Hydraulic pump Failed **ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ**

Topic: Hydraulic pump Failed **ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ** (Read 17028 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #200 – December 09, 2023, 11:53:23 am

Quote from: "Irish" – December 09, 2023, 10:17:55 am

This topic may have temporally saved us from disaster, because of Mikes findings, info and the video I realized that there should be no movement of the tensioner pulley.
Per the forum info ordered a new pulley and green HD belt and just installed them. Now it runs with no movement sparing the pump from the added pulsating lateral load on the pump shaft/ bearings.
Tried to add a video but I guess it's not possible.
Thanks again Mike !

David,
I had to use video compression program (HANDBRAKE, is free) to get it down to a size the forum would allow, then just added it to my media section.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #201 – December 09, 2023, 12:01:36 pm

Sounds like the legal profession in our country may have driven the engineers and component manufacturers into a corner.

Yes, my "replaces" pump from Foretravel Parts Dept was 20 years ago.

SAD!

But, wonder if the engineers at Foretravel would step up and spec and "bless" a replacement. That would clear the component manufacturers of any liability. It would also give Foretravel Corp another profit source in addition to keeping existing customer base happy/loyal. Probably a decision for upper management, not engineering.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #202 – December 09, 2023, 12:11:38 pm

Quote from: wolfe10 – December 09, 2023, 12:01:36 pm

Sounds like the legal profession in our country may have driven the engineers and component manufacturers into a corner.

Yes, my "replaces" pump from Foretravel Parts Dept was 20 years ago.

SAD!

But, wonder if the engineers at Foretravel would step up and spec and "bless" a replacement. That would clear the component manufacturers of any liability. It would also give Foretravel Corp another profit source in addition to keeping existing customer base happy/loyal. Probably a decision for upper management, not engineering.

I fully agree.....When I sent out that mass email to all I could find at FT,FOT,MOT.....MOT called me almost immediately, But their suggestion was to use a shop that got their pumps/parts from QCC. That shop was totally unaware that those items no longer exist. When I got back with MOT to tell them what I discovered, the basic answer was "maybe you need to find another way" , if you recall I Posted that update and suggested all remember that comment and MOT when next they need some parts. I surely will.
FOT, I Know has been in contact with QCC, to what level I dont know.
FT itself, I never got a response from, I only had an email that Michelle provided.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #203 – December 09, 2023, 12:14:01 pm

Thanks, Mike for carrying the baton on this one.

Brett

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #204 – December 11, 2023, 07:44:31 pm

why could you not use a standard B2 pattern pump of the proper displacement with a extremal proity valve. the straight shaft you would use a taperlock hub drilled to match the pully pattern

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #205 – December 11, 2023, 08:42:21 pm

I don't know anything about pumps but I did look up the pump and the valve too see what they look like so to understand what you are suggesting I sure hope someone comes up with a solution hope someone answers you I know it's a safety issue but when you look at all the modified truck on the road with over size tires, lights , jack up high, street rods you would think changing a pump or making a shaft no one would think twice about it . To see all these Coaches parked over a hydraulic pump. Is mind blowing .

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #206 – December 11, 2023, 09:40:06 pm

The safety issue seems a stretch because if you break a belt you are in the same situation while driving. The only difference is the down time.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #207 – December 12, 2023, 05:16:57 am

Quote from: craneman – December 11, 2023, 09:40:06 pm

The safety issue seems a stretch because if you break a belt you are in the same situation while driving. The only difference is the down time.

or.... a blown hydraulic hose while driving, you can still steer the coach although it will take some strong arm steering to do it.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #208 – December 12, 2023, 06:20:18 am

I have blown a hose and have driven a good five miles to a safe place to Replace the hose had to stop once to cool down the engine and add oil it was pissing out I fill the oil reservoir and start the engine and go
it is possible to steer it hard but you can steer at 40 mph get it up to speed and it gets easier. It's the dead stop turning that's the killer. I came to a stop sign stop turned and carried on if could get the fans going I would try to make it home with no steering.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #209 – December 12, 2023, 06:59:11 am

I talked with my nephew again about this and the possibility of having shafts made IF needed. He confirmed that it would not be a problem at all. The company doesn't ask what stuff is for aside from possibly someone asking out of curiosity.
Even without QCC, a broken shaft does not mean lawn ornament status.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #210 – December 12, 2023, 10:52:59 am

I agree on the ability to have a new shaft made. But unless someone wants to make up some shafts and seal kit's for purchase , ain't going to do you much good broken down in podunk junction beside the road 1000 miles from home.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #211 – December 12, 2023, 12:54:29 pm

Quote from: Dave Larsen – December 12, 2023, 06:59:11 am

I talked with my nephew again about this and the possibility of having shafts made IF needed. He confirmed that it would not be a problem at all. The company doesn't ask what stuff is for aside from possibly someone asking out of curiosity.
Even without QCC, a broken shaft does not mean lawn ornament status.

