Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Topic: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading (Read 10493 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #125 – April 27, 2021, 09:14:26 am

I've got to agree with others on this. Pulled and replaced many full floating axles, have never had to replace a seal.

I guess a big question is if an insurance claim is involved. I expect, as others have said, that the problem can be detected by careful observation. If possible, would start by parking it on a flat, level surface, and leveling up. Stand back with a critical eye and note if and how the body appears to be twisted. Are seams between baggage doors and body even? Does the body appear to be parallel with the paving? Are you absolutely sure all airbags are intact and working? Do windows slide properly? Does entry door have an even margin and operate properly? Mount roof and look for wrinkles, cracks, sheared fasteners etc. Inspect body for areas where glass has cracked particularly at re entrant corners. Do interior doors work and latch properly? If body is visually lower in one corner than the others, try raising that corner with air a bit and see if things look better. This would help identify problem area if damage is localized.

Next, block up and crawl under. Look for obvious problems, bent torque arms, sheared bolts, damage to bulkheads. Is the fiberglass belly pan wrinkled?

Knowledge is power. If body is seriously torqued, this would be important to know for your dealings with insurance. If not totaled, then I would have it patched up, driven or hauled to Nac as a minimum and let them deal with it.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #126 – April 27, 2021, 09:20:09 am

If its the axle it's not a seal it's a gasket any truck repair shop or truck part store would have that. you can even use Silicone make the gasket with a sheet of gasket paper or use the old one just to drive it in the shop have an truck mechanic make a Service call and check out the front suspension. you have a mechanical problem not a cosmetic problem it's a heavy truck centre With a alignment Center, that do suspension work For trucks or a fabrication shop welding shop for this job. can't see it being a major Job unless you also have a bulkhead issue in there maybe it just the front axle bolts that came loose and the front axle shifted at that low speed maybe 2 miles an hour it's hard to believe you have big damage you hit bigger holes driving on the main road that hit harder I think it is the front axle that shift for some reason it is not a very complicated suspension and very little that really can go wrong a good Heavy duty truck mechanic should be able to tell you with a service call and an One hour labour

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #127 – April 27, 2021, 01:47:21 pm

Agree with Cape,simple system,don't need a specialization guru.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #128 – May 07, 2021, 08:46:45 am

Curious minds are still here.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #129 – May 07, 2021, 11:56:11 am

Quote from: John44 – May 07, 2021, 08:46:45 am

Curious minds are still here.

They are waiting for wheelbase measurements from FT right now. The general consensus is that the damage is not all that bad though.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #130 – May 07, 2021, 01:39:46 pm

Between waiting for axle seals for the axle gaskets and the wheel base thing, sounds like you may be in for a bumpy ride.
I hope not and maybe I'm reading too much into it.
Measure both sides and see what fits in the wheel wells.
Check for the rear axle square in a couple of places in the front half of the coach and see if the axle is out of line , or the trailing arms are not even from the rear end.
My 100$ is on a bent trailing arm mounting area. /tube . Or simply broken away from the frame .

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #131 – May 07, 2021, 02:00:53 pm

Quote from: Elliott – May 07, 2021, 11:56:11 am

They are waiting for wheelbase measurements from FT right now. The general consensus is that the damage is not all that bad though.

How many weeks does it take to send wheelbase measurements? Every morning must seem like Groundhog Day.

Pierce

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #132 – May 07, 2021, 02:15:10 pm

My money goes on misaligned front axle,no way did the torque rod bend from what he did.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #133 – May 07, 2021, 02:57:09 pm

Quote from: John44 – May 07, 2021, 02:15:10 pm

My money goes on misaligned front axle,no way did the torque rod bend from what he did.

