corner--both ways.
Now when you assemble the two parts the threaded taper plug will expand the square sides until they are stopped by the steel plate.
A tapered wedge principle has been used for years on the wood handles of axes, sledges, mauls, and hammers for years.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #15 – February 20, 2021, 11:07:46 am

Quote from: nitehawk – February 20, 2021, 10:51:17 am

How about drilling and tapping the existing center hole in the handle for a Holo-Krome 1/16-27 pressure plug?

Why does everything you suggest sound (to me) either technically challenging, or requires exotic hardware I am not likely to find at Home Depot?

Remember I are a English major. I'm not all that sharp, but I know how to fake it.

It's a slow weekend here, now that the electic power is back on and the most recent crisis has been averted (or postponed). I will pull my door plate off and take a close look at it. All reinforcement options mentioned above will be considered in light of:
1. The tools I have on hand
2. The mechanical fasteners I have on hand
3. My skill level in regard to employing said tools

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #16 – February 20, 2021, 11:29:30 am

Chuck, we have a lot in common. I speak AND can read english.
I would suggest that if the tools and/or expertise isn't within the capability of the individual that it would be advantageous to take said problem and solution to a machine shop.
Sometimes I can even converse coherently with others in the "written" form of communication.
Not bad for a high school gradjiet.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #17 – February 20, 2021, 11:44:19 am

Quote from: nitehawk – February 20, 2021, 09:59:16 am

The handle is most likely pewter, which means not possible to weld, solder, etc.

You can solder pewter, but that handle is most likely die-cast metal.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #18 – February 20, 2021, 02:05:27 pm

Thanks you so much for all the ideas!
Although some of them are just too complicated for me to understand now.

I will try the washer first.

I have solder iron for circuit board. I am wondering if adding solder will help?

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #19 – February 20, 2021, 03:35:34 pm

I had a similar problem, the handle came off in my hand. Thought about drilling and tapping the stem, then I thought about pressing it back together the way it was manufactured. Then a light went off and I bought a new one, I figured that the original handle had lasted almost 30 years so the replacement would out last me. $70 includes shipping from Foretravel, no fuss no muss.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #20 – February 20, 2021, 04:46:18 pm

Quote from: Olde English – February 20, 2021, 03:35:34 pm

I had a similar problem, the handle came off in my hand. Thought about drilling and tapping the stem, then I thought about pressing it back together the way it was manufactured. Then a light went off and I bought a new one, I figured that the original handle had lasted almost 30 years so the replacement would out last me. $70 includes shipping from Foretravel, no fuss no muss.

I asked the same question early last year when we broke the handle off just like the 91 in the original posting... we read all of the " fixes"... tools we do not have.. not sure really how to do the fix.... we just called FT factory and ordered a new inside plate with the handle and 3 screws later all done....

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #21 – February 20, 2021, 05:17:07 pm

You guys give up too easy. I took my latch plate off and carried it in to my work bench. Good thing I decided to check it today, cuz my handle was ALSO almost ready to break! I studied it for a while, made a few measurements, poked around in my tool box and parts drawers, and then decided I could fix it. I'll post my repair in a separate thread so it is easier to find in a Forum search. See link below:

1993 GV Entry Door Handle repair

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #22 – February 20, 2021, 05:38:41 pm

Chuck

Please post how you fix it!

Hope it doesn't involve torches and solder.

Really appreciate.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #23 – February 20, 2021, 08:57:50 pm

In Houston area, there are so many busted copper pipe around. Torch and solder material are in short supply.

Re: 1991 Grand Villa Door Lock broken

Reply #24 – February 21, 2021, 07:59:04 am

My solutions were pretty much predicated upon the fact that I did not know if there was any clearance between the square' end and the rest of the mechanism.
Chuck's solution is well within the reach of most of us.
One addition I might have made was to drill a small hole thru the actuator plate and into the handle, then put a small dowel or spring pin down flush with the actuator plate. Then the washer/screw would hold the pin in the hole AND there would be zero rotating force on the friction fit of washer and handle.

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