How many shaft do we need to purchase from your nephew's company to produce and what is the process do we need a shaft for a template or can they do it by a blueprint I think Mike has the blueprint I would suggest waiting to see what QQc is going to do if they don't come to the plate soon we will have to go down another path and this sounds like it. I think we all need a spare shaft some where lucky to find one but I sure need the piece of mind with a spare shaft.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #212 – December 12, 2023, 04:27:08 pm

Quote from: bbeane – December 12, 2023, 10:52:59 am

I agree on the ability to have a new shaft made. But unless someone wants to make up some shafts and seal kit's for purchase , ain't going to do you much good broken down in podunk junction beside the road 1000 miles from home.

It also won't do any good at many repair shops, either. Most chassis repair places aren't going to want to rebuild a hydraulic pump for you (some may not even touch that kind of work); they want to replace the pump as a unit. So either you need to have the skills and tools to do the rebuild yourself, or now you have to find a hydraulic shop that will rebuild it for you all while your coach is disabled.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #213 – December 12, 2023, 05:56:52 pm

Yep, first choice for many would be new pumps. Waiting to see if QCC comes through is the best option for now. If they don't, at least there is a viable Plan B. Neither option helps anyone who breaks down today.
It would also seem that any mechanic who was willing to replace a pump could also put a shaft in if that's what was needed. Only a few more bolts.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #214 – December 12, 2023, 07:17:07 pm

There are hydraulic shops all across the country. This is a matter of removing the pump and bringing it to a hydraulic shop that sells and repairs pumps, hydraulic cylinders, hydraulic hoses, fittings .They repair and bench tested they have the equipment they would have seals and bushings. The problem is getting the shaft that's the part needed . Having it repaired is not the problem and I'm sure most mechanics would tackle it .Hydraulic is a big business just say

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #215 – December 12, 2023, 10:03:24 pm

Parker sells complete packages for city buses with the same stuff we have, accessed steering, hyd driven fans for cooling even air conditioning drives. The parts are in the supply stream.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #216 – December 12, 2023, 10:07:08 pm

I do not understand a safety issue as a blown hose or lost belt is same result.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #217 – December 12, 2023, 10:13:50 pm

I saw all the specs for the valve and pump in a previous post. These as pretty small loads not much flow and low pressures. I'll see if I can put some part numbers together. the only thing is to think out hose routing and drilling of the hub for the staight shaft to reuse the exiting sheve.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #218 – December 12, 2023, 11:01:26 pm

Replacing the hydraulic pump with another off the shelf pump is not rocket science. Find a pump with the proper flow, pressure and rpm. Make a mount and mount it. The first picture is shop built race car. The engine turns 9,200 rpm and belts drive the oil and hydraulic pumps. Engine cost about $70,000 and failure of a pump is not an option. The second picture is the pump and mount in question. Tractor simple. Welded mount easily modified to accommodate a different pump. Simple belt drive with a steel pulley easy to modify for a different pump drive. Panic over a shaft problem is not rational. Find a racecar shop or agriculture equipment repair shop and solve the problem.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #219 – December 13, 2023, 12:09:09 am

All good ideas. But panic over a pump failure is not a big deal, IF you are doing a mod in your yard at home. Not so much in the middle of BFE, and you are fulltime. A complete new pump assy would be the best option but still a good bit of work to change it out. While a failure is relatively rare a shaft and seal kit is good, but a complete pump and pulley assembly is the best solution.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #220 – December 13, 2023, 12:36:23 am

The point is that options are available and if this pump is a problem change it to a more robust unit before you get to BFE.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #221 – December 14, 2023, 01:05:29 pm

Quote from: Racedad – December 12, 2023, 11:01:26 pm

Replacing the hydraulic pump with another off the shelf pump is not rocket science. Find a pump with the proper flow, pressure and rpm. Make a mount and mount it. The first picture is shop built race car. The engine turns 9,200 rpm and belts drive the oil and hydraulic pumps. Engine cost about $70,000 and failure of a pump is not an option. The second picture is the pump and mount in question. Tractor simple. Welded mount easily modified to accommodate a different pump. Simple belt drive with a steel pulley easy to modify for a different pump drive. Panic over a shaft problem is not rational. Find a racecar shop or agriculture equipment repair shop and solve the problem.

If that is your Rig in the picture? you appear to be in the very setup that commonly fails, we all are waiting on your NEW design.......you might actually can make some serious $ doing so, that is if you don't mind this little thing called legal liability.

So many engineering wizards all they want to do is suggest there is a better way.....Those that only talk, and dont also offer to take part in doing so..... is also not rational.
Ive put my skin in this game, mine is repaired and I personally have a spare way, the rest dont/wont have that option....I'm doing my part to see to it, the rest might have that way.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #222 – December 14, 2023, 07:42:03 pm

It looks like when they built my '81 they did it right. very easy to mount something else if it ever failed.

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #223 – December 14, 2023, 08:20:17 pm

Did the pump run the steering and the fan motors in 1981

Re: Hydraulic pump Failed ALL FORETRAVEL OWNERS SHOULD READ

Reply #224 – December 14, 2023, 10:14:48 pm

Quote from: Cape Bretoner – December 14, 2023, 08:20:17 pm

Did the pump run the steering and the fan motors in 1981

Yes but only one large fan motor.

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