Going back and reading the earlier posts the tire were rubbing on bags at opposing corners. Makes sense that the axle migrated on the perch or bent the entire front axle structure. If the links or mounts were affected it would not affect tire to airbag dimensions. The painful stall tactics is unacceptable to me but everyone is busy, but how long would it take to drop some plumb bob marks and take some measurements just to qualify or disqualify a repair. It's frustrating to say the least and I'm not vested at all with it. I genuinely hope Elliott gets a fair deal on getting it resolved promptly. Still chuckling about axle gaskets.
Scott

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #134 – May 07, 2021, 03:15:39 pm

I also have been waiting to see how you are going to make out Elliott. I don't know how handy you are but with a messaging tape,
a carpenters square and some string you could check out the alignment your self. I wish you all the luck

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #135 – May 07, 2021, 03:41:31 pm

I'm watching how many people are reading this almost 3000 reading and Fallowing this everyone waiting to see the outcome and looking out for Elliott Hope thing's work out

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #136 – May 07, 2021, 03:53:06 pm

Quote from: John44 – May 07, 2021, 02:15:10 pm

My money goes on misaligned front axle,no way did the torque rod bend from what he did.

WE should start a pool.. ?
The Non Foretravel stuff will be fine. Its the suspension mounting to the Foretravel frame bits that have failed . For the money

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #137 – May 07, 2021, 04:09:12 pm

We should have a 50/50 draw with what we think what went wrong to help out Elliott half to the winner and half to Elliott L.O.L

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #138 – May 07, 2021, 04:19:01 pm

After it's all said and done if it turns out the shop did'nt know what they were doing or looking at let's get the name so we can cross them off the list,and if they do a good job let's get their name to add to the list.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #139 – May 07, 2021, 04:45:51 pm

Now that the dust is settling I'm not as wound up over the delays and I'll explain why.

Whether or not they actually needed to order the axle seals from FT is moot at this point; they did and I'm not going to fault them for going through FT after I made a fairly big deal about wanting to make sure this was done "right" when I dropped it off. I'd rather them err on the side of caution in that regard. In 20/20 hindsight, the way I handled my concerns about whether or not they were qualified to work on a FT was pretty poor and definitely didn't score me any brownie points.

It turns out that FT initially sent them the wrong parts, and then sent them only ONE of the correct parts, and that's where much of the delay came from. I ended up calling Zach at FOT and he confirmed this story was true.

THEN right as the correct parts arrived, insurance started raising some concerns over the 10 hours of labor they wanted just to put the estimate together. I told the shop to pump the brakes until we could get some questions answered. It ended up taking multiple days to sort through it and it was a big non-issue. Basically, those 10 hours of labor are only billed if they go through all the effort of estimating it and then I decide to take it somewhere else. It's a reasonable stipulation IMO and once we got it properly documented insurance was good with it. By the way, I used that time to call around and see if there was a better place for this work and I feel good about where I have it. I even called a couple of the FT authorized service centers in SoCal, as well as my local Cummins location and asked them for a recommendation and still ultimately decided staying put was the best option.

On an unrelated note, insurance reimbursed me for the full $6k bill for the tow/recovery, without batting an eye

So, I finally just gave the shop the greenlight to proceed this past Monday. They've got it up on a lift and are mostly done with the estimate I guess, they're just waiting to hear back from FT on the wheelbase measurements before presenting me with the real deal. Given that FT has absolutely zero incentive to help me with this, I'm not surprised it's taking a while to hear back. There is loss of momentum every time a delay occurs... techs get repurposed, parts guys worry about other orders, etc... it's the nature of the beast and I'm getting the full effect of that.

We've rented an AirBnB for a month and it's taken some of the pressure off. I don't feel the need to be pushy and I'm slowly gaining trust in the shop that has my coach. Despite some chaos for a couple days, insurance is looking like they'll take good care of me too. I'll share the estimate here once it's all said and done... I'm sure there will be some negotiating over it

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #140 – May 07, 2021, 04:47:33 pm

Quote from: Cape Bretoner – May 07, 2021, 04:09:12 pm

We should have a 50/50 draw with what we think what went wrong to help out Elliott half to the winner and half to Elliott L.O.L

We used to race Hobie cats and often extreme sailed Lake Ontario. The crash boat drivers would come up to us and tell us that we were on our own. So we crash boated each other. One day it was blowing about 40 , so we built a beer drinking fire. 3 newbs set their boat up and went out . 2 came back on the boat eventually. , the 3rd, Girl swam back as she had fallen off pretty quick. . Meanwhile we had a pool going for how long until they pitch poled . I had 3 min. etc. When they actually sailed back onto the beach we gave them the money. They could not turn around , so they dumped and swam the boat around , flipped it back up etc.
Well worth the 5$ per to watch.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #141 – May 07, 2021, 09:21:13 pm

Quote from: Elliott – May 07, 2021, 04:45:51 pm

In 20/20 hindsight, the way I handled my concerns about whether or not they were qualified to work on a FT was pretty poor and definitely didn't score me any brownie points.

That's how I roll! Why wait to burn your bridges!

The good news is a little grovelling works wonders, and in the long run the shop will feel as though they hold the high ground.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #142 – May 08, 2021, 12:07:13 am

We are carefully watching this thread. We're ready to boondock and traveled several BLM roads in the Jeep this week that we wouldn't previously have been concerned with if we'd taken then slowly...rocky and Sandy but no serious elevation changes. We need to hear the final analysis of this thread so watching intently.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #143 – May 08, 2021, 04:36:55 am

Sounds like your insurance is good,what company?

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #144 – May 08, 2021, 09:16:26 am

Quote from: Protech Racing – May 07, 2021, 03:53:06 pm

WE should start a pool.. ?
The Non Foretravel stuff will be fine. Its the suspension mounting to the Foretravel frame bits that have failed . For the money

Not knowing exactly to what the radius arms are attached, I'll place my bet on a buckled frame tube.

Stretching my neck out I think Foretravel Offroader Elliott hit a rock with his front axle.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #145 – May 08, 2021, 09:30:09 am

Hopefully below the bag attachment structure/axle
Scott

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #146 – May 08, 2021, 09:38:39 am

Quote from: dsd – May 08, 2021, 09:30:09 am

Hopefully below the bag attachment structure/axle
Scott

One side went back into the bag support and the other went forward.

I wonder if Elliott got air?

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #147 – May 08, 2021, 10:38:16 am

Quote from: Old Toolmaker – May 08, 2021, 09:38:39 am

One side went back into the bag support and the other went forward.

I wonder if Elliott got air?

So bag support made contact with tire. It's mounted to the structure that holds the axle. That assembly moves with the axle if it's below the lower bag mount plate. The upper mount is attached to the frame. It never made contact at that position in photos posted at the start. More like a earth mover pushing
Scott

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #148 – May 08, 2021, 10:52:48 am

Toolmaker,what are you calling a "frame tube" you have the torque rods and the frame itself,don't think neither is bent from his
story,unless something bent before this incident.

Re: Coach/suspension Damage From Torquing While Off-Roading

Reply #149 – May 08, 2021, 11:28:59 am

Quote from: John44 – May 08, 2021, 10:52:48 am

Toolmaker,what are you calling a "frame tube" you have the torque rods and the frame itself,don't think neither is bent from his
story,unless something bent before this incident.

The frame of the unihomes and unicoaches is made of square steel tubing artfully arranged to have the same stiffness as a bridge. I have the rubber torsion bar suspension so my torsion bars are mounted to angle iron. I've only had a chance to look at one U320 in person and all I was able to see was that most of that front suspension is mounted to a giant steel mattress. I know that in the rear the track bars are mounted to the steel tubing, and I assumed the front axle was located in a similar fashion.

Either way, Foretravel did not use custom hydroformed parts, only using bandsaw cut catalog steel products held together with welds.

As others have pointed out, to repair you need the same skill set as a 15th century cathedral architect. Plumb bob and something with which to measure combined with basic compass and straightedge geometry.

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